Jack started movie 2 where movie 1 ended off

Ok I know a lot of people will say Jack left with nothing but the horizon and free life on his hands by the end of movie 2

Well IMO..No he didn't..and the reason why I say this is because of the way movie 1 ended with him and the way movie 2 actually started with him

I think from the offset of this series they always had the Jack/Liz partnership on their minds...the original draft script for movie 1 is a whole lot more Jack/Liz orientated than the movie we see..and even the deleted scenes in that movie all suggest how close these two might get if they were ever given the chance to. "peas in a pod darling"..Its like movie 1 was supposed to be the test to see how people would react to a Jack/Liz thing...because Jack was SUCH a risky character to add..they had to put in Will to balance it out and make it straight 😂

..people loved Jack and alot of people loved the Jack/Liz scenes in the movie the most..they are the most memorable to me as well...even before i was a shipper lol

and what strikes me is the ENDING to movie 1 and how Jack/Liz orientated it actually is...

Now me being my film studies self, I actually look at some parts symbolically like the bird for example.

When Norington asks
"Elizabeth is this where your heart truly lies then?"

and she says
"It is"..

we get Norrington giving a hurt look and background music that suggests sadness..but then it cuts to Jack's reaction too and the this music remains..and all of a sudden we get a pang in the music..and why? because HE is looking sad and hurt too..its like a little emotional realisation pang in the music to make the people realize this emotion he just showed...its a tad late though to make it slightly less obvious in my opinion. This moment is very, very short but that doesn't make it insignificant. Why would he be looking like that if he wasn't sad about something?..Its obviously to what she just said..and its kinda obvious because we just saw Norrington look exactly the same way...they actually repeat this in movie 2 when Liz kissed Will on the beach..although this time Jack shows jealousy..which is what I think Liz intended because she turns round and gives Jack a little smirk as soon as Will kisses her.

anyway movie 1:

When Elizabeth says "it is"(where her "heart lies" notice Jack in the background)

Norrington's reaction to what she says:

And of course Jack's reaction to what she says (pretty much frame by frame cuz hes so damn hot):

IMO when the bird appears its not Jack thinking..Ok I prefer being a free bird anyway..because what happens after this shows us whats really on his mind .IMO the bird tells him.."I know she's a free bird at heart" 😄 and then he gives her a look here after seeing the bird and thinking that. (all symbolic by the way..it has a double meaning IMO):

Just after he sees the bird/knows where her heart truly lies:

He's then like...right then I'm off lol..he ONLY looked at her there before he left after spotting the bird..I think its very significant.but very small and easy to miss..GOD I wish they left all those Jack/Liz deleted scenes in..it would have made it so much clearer whats going on with Jack..

When he's back on the pearl he's singing the song he sang with Elizabeth earlier and smiling he then looks to his compass..smirks and snaps it shut. Yet this huge moment seems to slip the audiences minds a little bit..which I think was the idea but when you watch movie 2 and look at the scenes that were deleted in movie 1 it makea ALL the more sense..had they left in that scene where Elizabeth TAUGHT him that song..and the "peas in a bod scene"..people would have left thinking "OMG he has Elizabeth on his mind and its making him smile!"

Then in movie 2 what do we have? Straight off the bat Jack is thinking of Elizabeth and he must have been thinking about her for a long time because he's now getting vexed at what his compass is showing him..Which according to Ted Elliot (screenwriter) is Port Royal and then the antipode of port royal because by this time I think he is worried about having her in his life or not..because it would "limit his freedom" which IMO is a load of bull. How can he be truly free if he doesn't allow himself what he wants? He then says "why is the rum always gone?" Which is a call back to movie 1 where he was singing that song with Elizabeth

So IMO they have tied in the beginning of movie 2 with how movie 1 ended..so thats with Elizabeth on his mind and his compass telling him he wants her but heading in the opposite direction..and the song she taught him in his mind when they were on te beach with the rum.. 🙂

yip, excellent!! I've never thought about that, but you're alsolutly right!!

And that he had Elisabeth on his mind is clear in both movies I find (just my impression), was my thought when his compass wasn't pointing in a clear direction at the beginning and his behaviour, too. He just tries to look like everything is fine, but he has changed.

Exactly.....he's sort of in denial.....

Originally posted by LovelyOne

And of course Jack's reaction to what she says (pretty much frame by frame cuz hes so damn hot):

I never realized how SAD he looks.

LOL I know!! its really short but its really significant IMO

oh and BTW at the start of that post I mean left movie 1 with the horizon on his mind,,not movie 2

as in he didnt REALLY have the free life and horiszon on his mind..

he is so freakin ssexxi!!

I love these pics of Jack - he is soo damn sexy....what a beautiful man...and I've kind of said this before too - where movie one ends with him singing the song and you know he's thinking of Liz and the song and the island...and then in movie 2 he is all confused and vexed because of his mixed emotions about Liz....but I never put is as eloquently as you do LovelyOne...you are so much better at playing it out...this all makes perfect sense to us...but are Ted and Terry this deep - and if they are and if everything is true that we picked up on...it's gotta be a Jack/Liz ending, it's just gotta be...if it's an adult movie...now, if they are going to make it a kiddie movie then it would be Liz/Will...but I've seen many times where Terry/Ted, Jerry and Gore all say this is an adult movie with adult themes..thus the PG 13 rating...

lol yet over 1 million kids under 13 see it!

Hey lovethemtigers..thanks 🙂

I think that they had this whole partnership on their minds from the very beginning..the draft scrip origionally had so much more Jack/Liz emotional moments..but they coudlnt mke it too in your face because jack was a risk and they needed to see how the audience would react to him..and even a possible relationship wth the leading lady..so they they origionally threw in lots of suggestive scenes..but IMO if jack had the potential to be the selling point of the movie..and if they gave it to the audience with all those other Jack/Liz scenes..then they would have probably made the audience like that that aspect of the movie..and it would make their intended ending seem pretty weak

which makes me think..why have they just gone an added this whole amazing relationship in movie 2 and end it Will/Liz in movie 3..its going to dissapoint a LOT of people..LOL i mean even wiothout all the added scenes..even the reaction to the one on the island was enough for them to feel pressured into writing movie 2 about Jack/Liz and their possible relationship.

And Yes Jack does say "bring me that horizon" at the end..but then think..He sings the song...and what did we see earlier? Jack/Liz singing that song..plonking down on the beach..talking about freedom looking out at the horizon..Jack puts his arm around her.

lol Jack has been completly infatuated with Elizabeth, both mentally and physially since movie 1.

And during the peas in the pod scene..Jack actually says he admires what she did to him as in the betrayal...so Liz has totally made this man infatuaded with her even back then IMO..

So Jack being angry with Liz after this betrayal?? I dont think so..he's totally going to be in love with her.

r...and IMO this is going to hit Liz too..in that peas in a pod scene..when he showed her how much he liked that about her(betrayal)...she was completly caught up in his eyes..Then norrington comes along and she suddenly gets woken up and composes herself lol..which is similar to what happens with her and him on the pearl..

So true...that is very true about the Peas in a Pod scene....here is such a cute video of JackandLiz on youtube it made me smile and laugh..everyone must watch it..it's great

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwmZhIs0hog

in the orginal script it says:

Jack stands at the wheel: he's got his ship back, and all
is right with the world. He begins to unconsciously hum:
"Yo, ho, yo, ho, a pirate's life for me ..."

He realizes what he's doing and smiles , the orchestra takes
over as the Black Pearl sails for uncharted waters

so he's def. thinking about elizabeth!

script:
http://www.imsdb.com/scripts/Pirates-of-the-Caribbean.html

YES EXCATLY OMG THANKS!!

Also all you have to look at after that little realization/knowing( he's just had about Liz fits in well with what he next says..he suddenly goes from looking really sad..realizes that she is in fact a free bird like him..he was thinking over everything on the beach IMO there..realizing that she's basically a pirate like him..and the other scenes that were deleted explain that too..

he then perks up

"Well I', actually feeling rather good about all this. I think we've all arrived in a very special place, spiritually, ecumenically(think thats what he says there lol) dramatically.....then he goes up to Liz "Elizabeth it would have never worked between us darling"..I'm sorry but how FAKE did that sound and look?? he darn KNOWS that it would have especially after what he just realized in that scene about how pirate like she really is..he's just trying to make himself feel a bit better because he's "lost" her at the moment IMO..he's trying to make it sound like he doesnt need her..and it also explains that little look..he looked at her realizing that she is not really happy in that life and then quickly looked down in case people spotted his little emotional weakness just then lol

Originally posted by LovelyOne
YES EXCATLY OMG THANKS!!

Also all you have to look at after that little realization/knowing( he's just had about Liz fits in well with what he next says..he suddenly goes from looking really sad..realizes that she is in fact a free bird like him..he was thinking over everything on the beach IMO there..realizing that she's basically a pirate like him..and the other scenes that were deleted explain that too..

he then perks up

"Well I', actually feeling rather good about all this. I think we've all arrived in a very special place, spiritually, ecumenically(think thats what he says there lol) dramatically.....then he goes up to Liz "Elizabeth it would have never worked between us darling"..I'm sorry but how FAKE did that sound and look?? he darn KNOWS that it would have especially after what he just realized in that scene about how pirate like she really is..he's just trying to make himself feel a bit better because he's "lost" her at the moment IMO..he's trying to make it sound like he doesnt need her..and it also explains that little look..he looked at her realizing that she is not really happy in that life and then quickly looked down in case people spotted his little emotional weakness just then lol

yes it was totally fake, and he's saying all that spritiually stuff to convince himself or something, and if i'm right ecumenically means dealing with the church and since christianity was big back then he's like telling himself this is how its suppose to be...something like that idk

LOL yeah..the "marriage is right"..he;s trying to say lol..which IMO is BS in his mind...he knows she's a free bird at heart..

He realizes what he's doing and smiles , the orchestra takes
over as the Black Pearl sails for uncharted waters

So he's thinking of Liz? realizes it and smiles...looks at his compass and it points back to her..and he heads away into no set direction because it is pointing back at her?

I have learned at college how to spot things in the mise en' scene etc in movies..what means stuff in movies and what doesn't..how to spot the real symbolisms and how to not look too deeply for them..If its meant to be symbolic its something quite obvious..and if its symbolic it usually means the writers etc. don't want you to pick up on it until much, much later..when the story has come to a close and you then watch over it again..and at the end of movie 1 we kinda do..its obvious he's thinking of Elizabeth there..and when you look at what Just happened there with his little "realization" that she is in fact a pirate at heart..

which is why DMC is so jam packed with little hints and clues that point to what is really going on but they cant make it too obvious because its not the end of the story yet and from what I see its mostly Jack/Liz hints...later when movie 3 comes out..and if its a Jack/Liz ending..people will look over the 3 films and spot all the hints etc..and notice how it was telling them all along...or if it ends Will/Liz then..we will look back at the hints and think..Ok it was really pointing to Will

which I cant see happening because how will they explain away the fact that the compass pointed at Jack..2 times..I cant see how they could explain that away in movie 3 because there was no obvious hints that it could have pointed to William in movie 2...I know you would say the beach scene was one..but he appears about 1 hr after it pointed to Jack there after they had dug up the chest etc...and by that point what the compass just did is already LONG out of the audiences minds......and IMO thats pretty far fetched if they want us to believe that it was in fact pointing to Will there..I wouldn't buy that for a second..you don't ever see that happen in movies..well all the movies/symbolisms I've learned about..they dont trick you with symbolisms..what a symbollic messahge appears to show you on the surface ..shows you and there's no two ways about it from what I've learned

and even when people say it was pointing to the letters of marque the first time..why did she not take them from his coat where he put them whist she had him chained there if thats what she wanted most in this world?..secondly he wasnt wearing his coat the second time so it couldnt have pointed to him for that reson there either

and they say it first pointed there because it was telling her that he had betrayed Will..no way..how does it answer a question like that?

It just shows you what you want most in this world as in physical object..so she wanted jack to be a dishonest man most in this world as a physicall object??

sorry not buying that either..

anyhoo I'm off to bed..night x

sleep tight!
love all your ideas
your ideas have really made me want to study film!

ditto!!

ow LovelyOne you are so right about jack I always thought he looked sad at that scne but never noticed the bird thing you said...so great and I love the hole beach thing with liz/will kissing and jack getting all jealouse and uncomfortable but that's another reason I LOVE jack/liz relationship see how norrington feels all uncomfortable and looks down at the sand? whilst jack (who is also feeling almighty jealous) looks around and his gaze falls at the ground for a second but than faces their kiss by looking STRAIGHT at them and then he registers her little smirk and takes all the awkwardness out off the moment by asking :"how did YOU get here?"

wow this is so true I always knew jack looks sad in that scene but never noticed that bird thing you said... that was so brilliant! and I love the whole thing you said about the beach scene when liz/will kiss and i love how the camera actually gives us a moment to COMPARE norri and Jack's reaction and it's so amazing how norr being the noble and shy one looks down at his feet but jack's gaze goes all around and falls to the ground but it's like in a second he thinks to himself "I'm captain jack sparrow I don't handle a situation like THIS, savvy?" he looks straight at the just enough time to register liz's smirk which then he realizes what the kiss was FOR and takes the awkwardness out of the moment by askin" what are YOU doing here?" I just love that part

"and even when people say it was pointing to the letters of marque the first time..why did she not take them from his coat where he put them whist she had him chained there if thats what she wanted most in this world?..secondly he wasnt wearing his coat the second time so it couldnt have pointed to him for that reson there either"----LovelyOne

I think I brought up the significance of the compass in that scene (or lack thereof) in that scene. See, Liz already knows she's infatuated with Jack. If she wasn't, and she took out the compass and saw it pointing to him, she wouldn't have been worried. "They're pointing to the letters," or "He knows how to get me to Will" or "Well, he has the kind of life that I want." All those things are nothing to get worried over. But what does Liz assume? "Oh no! It shows I have feelings for him, which is true!" The compass's power in this scene doesn't really matter. She believed it to show Jack, indicating she is thinking of him.
I love what you showed us at the end of the first movie. I did notice Jack kind of poking his head up between Liz and Will and it made me wonder if he symbolically "came between" them somehow, but I never thought of his face showing sadness and then the business with the bird. I thought he was happy to see it because he knew it was Mr. Cotton's and he would live to fight another day, but it could easily have been a reminder that Liz is a freedom-loving gal just like he's a freedom-loving guy.
And yes, we all know what the very end means as he's singing that song..... 😍 He can't get her off his mind.