Spy report links Iraq invasion to more terrorism

That scenario is probably created by the situation the US has given us. What I mean is, if the US hadn't taken this erroneous course of action, it is unlikely that nations that favour a different course would have been so affected by the fall-out from whatever the alternative action was. Basically, what the US has done has tainted all of Western democratic countries, regardless of their support or otherwise. That seems like a grand-standing statement, but in light of these recent reports, it certainly rings true.

i believe its because of algeria that al-qaeda is "declaring war" on France...although i didnt really bother to find out much more cause...really...who gives a shit about Algeria...

Originally posted by Darth Kreiger
Yes, because a few of our soldiers are screwed up, that means we're terrible people, how could we do this?!?!

No, endorsing, condoning, justifying, accepting or ignoring it makes you a terrible person.

Originally posted by Darth Kreiger
I didn't Generalize the Population, the people in that Prison were Insurgents/Terrorists, that is why it was guarded by the Military.

Wrong again. Most people were let go because they were innocent. I won't bother covering ground that Imperial covered so well before me.

Originally posted by Darth Kreiger
Look outside the box? Are you that dull? Win the hearts of the Terrorists?

Yes, that's exactly what I said...uhhmm...no it isn't. And not all Iraqis are terrorists or insurgents.

Originally posted by Darth Kreiger
You have lost reason, that is who we torture, not the average farmer.

Wrong again. Also endorsing torture again. Bravo!

Originally posted by Darth Kreiger
But because my posts are Conservative Garbage, you shouldn't listen to me hang

That is the smartest thing you have said yet, unfortunately it was only an attempt at humor, so you lose a few points there again.

Originally posted by KharmaDog
No, endorsing, condoning, justifying, accepting or ignoring it makes you a terrible person.

Wrong again. Most people were let go because they were innocent. I won't bother covering ground that Imperial covered so well before me.

Yes, that's exactly what I said...uhhmm...no it isn't. And not all Iraqis are terrorists or insurgents.

Wrong again. Also endorsing torture again. Bravo!

That is the smartest thing you have said yet, unfortunately it was only an attempt at humor, so you lose a few points there again.

I never Justified it(though I'm sure a few of them deserved it), but you are blaming the whole Military for it, which is your problem, Liberals don't like Individuals, they like groups.

Skipping this post, since again, several of the people there were Insurgents

What I said, was torturing Terrorists, and you told me to think outside the box, and be humain to them, so technically, that IS what you said. I never said all Iraqi's were Terrorists/Insurgents, yet you seem to get that with the Ancient Liberal Secret of Word Twisting.

Yes, I'm wrong because you say I'm wrong, we torture Terrorists, OK? The people in Gitmo are tortured, those people in Prison that arn't Terrorists, just get Prisoner Treatment. And yes, I support Torture, I can't possibly fathom how being nice to a person that wants to kill us will work, but ok, you go with that, and watch them tell nothing. I do support Torture, what is wrong with Torturing Terrorists? What you do is say, I am the Big Bad Conservative that wants to Torture Iraqi's for the Hell of it.

For this last post, you have supported a Lack of Credibility, you think all Conservatives are Moronic Douchebags that want War, and killing of poor innocents.

Get out of your shell, stop trying to make the World Perfect, we need to do some Dark things in order to fight these people who will stop at nothing to chop off your head

Has anyone else realized that when liberal and conservatives argue, it's just days upon days of the pot calling the kettle black?

Both are well intentioned. But how about instead of insulting your opponent, you have a civil debate? Both of you think you're right obviously, and insulting or getting insulted isn't going to change what either of you think.

Originally posted by Darth Kreiger
Skipping this post, since again, several of the people there were Insurgents

Are we still talking about AB here? Because there wasn't differentiation - there wasn't a terrorist wing and a "Innocent person wrongly arrested wing" - might some have been terrorists? Possibly. The fact was the vast majority weren't and the majority of those treated to a bit of the prison guard hospitality weren't either.

What I said, was torturing Terrorists, and you told me to think outside the box, and be humane to them, so technically, that IS what you said. I never said all Iraqi's were Terrorists/Insurgents, yet you seem to get that with the Ancient Liberal Secret of Word Twisting.

I don't think he was suggesting being humane to the terrorists (though it is good to see how quickly a person can decide a whole group deserves no humane treatment) - rather it is winning the hearts and minds of Iraqis. It might seem a surprise, but doing that is far better then torturing terrorists and letting the world see. Because what that does is makes people angry, and more likely to be terrorists. It is self defeating to capture and torture a terrorist if the by product is a dozen Iraqi citizens becoming replacements as a result.

Which is what Iraqi is all about. The reason why experts are saying "Iraqi has created the next generation of terrorist" - because the hearts and minds haven't been won. They have been royally angered, and people turn to terrorism.

Yes, I'm wrong because you say I'm wrong, we torture Terrorists, OK? The people in Gitmo are tortured, those people in Prison that arn't Terrorists, just get Prisoner Treatment. And yes, I support Torture, I can't possibly fathom how being nice to a person that wants to kill us will work, but ok, you go with that, and watch them tell nothing. I do support Torture, what is wrong with Torturing Terrorists? What you do is say, I am the Big Bad Conservative that wants to Torture Iraqi's for the Hell of it.

Hmmm. What is wrong with torturing terrorists, apart from the bad media. Might it be because no one seems certain who is a terrorist? Tell me, with the Guantanamo - all those hardened terrorists shipped there to begin with? Look up the figures of how many have been released. And the fact that the remaining ones, well, no one has been able to put together a convincing case against them that would work in a court of law - so we can't charge them in court, but we have enough to torture them? Smooth.

Oh, and the fact - "Does the US have the authority to torture citizens of another nation on the suspicion of terrorism" - because potential Iraqi terrorists captured in Iraq are still Iraqi - and by legal processes I don't believe the US has the authority to do such things to them.

Originally posted by Kinneary
Has anyone else realized that when liberal and conservatives argue, it's just days upon days of the pot calling the kettle black?

Both are well intentioned. But how about instead of insulting your opponent, you have a civil debate? Both of you think you're right obviously, and insulting or getting insulted isn't going to change what either of you think.

when someone willingly denies solid evidence that they are wrong, i cannot respect their opinion, because they are logically and possibly mentally deficient.

i know its tough to watch....so.......maybe you shouldnt

Originally posted by Kinneary
Has anyone else realized that when liberal and conservatives argue, it's just days upon days of the pot calling the kettle black?

Both are well intentioned. But how about instead of insulting your opponent, you have a civil debate? Both of you think you're right obviously, and insulting or getting insulted isn't going to change what either of you think.

Like PVS said, when someone(Darth Kreiger) is wrong, they are wrong. When someone(KharmaDog) is right, they are right.

There really isn't anything to get confused about.

I am constantly surprised by how easily people forget their own history. Some of you sound EXACTLY like those americans who argued against our entering wwII. If you cant see that we are in reality in a war with militant islam and that police actions were no longer effective then nothimg I could say will change your mind. But if you like your freedom to speak your mind and do what you please and THINK what you please
then you should thank your god, whichever that may be, that we went ahead and started this war. Does it militantize some of the muslim population? Of course, any resonable person would deduce that. Just like 9/11 made us want to go to war. But we can not stop this war untill it is done! If we do we will have wasted all those good men for nothing.

again, why did we invade iraq. i wonder why over 40% of americans surveyed are stupid enough to be convinced that iraq and 9/11 were connected in any way when the president had admitted that there was none after all.

maybe you could enlighten me. or you can just vomit out some more nonsensicle talking points from 3 years ago which were factually proven wrong. after all, if you chant it enough, it becomes true.

and oh i forgot, im supposed to respect the opinions of others which are based entirely on lies.

Originally posted by hardwoodman
I am constantly surprised by how easily people forget their own history. Some of you sound EXACTLY like those americans who argued against our entering wwII. If you cant see that we are in reality in a war with militant islam and that police actions were no longer effective then nothimg I could say will change your mind. But if you like your freedom to speak your mind and do what you please and THINK what you please
then you should thank your god, whichever that may be, that we went ahead and started this war. Does it militantize some of the muslim population? Of course, any resonable person would deduce that. Just like 9/11 made us want to go to war. But we can not stop this war untill it is done! If we do we will have wasted all those good men for nothing.

Pretty much.

We have to be in it to win it.

They are, and will not stop unless our entire country converts to Islam.

If we don't, we are "infidels" fit for killing.

Those are not my words, but the words of those who plan and execute the murder of thousands of Americans at a time.

So, either we convert to Islam, or we destroy these F*ckers here and now, preferably in their own region of the world.

Which brings us to the true reason for the War in Iraq (not Saddam, not WMD, not oil, not Haliburton, which are all side effects):

For strategic position in the broader scale of this "holy war". (again, not my words but the terrorists)

If Israel supports us, and we have Iraq as a base of operations, then war with Syria, Iran, Pakistan, and any other Muslim country's whose populations hate our support of Jewish/Christian nations will be much easier.

And it will come to that, believe me.

If it takes 10 years and 10,000 American lives (which would be what, less than 10% of how many we lost in WWII?) to secure Iraq, it will be needed against the threat that we face in these times.

Bush knows this, and just like his Supreme Court nominations, he's playing this game so that we win it in the next 25 years, not for what's happening in the world right now.

After the next terrorist attack on U.S. soil, people won't care anymore and will just want this shit handled.

All these debates that we have now will be pointless.

As for the report, yeah Iraq has created more pissed off Islamic radicals than there were, but something else would have gotten them mad anyway.

I highly doubt that they were just gonna leave us alone, as WTC I and its far scarier sequel WTC II, the U.S. embassy bombings, the U.S.S. Cole, and the foiled airplane plot in England have proved.

All the war did was intensify and speed up the inevitable.

If it gives us a second democratic, non-muslim country in the region that we can use for military operations and count on for support.....

Then THAT would truly be "Mission Accomplished."

Originally posted by sithsaber408
either we convert to Islam, or we destroy these F*ckers here and now, preferably in their own region of the world.

Originally posted by sithsaber408
If it gives us a second democratic, non-muslim country in the region that we can use for military operations and count on for support.....

Then THAT would truly be "Mission Accomplished."

and you are a genocide supporting piece of lowlife scum.

:edit: but at least you had the balls to say it, which is more than i can say for your PC code speaking pussy peers.

So, pvs, only lowlife scum think that these guys are comming for us? And I agree with the other lowlife genocidal scumbag, it was wmd or any of that stuff; they were just the easiest. And in the right locale. And had a majority sheia population that had been oppresed and murdered for decades. So they were easy! and of course they were shooting at our pilots every day, WHICH MADE IT EASY! So sit whever you are in your smugness but even worms appreciate their liberty. And good men, better than YOU, go to their deaths every day protecting people just like you.

nice try at blurring a war on militant fundamentalist terrorists...etc... with his point of eliminating an entire religion through genocide. great stuff.

yes, only lowlife scum feel that an entire people of a religion should be exterminated. yes. fact. scum. lowlife scum.

so take your browbeating pseudo-patriotic spin about dishonoring troops and cram them up your ass. are we clear? do you need me to elaborate further? or are we good?

Tou sound like a real tuff guy......he says while shakin in his boots

Originally posted by PVS
and you are a genocide supporting piece of lowlife scum.

:edit: but at least you had the balls to say it, which is more than i can say for your PC code speaking pussy peers.

Thanks, but you are wrong.

Originally posted by PVS
nice try at blurring a war on militant fundamentalist terrorists...etc... with his point of eliminating an entire religion through genocide. great stuff.

yes, only lowlife scum feel that an entire people of a religion should be exterminated.

I am talking about the former, not the latter.

I never said a word about all people in that religion, I said I was talking about the ones who have declared to us: "Turn your country to Islam or die.".....

Translate: Islamic militant fundamentalist terrorist.

And what I said about making Iraq a base of operations was for waging a war against them.

Where you got that I want to kill every muslim I don't know.

Originally posted by sithsaber408
If it gives us a second democratic, non-muslim country in the region that we can use for military operations and count on for support.....

Then THAT would truly be "Mission Accomplished."

so you didnt mean that? then be noble and stand corrected

Methinks he's havin a kniption!!!!!

Originally posted by hardwoodman
Tou sound like a real tuff guy......he says while shakin in his boots

oh lets not flex nuts. im not the one accusing others of betraying our troops. ok toughy?

Originally posted by hardwoodman
Methinks he's havin a kniption!!!!!

wtf is a kniption? is that some sort of skin fungus?

I am not worthy of such an erudite parlay. And I dont want to raise your blood pressure any more than it is, so I'll just leave u 2 stew n ur own juice bye now!!

kthxbye