What Do You Believe? Here Is What We Believe:

Originally posted by SupezM'
Um, God says everyone IS going to hell, UNLESS they accept Jesus Christ as their lord and saviour. How is that a contradiction?

Well - by all accounts following the Biblical fall mankind was apparently doomed 100% - no Jesus for thousands of years.

Then suddenly out of the blue God sends Jesus and we are told we can be saved. Which is kind of contradictory. Why not send Jesus as soon as Adam and Eve were voted out of the Garden? Why let so many die with no way to achieve salvation, if Jesus was vital for that?

And how did the Jews get to heaven? Originally God's "chosen" people, around before Jesus, the path to salvation. When God was leading them around deserts and all that and they died - did they go straight to heaven?

Exactly. The Jews were God's chosen people....why did all of them go to hell, jsut because god was too lazy to get off his ass and send down a son?

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Well - by all accounts following the Biblical fall mankind was apparently doomed 100% - no Jesus for thousands of years.

Then suddenly out of the blue God sends Jesus and we are told we can be saved. Which is kind of contradictory. Why not send Jesus as soon as Adam and Eve were voted out of the Garden? Why let so many die with no way to achieve salvation, if Jesus was vital for that?

And how did the Jews get to heaven? Originally God's "chosen" people, around before Jesus, the path to salvation. When God was leading them around deserts and all that and they died - did they go straight to heaven?

Care to respond to my post in The U.S. Constitution Mentions Jesus Christ, Started by: JesusIsAlive. I quoted several statements and prefaced them with the word fact. I think you are qualified to respond because you give well-thought out reasons for what you think. You don't just say, "This is so because it is."

Now in response to this post I will say that God is wiser and smarter than you are Imperial. So He has it all figured out concerning how folks can be saved. I honestly don't understand why you raise such issues. The crucifixion of Jesus Christ was foreordained before the foundation of the world. In God's great foreknowledge and wisdom He already planned a way whereby the world could redeemed by the Blood of His Son Jesus before the world existed. Jesus even told Pilate that he (Pilate) could have no power at all against Him except it had been given to him from above (i.e. from God). It was God's plan to give His only, Begotten Son as a ransom for the sins of the world.

But to get to the heart of what you said, God gave Abraham credit for righteousness through Abraham's faith (Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness). Perhaps God gave everyone credit for being righteousness prior to the advent of Jesus. Who knows, who cares. God has it all worked out.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Care to respond to my post in [b]The U.S. Constitution Mentions Jesus Christ, Started by: JesusIsAlive. I quoted several statements and prefaced them with the word fact. I think you are qualified to respond because you give well-thought out reasons for what you think. You don't just say, "This is so because it is."

Now in response to this post I will say that God is wiser and smarter than you are Imperial. So He has it all figured out concerning how folks can be saved. I honestly don't understand why you raise such issues. The crucifixion of Jesus Christ was foreordained before the foundation of the world. In God's great foreknowledge and wisdom He already planned a way whereby the world could redeemed by the Blood of His Son Jesus before the world existed. Jesus even told Pilate that he (Pilate) could have no power at all against Him except it had been given to him from above (i.e. from God). It was God's plan to give His only, Begotten Son as a ransom for the sins of the world.

But to get to the heart of what you said, God gave Abraham credit for righteousness through Abraham's faith (Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness). Perhaps God gave everyone credit for being righteousness prior to the advent of Jesus. Who knows, who cares. God has it all worked out.
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People who are sent hell because god pocrastinates care.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Now in response to this post I will say that God is wiser and smarter than you are Imperial. So He has it all figured out concerning how folks can be saved. I honestly don't understand why you raise such issues. The crucifixion of Jesus Christ was foreordained before the foundation of the world. In God's great foreknowledge and wisdom He already planned a way whereby the world could redeemed by the Blood of His Son Jesus before the world existed. Jesus even told Pilate that he (Pilate) could have no power at all against Him except it had been given to him from above (i.e. from God). It was God's plan to give His only, Begotten Son as a ransom for the sins of the world.

Why do I ask such questions? Because I like to know? Because knowledge is important? It is a way of growing, of learning?

And because if I were to believe in a God I would want to know it was for a just reason. This is a hole in the story for me -

1st - Adam and Eve fall. They are now separate from God, and there descendants in sin, and thus doomed.

2nd - The Bible claims that only through Jesus can one be saved from that Original sin.

3rd - But Jesus was born thousands of years after that event - thousands of people came and went without salvation

4th - By rights they couldn't have known of Jesus, so couldn't be saved.

5th - The Jews were God's chosen people, and when doing as there told one Good terms with God - but they didn't believe in Jesus, and the messiah hadn't come to offer salvation... so how did that work?

But to get to the heart of what you said, God gave Abraham credit for righteousness through Abraham's faith (Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness). Perhaps God gave everyone credit for being righteousness prior to the advent of Jesus. Who knows, who cares. God has it all worked out.
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And in that sense it would be better if Jesus hadn't come. People deserve credit for their "righteousness" - not simply for believing in a figure without evidence. Faith should be less important then action and intent.

But as to it - why didn't God feel bothered to have it recorded? I mean, when one considers the stuff that got into the Bible it seem remarkable that God wouldn't have felt the need to comment on the souls of the thousands of people unfortunate enough to be born after the fall but before the avenue to salvation was offered.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Why do I ask such questions? Because I like to know? Because knowledge is important? It is a way of growing, of learning?

✅

Not to mention, god is not very good/powerful/caring if he hasn't figuresd this out this.

Hell, god might be as dumb as JIA seems.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Who knows, who cares. God has it all worked out.

FINALLY! 😆

Originally posted by JesusisAlive
What do you beleive?

Like you CARE what we beleive.... 🙄

Originally posted by JesusisAlive
Here's what we beleive

Like we CARE what you beleive... 🙄

Originally posted by Lord Urizen
Like you CARE what we beleive.... 🙄

Like we CARE what you beleive... 🙄

Originally posted by Alliance
✅

Not to mention, god is not very good/powerful/caring if he hasn't figuresd this out this.

Hell, god might be as dumb as JIA seems.

True, true. I question the claim of God's greatness if he is so unaware of the way his creation thinks. A politicean in the modern world has to know how to get to the voters, to reach them and understand the way they think.

God on the other hand doesn't care that the majority of people don't think the way the Bible says they should.

FINALLY! 😆

I must have blacked out and by odd probability typed that as a thrashed about, I'd never say it while conscious.

Originally posted by Alliance
Which exposes the whole irony of this thread.

AHAHAHAHAAAA 😆

I know droolio

Originally posted by lord xyz
There is one good thing about JIA's posts, the more he posts, the people turn atheist.

Well that is sort of true, I had a great deal of respect for Christianity until JIA showed me his version of Christianity, it scares the crap out of me and I want to stay away from it. Thanks JIA, you have shown me the error of my ways.

Originally posted by crazy
Well that is sort of true, I had a great deal of respect for Christianity until JIA showed me his version of Christianity, it scares the crap out of me and I want to stay away from it. Thanks JIA, you have shown me the error of my ways.

droolio

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Why do I ask such questions? Because I like to know? Because knowledge is important? It is a way of growing, of learning?

And because if I were to believe in a God I would want to know it was for a just reason. This is a hole in the story for me -

1st - Adam and Eve fall. They are now separate from God, and there descendants in sin, and thus doomed.

2nd - The Bible claims that only through Jesus can one be saved from that Original sin.

3rd - But Jesus was born thousands of years after that event - thousands of people came and went without salvation

4th - By rights they couldn't have known of Jesus, so couldn't be saved.

5th - The Jews were God's chosen people, and when doing as there told one Good terms with God - but they didn't believe in Jesus, and the messiah hadn't come to offer salvation... so how did that work?

And in that sense it would be better if Jesus hadn't come. People deserve credit for their "righteousness" - not simply for believing in a figure without evidence. Faith should be less important then action and intent.

But as to it - why didn't God feel bothered to have it recorded? I mean, when one considers the stuff that got into the Bible it seem remarkable that God wouldn't have felt the need to comment on the souls of the thousands of people unfortunate enough to be born after the fall but before the avenue to salvation was offered.

What?!?

You have grossly misunderstood what I posted. I said that God gave Abraham's faith (he believed God) credit for righteousness. I did not say (now listen very closely) that God gave Abraham's righteousness credit.

Can you see the difference?

If I had said that God gave Abraham's righteousness credit then that would mean that Abraham would have something to boas about before God. Furthermore, that would imply that Abraham was saved by his works (good moral deeds) instead of by his faith in God.

But I did not say that. Here is what I said:

But to get to the heart of what you said, God gave Abraham credit for righteousness through Abraham's faith (Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness).

[COLOR=darkblue]Did you catch that, did you see the huge difference? God imputed, accounted, or gave Abraham credit for being righteous through Abraham's faith--not on the basis of his works. This is an invariable Truth found throughout Scripture. We are saved by faith alone apart from our works. Our works should be the evidence, proof, or fruit of our salvation not the source of it. God is the source of it in Abraham's case because Jesus had not yet arrived. But now God commands people everywhere to repent of their sins and to exercise faith in the finished work of Jesus the Christ for salvation--from sin Debbiejoe.
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Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
Care to respond to my post in [b]The U.S. Constitution Mentions Jesus Christ, Started by: JesusIsAlive. I quoted several statements and prefaced them with the word fact. I think you are qualified to respond because you give well-thought out reasons for what you think. You don't just say, "This is so because it is."

Now in response to this post I will say that God is wiser and smarter than you are Imperial. So He has it all figured out concerning how folks can be saved. I honestly don't understand why you raise such issues. The crucifixion of Jesus Christ was foreordained before the foundation of the world. In God's great foreknowledge and wisdom He already planned a way whereby the world could redeemed by the Blood of His Son Jesus before the world existed. Jesus even told Pilate that he (Pilate) could have no power at all against Him except it had been given to him from above (i.e. from God). It was God's plan to give His only, Begotten Son as a ransom for the sins of the world.

But to get to the heart of what you said, God gave Abraham credit for righteousness through Abraham's faith (Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness). Perhaps God gave everyone credit for being righteousness prior to the advent of Jesus. Who knows, who cares. God has it all worked out.
[/B]

I have got to love how the biggest question dodger on this forum is asking someone else in a different thread to answer his. You did not answer debbiejo's posts on the days, you seemed to have been backed into a corner and started copying and pasting about being saved which had nothing to do with the topic at hand.

He does it for everyone. He just ignores all my questions.

Originally posted by Imperial_Samura
Why do I ask such questions? Because I like to know? Because knowledge is important? It is a way of growing, of learning?

And because if I were to believe in a God I would want to know it was for a just reason. This is a hole in the story for me -

1st - Adam and Eve fall. They are now separate from God, and there descendants in sin, and thus doomed.

2nd - The Bible claims that only through Jesus can one be saved from that Original sin.

3rd - But Jesus was born thousands of years after that event - thousands of people came and went without salvation

4th - By rights they couldn't have known of Jesus, so couldn't be saved.

5th - The Jews were God's chosen people, and when doing as there told one Good terms with God - but they didn't believe in Jesus, and the messiah hadn't come to offer salvation... so how did that work?

And in that sense it would be better if Jesus hadn't come. People deserve credit for their "righteousness" - not simply for believing in a figure without evidence. Faith should be less important then action and intent.

But as to it - why didn't God feel bothered to have it recorded? I mean, when one considers the stuff that got into the Bible it seem remarkable that God wouldn't have felt the need to comment on the souls of the thousands of people unfortunate enough to be born after the fall but before the avenue to salvation was offered.

What?!?

You have grossly misunderstood what I posted. I said that God gave Abraham's faith (he believed God) credit for righteousness. I did not say (now listen very closely) that God gave Abraham's righteousness credit.

Can you see the difference?

If I had said that God gave Abraham's righteousness credit then that would mean that Abraham would have something to boast about before God. Furthermore, that would imply that Abraham was saved by his works (good moral deeds) instead of by his faith in God.

But I did not say that. Here is what I said:

But to get to the heart of what you said, God gave Abraham credit for righteousness through Abraham's faith (Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness).

Did you catch that, did you see the huge difference?

God imputed, accounted, or gave Abraham credit for being righteous through Abraham's faith--not on the basis of his works. This is an invariable Truth found throughout Scripture. We are saved by faith alone apart from our works. Our works should be the evidence, proof, or fruit of our salvation not the source of it. God is the source of it in Abraham's case because Jesus had not yet arrived. But now God commands people everywhere to repent of their sins and to exercise faith in the finished work of Jesus the Christ for salvation--from sin Debbiejoe just in case you are reading this.

DID YOU CATCH THAT? HUH IMP? HUH? DID YOU CATCH THAT?

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive
[COLOR=darkblue]What?!?

You have grossly misunderstood what I posted. I said that God gave Abraham's faith (he believed God) credit for righteousness. I did not say (now listen very closely) that God gave Abraham's righteousness credit.

Can you see the difference?

I was saying that it is better to reward someone for something other then believing in Jesus - their actions and intents. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

If I had said that God gave Abraham's righteousness credit then that would mean that Abraham would have something to boas about before God. Furthermore, that would imply that Abraham was saved by his works (good moral deeds) instead of by his faith in God.

And as I was saying it would be more just to be saved not by faith but by actions and intents. I won't be given a Nobel Peace Prize for belief in God, I will be given it for what I contribute. God gave people free will to live their lives - it would make sense to measure them by what they did with their lives, not because they spent their years thinking Jesus had set up shop in their hearts.

DID YOU CATCH THAT? HUH IMP? HUH? DID YOU CATCH THAT?

Yes, I thought I better respond before he posted it again.

We'll probably see 5 more posts anyway.

Originally posted by JesusIsAlive

DIVINE HEALING - Healing is for the physical ills of the human body and is wrought by the power of God through the prayer of faith, and by the laying on of hands. It is provided for in the atonement of Christ, and is the privilege of every member of the Church today (James 5:14,15; Mark 16:18; Isa. 53:4,5; Matt. 8:17; 1 Peter 2:24).

Does this con still work? Pretty sad...