Originally posted by HandOfFate
LOL, I don't remember Rachel holding a universe in her hands. 😉
Beyonder gave Rachel the Full Power of the Phoenix Force, and beyond.
Beyonder gives Rachel enough power to kill him
"I offer you a choice, Phoenix...you may SLAY me"
"I herewith grant YOU SUFFICIENT Power to do so"
Rachel knows this...and plans on using it against Beyonder.
The Watcher speaking:
"She WILLS a THING"......"Says to herself, So Be it, and it is Done"
"The Primal Absolutes....CREATION and DESTRUCTION, are Hers to Command"
Check Rachel out, the Phoenix Force is Her B*TCH
"She has become ALL she EVER dreamed of...and FAR, FAR MORE.
"the Phoenix RISES ANEW"
You know what ANEW means?
From Websters: In a New Way
Beyonder made her Beyond the Phoenix Force, just Like the Watcher SAID:
"ALL she EVER dreamed of...and FAR, FAR MORE"
The only thing Rachel ever wanted was to be like her mother.
Originally posted by Mr Master
Beyonder gave Rachel the Full Power of the Phoenix Force, and beyond.
I have the book and it doesn't say Rachel was more powerful then the Phoenix Force.
IIRC, the power he gave her was not that great seeing that she needed the life-force of the X-Men to get to the center of the universe.
Originally posted by HandOfFate
I have the book and it doesn't say Rachel was more powerful then the Phoenix Force.
And I just posted the Scans, where the Watcher says,
"she has become everything she ever dreamed of and FAR FAR MORE"
Originally posted by HandOfFate
IIRC, the power he gave her was not that great seeing that she needed the life-force of the X-Men to get to the center of the universe.
So go back and read, if you have the book.
Rachel took their life-forces to prevent being absorbed within the Sphere of the Mkraan Crystal. (it had nothing to do with travelling 😂 )
Just LIKE Her Mother before her:
With the Life-Force of ALL the X-Men she Anchors herself to Reality, to avoid being ABSORBED
Because if Rachel or Jean didn't receive that anchor/sustainability, this would happen:
Phoenix getting ABSORBED by the N-Galaxy, and it hasn't even broken free yet.
Originally posted by Mr Master
And I just posted the Scans, where the Watcher says,
"she has become everything she ever dreamed of and FAR FAR MORE"
But it doesn't say greater then the Phoenix Force. So your just giving me an assumption, not actual fact. If it said greater then the Phoenix Force, then will would have something to talk about.
Originally posted by Mr Master Rachel took their life-forces to prevent being absorbed within the Sphere of the Mkraan Crystal. (it had nothing to do with travelling 😂 ).
Again, It doesn't say that. Beside Jean/Phoenix was trying to heal the M'kraan Crystal and save the universe.
Rachel on the other hand was going to destroy it, so why would she need an anchor? She wasn't planning on come back.
Originally posted by Mr Master With the Life-Force of ALL the X-Men she Anchors herself to Reality, to avoid being ABSORBED.
Are we talking about Jean or Rachel? In Jean case, she did absorb the life energy of Storm and Corsair to anchor herself.
IIRC, the Classic X-Men issue tried to make this into a team effect with all the X-Men but this didn't happen in the original story.
Originally posted by Mr Master Because if Rachel or Jean didn't receive that anchor/sustainability, this would happen:
Phoenix getting ABSORBED by the N-Galaxy, and it hasn't even broken free yet.
Again, why would Rachel need an anchor, when she trying to kill everything.
I hope I don't sound rude, that's not my intention.🙂
Originally posted by HandOfFate
But it doesn't say greater then the Phoenix Force. So your just giving me an assumption, not actual fact. If it said greater then the Phoenix Force, then will would have something to talk about.
Ok, your being cool, and I'm being cool and this is a pretty good debate.
This is necessary so bare with me, this definition is straight from webster's :
WILL: verb; [ trans. ] make or try to make (someone) do something or (something) happen by the exercise of mental powers : "reluctantly he willed himself to turn and go back"
Now
"She WILLS a THING"......"Says to herself, So Be it, and it is Done"
"The Primal Absolutes....CREATION and DESTRUCTION, are Hers to Command"
Now seriously, is it not clear that she is actually controlling the PF?
Avatars are Not the "Primal Absolutes" That's the Force in it's Natural State, the one that Spark's Big Bangs cyclically for a Universe.
Rachel is "WILLING" that.
Originally posted by HandOfFate
Again, It doesn't say that. Beside Jean/Phoenix was trying to heal the M'kraan Crystal and save the universe, not destroy it. Rachel on the other hand was going to destroy it, so why would she need an anchor? She wasn't planning on come back.
Again, Rachel took their life-forces to prevent being absorbed within the Sphere of the Mkraan Crystal.
"But I Can't do it completely on my own. I NEED Your Life-Force, your Spirits to SUSTAIN Me" (she even makes a reference to her Mother)
.....
Here, AFTER they Arrive at the Crystal Rachel says,
"I welcome Your Spirit Forms, I thank you for the gift of your Life-Forces, I MEAN to USE them well" (She hasn't even put their Spirits to use yet so it was obviously Not For the voyage)
Now is it just a coincidence that Jean happened to do the EXACT SAME thing that Rachel did?
The reason Jean did it, was to avoid getting Absorbed once inside the Sphere.
What you have to understand is Rachel would NOT have been able to reach the "Interlocking Stasis Fields" which hold back the N-Galaxy.
"a Network of interlocking Stasis Fields NEUTRALIZES the power of the N-Galaxy"
And HOW is she going to Destroy the Universe without releasing the N-Galaxy?
You see,
Cyclops with one eye blast cracked the Sphere, at first Jean thought something was breaking free.
Well this assures us Rachel didn't Absorb the Life-Force of all those X-Men to crack the Sphere
So Jean goes Inside the Sphere
Jean has to "SOAR Deep into the Sphere" before reaching the Stasis Fields that contain the N-Galaxy
"Her joy SUSTAINS her" (there's that word again, like in Rachel's case)
Jean says, "There's such power here. BOUND within this LATTICEWORK (Stasis Fields)
Then right before Jean has a quick vison of what the N-Galaxy can do, she says,
"When the LATTICE DIES, the Neutron galaxy will be free"
When the WHAT Dies?
The Lattice
And WHERE is that located?
Deep Within the Sphere
continues in the next post....
continues....
Ok.
This is what happens when she applies her power to the Lattice
Jean Tries to FIX the Lattice Alone
"But it's NOWHERE NEAR good enough"
Here Jean Now understands what it is exactly that CONTAINS the N-Galaxy
"a Network of interlocking Stasis Fields NEUTRALIZES the power of the N-Galaxy"....
In the next Panel
Phoenix is getting ABSORBED by the N-Galaxy, even though it's STILL Neutralized
With the Life-Force of ALL the X-Men she Anchors herself to Reality, to avoid being ABSORBED
"For ALL Her awesome Power, She CAN'T DO IT ALONE"
ALL the X-Men gave their LIFE-FORCE to help REPAIR the Lattice.
"The POWER of Her Friends Sing WITHIN Her, as she reenergizes the Lattice"
Jean is STILL Repairing the Stasis Fields here along with the Spirits of MANY X-Men.
The point of throwing in the Jean Scans is to show you that Rachel would have never lasted in there with out the Life-Force of ALL those X-Men, just like Jean wasn't able to.
Hence, Rachel would NOT have been able to destroy the Universe, because she would never had been able to apply her power to the Stasis Fields that contain the N-Galaxy.
This why she NEEDED those X-Men and she knew it.
Ok, so we established that Rachel did NOT need the X-Men's Life-Force to get to the center of the Universe, NOR did she need them to break open the Sphere, since the Sphere is weak enough to get cracked open by Cyclops alone.
I think we can agree she needed the X-Men to Anchor/Sustain her from being Absorbed, giving her the time she would have needed to Un-Knit the Stasis Fields.
Originally posted by HandOfFate
Are we talking about Jean or Rachel? In Jean case, she did absorb the life energy of Storm and Corsair to anchor herself.
As you can see it was many more than that, Xavier, Colossus everyone.
Originally posted by HandOfFate
IIRC, the Classic issue tried to make it into a team effect with all the X-Men but this didn't happen in the original story.
What are you talking about not the original issue?
X-Men v1- 108 is the Original.
And it was a team effort, had it not been for the X-Men, that Feat would never exist for Jean.
Originally posted by HandOfFate
Again, why would Rachel need an anchor, when she trying to kill everything.I hope I don't sound rude, that's not my intention.
Not at all, you've been cool, but I hope you know why now.
Originally posted by What If...
Really, if you think you are "shooting down" anyone, you are also delusional.Your 'debates' are neither effective or offensive, so don't give yourself the idea you are offending any fans of phoenix.
creep.
LMAO, why would I get the idea your offended? My problem with you Fanboys is that people show you logic scans and proof and your fanboyism for this stupid bird blinds you to the truth people try to show you.
