Hal wins majority of this fight, Blackbolts gets majorly overwhelmed by Gl's construct.. Its quite difficult to fight off someone who can shrink to atom size, teleportational capabilities, High level matter/energy manipulation, biomolecular feats (can easily devevolved any beings), and many many more.. Hal 8-9/10... Just my 2 cents..
Hal's been beaten up by Despero. Badly. Hal just managed to beat him but his GL forcefields were penetrated and his arm was broken from simple physical strength. That's the Hal people think about when he loses.
Hal also has feats of stopping supernova's or black holes or crap like that. That's the Hal people think of when he wins. There's a solution to this and no, it is not PIS or CIS. People who continue to think that just don't like applying their brains. Therefore, in the same fashion of explaining just how Cap's shield absorption properties work: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=5319612&highlight=forumid%3A77+userid%3A77143#post5319612
and Wolverine's healing powers work:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=5050676&highlight=Wolverine+forumid%3A77+userid%3A77143#post5050676
and Iceman's powers work: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=5051656&highlight=forumid%3A77+userid%3A77143#post5051656
I shall tackle this inconsistency that is more than just inconsistency. Hell, it happens every other GL comic. Hal gets punched, Hal stops supernova, repeat.
Here's the solution: There's a difference in what Hal does and how he utilizes the ring in those two situations. The first situation is Hal using 'strength constructs.' Usually, Hal uses 'strength contructs' which are certainly strong but can be penetrated. Hal used them against Despero, Stewart used them in 'Sacrifice,' and they were all blown away by physical force. They are tied directly to willpower and significant physical force can break them.
The second situation, when he's running around doing all his 'star-level' feats are when Hal's using energy manipulation. This is also directly linked to willpower in the concentration it takes to manipulate energy.
Let me illustrate this difference between 'strength construct' and energy manipulation with an analogy, Onslaught from MU had both telekinetic and magnetic powers. Now if he was forced to bend adamantium, which of his powers would be more convenient and less exhausting? His magnetic powers of course. TK power would result in extremely difficult physical manipulation rather than simple magnetic molecular warping. That's the same deal with Hal. When he deals with black holes, he's not using a physical strength construct to combat the gravitational forces of the black hole, he simply manipulates space/time continuum to contain/shunt it, whatever. Same thing when he contains a supernova.
The explanation sounds too simple to be true but it works. Otherwise, all those physical strength constructs GL's make would never break. But we see that they always do. SPB broke 300 GL's combined strength construct in 'Infinite Crisis.' You think SPB had the power of 300 black holes? Doomsday, pre-Death of Superman broke a GL's strength construct physically, did he have the strength of a blackhole then? It's a simple answer yes, but it works on all levels.
So back to Blackbolt's and Hal Jordan's fight. Hal would probably throw up strength constructs in defense or attack against BB and that would be the end of it. Because BB's scream would blow away Hal's strength constructs. The feedback renders Hal unconscious. And yes, a full force strength construct being shattered results in the Green Lantern's willpower being shattered. It's happened dozens of times. Stewart is unconscious after Superman broke his 'strength construct' in 'Sacrifice.' Hal was knocked dizzy whenever Despero penetrated his fields in 'Emerald Twilight.' The first Green Lantern Doomsday met, was killed when DD broke out of the 'strength construct bubble' which stunned the GL.
Only way Hal defends against the scream is if he were able to analyze its energy wavelength or frequencies before getting hit with it full force, which I'm sure his ring could do if given an opportunity. He'd use energy manipulation to negate the scream's effects. That's Hal's only chance. But everytime I've seen BB use his scream, he uses it with precision and careful determination and it always works. He knows when he needs just a whisper and when he needs a full shout. I've never seen his scream fail. That's why I think the first scream is the last scream and Hal generally never gets a chance to analyze the energies to compensate.
Black Bolt 7/10
So what your sayin is that disregard Hals high showing and just used low showing feats while you use Blackbolts highfeats... That not fair..lol
His more than shown what his contruct is made off.. SBP plowed through Gl's squads, Hal did desame... Plus his got more than making construct at his disposal.. invisibility doubt BB has got some way of tracking that, his amp strength to the point of slugging Mongul out in one shot, teleportational could easy teleports BB on the sun or a black hole, matter manipulation and the likes.. His done this on more than 1 heck 3 ocassions so its not pis... Everyones got low showing.. Hal would beat BB desame way Ronan beat him... What i mentioned above is mostly his normal showings..
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Hal's been beaten up by Despero. Badly. Hal just managed to beat him but his GL forcefields were penetrated and his arm was broken from simple physical strength. That's the Hal people think about when he loses.Hal also has feats of stopping supernova's or black holes or crap like that. That's the Hal people think of when he wins. There's a solution to this and no, it is not PIS or CIS. People who continue to think that just don't like applying their brains. Therefore, in the same fashion of explaining just how Cap's shield absorption properties work: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=5319612&highlight=forumid%3A77+userid%3A77143#post5319612
and Wolverine's healing powers work:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=5050676&highlight=Wolverine+forumid%3A77+userid%3A77143#post5050676and Iceman's powers work: http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=5051656&highlight=forumid%3A77+userid%3A77143#post5051656
I shall tackle this inconsistency that is more than just inconsistency. Hell, it happens every other GL comic. Hal gets punched, Hal stops supernova, repeat.
Here's the solution: There's a difference in what Hal does and how he utilizes the ring in those two situations. The first situation is Hal using 'strength constructs.' Usually, Hal uses 'strength contructs' which are certainly strong but can be penetrated. Hal used them against Despero, Stewart used them in 'Sacrifice,' and they were all blown away by physical force. They are tied directly to willpower and significant physical force can break them.
The second situation, when he's running around doing all his 'star-level' feats are when Hal's using energy manipulation. This is also directly linked to willpower in the concentration it takes to manipulate energy.
Let me illustrate this difference between 'strength construct' and energy manipulation with an analogy, Onslaught from MU had both telekinetic and magnetic powers. Now if he was forced to bend adamantium, which of his powers would be more convenient and less exhausting? His magnetic powers of course. TK power would result in extremely difficult physical manipulation rather than simple magnetic molecular warping. That's the same deal with Hal. When he deals with black holes, he's not using a physical strength construct to combat the gravitational forces of the black hole, he simply manipulates space/time continuum to contain/shunt it, whatever. Same thing when he contains a supernova.
The explanation sounds too simple to be true but it works. Otherwise, all those physical strength constructs GL's make would never break. But we see that they always do. SPB broke 300 GL's combined strength construct in 'Infinite Crisis.' You think SPB had the power of 300 black holes? Doomsday, pre-Death of Superman broke a GL's strength construct physically, did he have the strength of a blackhole then? It's a simple answer yes, but it works on all levels.
So back to Blackbolt's and Hal Jordan's fight. Hal would probably throw up strength constructs in defense or attack against BB and that would be the end of it. Because BB's scream would blow away Hal's strength constructs. The feedback renders Hal unconscious. And yes, a full force strength construct being shattered results in the Green Lantern's willpower being shattered. It's happened dozens of times. Stewart is unconscious after Superman broke his 'strength construct' in 'Sacrifice.' Hal was knocked dizzy whenever Despero penetrated his fields in 'Emerald Twilight.' The first Green Lantern Doomsday met, was killed when DD broke out of the 'strength construct bubble' which stunned the GL.
Only way Hal defends against the scream is if he were able to analyze its energy wavelength or frequencies before getting hit with it full force, which I'm sure his ring could do if given an opportunity. He'd use energy manipulation to negate the scream's effects. That's Hal's only chance. But everytime I've seen BB use his scream, he uses it with precision and careful determination and it always works. He knows when he needs just a whisper and when he needs a full shout. I've never seen his scream fail. That's why I think the first scream is the last scream and Hal generally never gets a chance to analyze the energies to compensate.
Black Bolt 7/10
Well if you guys had paid attention at all to my theory, its all about space/time and energy manipulation for his high-end feats. But that is if he can analyze and knows exactly what he's dealing with. If he doesn't, or he's forced to deal with physical strength, he uses straight up 'strength constructs' akin to telekinesis.
I'm not ignoring his high-end feats. I'm explaining how they can be reconciled with his low showings. They are not low showings. He's just using the ring in a more primitive way. When he can use more sophisticated measures with the more complicated abilities open to his ring, he can use em. As I illustrated, Onslaught has access to magnetic and telekinetic powers. Would it be easier for him to bend adamantium with magnetic manipulation or telekinetic force? Same thing.
Like I said, if Hal has the opportunity to analyze Black Bolt's screams, he should be able to manipulate that energy frequency/wavelength and maybe even turn it against him. But only if he's given an opportunity. And like I said, Black Bolt always end a fight with a sonic scream. He NEVER gives a person an opportunity when the fight goes that far. He ends it. Therefore, Black Bolt wins more often than not.
Black Bolt 7/10
Why does he need to analyse BB scream to beat him.. If Hal wishes to he could go H2H while amping strength (Okay that be bad tactics on his part but if he makes a contruct preventing BB from screaming, hed TKO him) or just teleports him to a blackhole you dont have to anylyse BB scream to do that.. How bout Hit and run tactic coupled with invisibility/speed hows BB going to counter that kind of tactics... Hals is definetly faster in both fighting and overall speed..
Originally posted by RoldzI'll respond to every single one of your points. 1) GL Corps protocol prevents use of the ring for killing. You'd have to override it with a request which takes time. 2) GL has used amped strength before and he falls far short of a guy with Mongul strength. 3) Black Bolt doesn't inhale air to scream like Black Canary. The mental command for vocalization is directly connected to his control of the ionic sonic particles which are his actual scream. If GL put a muzzle on Black Bolt's mouth, the sonic scream would still work. He only needs to make a sound with his vocal cords. He can do that even with his mouth closed by humming. 4) Teleporting into a black hole is BFR (battlefield removal) and is cheap and I never consider it a win. Otherwise Nightcrawler wins against Hulk. 5) Hit and run is a nice thought, but Hal doesn't fight at superspeed like Superman, he can merely accelerate to superspeed. Black Bolt is the same way and can reach supersonic speeds of 600 mph. But I do agree if Hal ran away like a wuss and took potshots and overwhelmed Black Bolt before he could let loose a sonic scream with his ring, he would win. Hence, I gave him 3/10 fights.
Why does he need to analyse BB scream to beat him.. If Hal wishes to he could go H2H while amping strength (Okay that be bad tactics on his part but if he makes a contruct preventing BB from screaming, hed TKO him) or just teleports him to a blackhole you dont have to anylyse BB scream to do that.. How bout Hit and run tactic coupled with invisibility/speed hows BB going to counter that kind of tactics... Hals is definetly faster in both fighting and overall speed..
But Hal's fearless, he never fights like that. Even when outclassed and powerless he goes straight-forward into the fight. He's courageous and stubborn to the point of reckless. Fearless. He'd never fight the way you described it. And these characters ought to stay true to character during theoretical KMC fights. But like I said, Hal might do that for a third of his fights and probably win if he fought out of character or had a reason to do so.
Black Bolt 7/10
the funny thing about black bolt is that on panel he has yet to let out a full scream, up to date he has only whispered, though hal has some killer energy containing/canceling feats in his own right , his shields might have a problem with black bolt's full scream..plus Hal is just a guy with a ring, he's prone to fatigue and battle weary, so much so that his clothes end up ripped and tattered a few times, and his nose and lips bleeding..while BB on the other hand can absorb electrons from the atmosphere and recharge..you gotta remember that hal is the one with the indomitable will, not the unparalleeld imagination(kyle) so while he is out there dicking aroun with BB and creating giant fists and boxing gloves, just one solid punch or electron blast from BB and he's done, not to mention the "master blow"
Originally posted by OneDumbG0
I'll respond to every single one of your points. 1) GL Corps protocol prevents use of the ring for killing. You'd have to override it with a request which takes time. 2) GL has used amped strength before and he falls far short of a guy with Mongul strength. 3) Black Bolt doesn't inhale air to scream like Black Canary. The mental command for vocalization is directly connected to his control of the ionic sonic particles which are his actual scream. If GL put a muzzle on Black Bolt's mouth, the sonic scream would still work. He only needs to make a sound with his vocal cords. He can do that even with his mouth closed by humming. 4) Teleporting into a black hole is BFR (battlefield removal) and is cheap and I never consider it a win. Otherwise Nightcrawler wins against Hulk. 5) Hit and run is a nice thought, but Hal doesn't fight at superspeed like Superman, he can merely accelerate to superspeed. Black Bolt is the same way and can reach supersonic speeds of 600 mph. But I do agree if Hal ran away like a wuss and took potshots and overwhelmed Black Bolt before he could let loose a sonic scream with his ring, he would win. Hence, I gave him 3/10 fights.But Hal's fearless, he never fights like that. Even when outclassed and powerless he goes straight-forward into the fight. He's courageous and stubborn to the point of reckless. Fearless. He'd never fight the way you described it. And these characters ought to stay true to character during theoretical KMC fights. But like I said, Hal might do that for a third of his fights and probably win if he fought out of character or had a reason to do so.
Black Bolt 7/10
Weve havent even touch matter/time manipulation yet..
All this ive mentioned are on comic panel, not speculation.. Even that hit and run tactics, so how is that not in his characteristic..
How would you proposed BB would win against Hal by the way? All he does is scream out loud..lol which is easily avoid by Hal...
Black Bolt (HoM) defeasts Apocalypse with a mere whisper.
<http://img132.imageshack.us/my.php?image=blackboltfeat16gt.gif> <http://img132.imageshack.us/my.php?image=blackboltfeat16gt.gif>. Black Bolt dodges an blast from gun from close range, while flying in midair, and destroys the enemys ships.
.
<http://img389.imageshack.us/my.php?image=blackboltfeat29wn.gif> if he can do that bb wins 10/10
Going against Gladiator..
<http://img158.exs.cx/img158/3928/gladss0fq.jpg>
<http://img232.exs.cx/img232/7655/gladss25uv.jpg>
<http://img106.exs.cx/img106/9764/vsglads9ak.jpg>
<http://img108.exs.cx/img108/3751/vsglads24bh.jpg>
Against Richard Ryder Nova.
<http://img103.exs.cx/img103/2438/nova22za.jpg>
<http://img110.exs.cx/img110/8058/nova36df.jpg>
Owns Mandarin
<http://img228.exs.cx/img228/8079/mannn3gk.jpg>
Remember classic Shpinx ? the one that fought Galactus?
<http://img67.exs.cx/img67/5563/vssphinx19mx.jpg>
<http://img63.exs.cx/img63/9550/vssphinx25qz.jpg>
<http://img171.exs.cx/img171/9885/vssphinx31pn.jpg>
vs Thing
<http://img168.exs.cx/img168/2411/vsthing19zf.jpg>
<http://img193.exs.cx/img193/5269/vsthing28zd.jpg>
<http://img182.exs.cx/img182/4141/vsthing34ff.jpg>
BB > Black Holes
<http://img125.exs.cx/img125/8040/holes6lm.jpg>
vs Magneto
<http://img236.exs.cx/img236/4031/vsmags11rn.jpg>
<http://img235.exs.cx/img235/9356/vsmags25pp.jpg>
<http://img228.exs.cx/img228/8273/vsmags30sb.jpg>
<http://img226.exs.cx/img226/6859/vsmags46hg.jpg>
vs Hulk
<http://img118.exs.cx/img118/1254/vh17ou.jpg>
<http://img123.exs.cx/img123/6058/vh28fm.jpg>
<http://img124.exs.cx/img124/5205/vh35iz.jpg>
<http://img112.exs.cx/img112/7639/vh40st.jpg>
<http://img62.exs.cx/img62/7937/vhulk12cj.jpg>
<http://img70.exs.cx/img70/1148/vhulk21dc.jpg>
<http://img27.exs.cx/img27/7936/vhulk37dh.jpg>
<http://img177.exs.cx/img177/7203/hulk25yj.jpg>
<http://img175.exs.cx/img175/525/hulk33gf.jpg>
<http://img168.exs.cx/img168/3176/hulk40cw.jpg>
<http://img186.exs.cx/img186/2706/hulk08rp.jpg>
<http://img173.exs.cx/img173/8646/hulk011rj.jpg>
Containment field
<http://img155.exs.cx/img155/3350/fcont7fr.jpg>
Electron powers
<http://img227.exs.cx/img227/623/ment9bn.jpg>
<http://img222.exs.cx/img222/2914/mind2fu.jpg>
<http://img220.exs.cx/img220/663/mind26to.jpg>
<http://img102.exs.cx/img102/9812/max57np.jpg>
vs Cap Atom Lite
<http://img103.echo.cx/img103/4640/gold9dm.jpg>
<http://img117.echo.cx/img117/4017/gold24se.jpg>
<http://img129.echo.cx/img129/6886/gold32kz.jpg>
<http://img186.echo.cx/img186/9127/gold48ti.jpg>
<http://img167.echo.cx/img167/6470/gold53cc.jpg>
<http://img184.echo.cx/img184/7660/gold68me.jpg>
<http://img183.echo.cx/img183/4364/trikon7ly.jpg>
Matter manipulation
<http://img45.exs.cx/img45/9417/matt4cy.jpg>
<http://img45.exs.cx/img45/9417/matt4cy.jpg>
