Originally posted by Alliance
Communism has never really been achieved, socialism is an econimic system
You did say its never really been achieved but doesnt the Chinese Government call itself Communist. Didnt the Vietnamese call themselves Politics. In the Cold War weren't the Russians communist?
As far as I know there is no such thing as 100 percent Capitalist system but America is still Capitalist.
Originally posted by Alliance
Politics is about governing people....I'd agree with that. Its simple, but works.
Right and communism comes under Politics.
Originally posted by Alfheim
You did say its never really been achieved but doesnt the Chinese Government call itself Communist. Didnt the Vietnamese call themselves Politics. In the Cold War weren't the Russians communist?As far as I know there is no such thing as 100 percent Capitalist system but America is still Capitalist.
Right and communism comes under Politics.
What is this the Cold War? Overdramatization comes to mind. Governments mislabel themselves because they're trying to be things that they are not. Communism is a rather clearly defined endgoal of society, one without government. I don't see anything close to that at all. Socialst might be the word you are looking for.
Secondly, it seems as if you dont really find fault with politics, but communism. If that is the case, then what you're doing is like saying all mammals are violent because you see a lion maul an antelope.
Originally posted by Ushgarak
I'm pretty sure that CIA source you like so much called them Communist...
You know what I mean....but now we have to start nitpicking. Obvoulsy some people have a different defintion of what Communism is.
Originally posted by Alliance
What is this the Cold War? Overdramatization comes to mind.
Well it could have led to a nuclear war.
Originally posted by Alliance
Governments mislabel themselves because they're trying to be things that they are not. Communism is a rather clearly defined endgoal of society, one without government. I don't see anything close to that at all. Socialst might be the word you are looking for.
No I am not. You dont think maybe they might have a different defintion of what Communism is? Anyway regardless of what you want to call them they use a political system. 🙄
Originally posted by Alliance
Secondly, it seems as if you dont really find fault with politics, but communism. If that is the case, then what you're doing is like saying all mammals are violent because you see a lion maul an antelope.
No I am saying that Politics can be bad as well. Its just that most of the examples of conflict I can remember are between Capitalism and Communism.
Originally posted by Ushgarak
I'm pretty sure that CIA source you like so much called them Communist...
Why would I trust an American souce that would clearly be biased in this instance? The US called everyone they didn't like communist. They were too busy clutching fear to actually use their heads.
Originally posted by Alfheim
No I am not. You dont think maybe they might have a different defintion of what Communism is? Anyway regardless of what you want to call them they use a political system. 🙄
Then name something that doesn't use politics and show me why this is such a special case.
Originally posted by Alfheim
No I am saying that Politics can be bad as well. Its just that most of the examples of conflict I can remember are between Capitalism and Communism.
Well, then I'd say thats a myopic view. If all you can reduce this conflict too, then saying politics is a destabilizing factor is over-reaching. (not even commenting on its correctness of course)
Originally posted by Alfheim
You did say its never really been achieved but doesnt the Chinese Government call itself Communist. Didnt the Vietnamese call themselves Politics. In the Cold War weren't the Russians communist?
well, if you look at the steps Marx envisioned neccesary for the transformation of society into a communist system, there was the need for a "dictatorship of the proletariat" on a temporary basis. It's arguable that communist governments never got hung up on the part where the government seizes private property and businesses, resulting in an autocratic dictatorship, and thus failing to fulfill Marx's vision of societal transformation.
Originally posted by Alliance
Why would I trust an American souce that would clearly be biased in this instance? The US called everyone they didn't like communist. They were too busy clutching fear to actually use their heads.
Well as far as I knwo they call themselves Communist as well.
Originally posted by Alliance
Then name something that doesn't use politics and show me why this is such a special case.
Well if you think about what im talking about I am talking about secular politics even if I have not used the phrase. If you also think about what I said and maybe im not making myself clear....politics can be just as bad as religon. Im not saying its like that all the time im saying it can be.
Originally posted by Alliance
Well, then I'd say thats a myopic view. If all you can reduce this conflict too, then saying politics is a destabilizing factor is over-reaching. (not even commenting on its correctness of course)
Well how many other political systems do you want or examples of conflict.
Theres the oppression of Communism by Stalin.
Theres the oppression of Hitler with facism.
Theres the conflict bet ween facism and communism.
Theres the example of the American Government presecuting people who they thought were Communist.
Theres the Vietnam war where the Americans invaded Vitenam because they didnt want them to become Communist.
Theres the Cold War which could have turned into a nuclear war.
Theres WW1
Theres the Jacobins of the French Revolution.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well as far as I knwo they call themselves Communist as well.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well if you think about what im talking about I am talking about secular politics even if I have not used the phrase. If you also think about what I said and maybe im not making myself clear....politics can be just as bad as religon. Im not saying its like that all the time im saying it can be.
Not evey concept on your list is political. You are basically saying that persecution and war harm people and YES! they do.
However, politics isn't the main cause of certain ideologies. The US didn't persecute communists to gain political clout, it did so because Americans were, and many still are, uneducated about it.
Well as an Atheist I see very little good in religion. I don't need to follow fictional stories in a very dull book (called the Bible) to lead a good and moral life. Common sense and good parenting is all that's required. Most of us are born with some called a conscience which makes 'the word of God' a bit superfluous really.
The good of religion is that it brings people together.
A sense of unity is needed in all people.
Civilization exists for the same reason that religion exists becasue most people can't stand to be alone.
Even these forums exist because people can't stand to be alone.
Religion provides a way for people to get the unity and companionship that they need. Unfortunately organized religion has (in most, but NOT ALL cases) perverted that concept into one of hate and exclusion.
Religion is good. Forcing it on other people is not.
Originally posted by Punkyhermy
what good does the alternative do?
atheism provide perspective and clarity that many main stream faiths lack. As such it is my chosen faith.
all respect for everyone ..
Welcome for everybody
I am a Muslim and I would like to clarify some things with respect for each one . 🙄
I will, clarify but in points. with notes
1- What is Islam? Islam is a religion of justice, love and tolerance. religion of life which I swore if anyone and of you would know the truth of islam he or she like it .. honestly ... When Islam came it came to give you emerging rights and avoid you from the ignorance to science and from the darkness to light . If you do not believe that .just read right books about Islam and understand what is the reality of Islam . Try to talk with Muslims. To hear them and understand them and what is islam mean . and do not watch the wewstern media , because the Western media distorts the image of Islam and convey the wrong things about Islam . that is why many of western people think that we are .. or all Muslims are terrorists. be sure that is wrong .
note
Every ideas of Western people about Islam became wrong .Especially after the events of September 11th . If that happened from Muslims there is a lot of things that have occurred from on non-Muslims against Muslims .. many wars .. do not forget that . I do not want to go into politics . but i want to tell you about truth of islam .
2- What is Jihad In Islam ? Is jihad is terrorism ? Certainly not .
Allah order from Muslims to Jihad ..in several cases.
The first case is if the enemy came to the land of the Muslims, to take away the land to hurt people. Here the Jihad will be compulsory from every muslim To defend their religion and homeland, But if the enemy entered one other Muslim countries but not my own country here the jihad become not compulsory from everu muslim .God told Muslims that in the war they should not kill women and children never because they are weak . We must deal with the captive by humanity .
note :
Jihad in Islam has a prominent place .. jihad mean when we when I am fighting the enemy, we fight them to make the word of god highest . and the Islam is the religion of freedom is not one could be compelled to convert to islam .. just if he or she want to enter to islam .
3- The concept of terrorism has emerged now after many of wars between muslims and non muslims .. for many reasons .. and
Everyone knows who started the war.. Who started the war? Be honest ..
note :
I live in a multicultural and there are Christians and Jews and a lot of people from around the world . all Muslims want to understand more the Westerners want to be friendly with them , and we do not want war . We want you to know the fact of Islam . islam is not a religion of terrorism never . But there are also Muslims who are not understand the truth of Islam . And Islam is a religion of ethics . God created us all of us and he will chastise us in the Doomsday .
I hope to find someone who can read who can understand who can think carefuly about that . and If I were a terrorist .. Why I have a lot of friends from West ? Why many of them assert that Islam is the religion of justice and peace ?
last note
For your information only .. Have you noticed that Islam enter each house ? You all know about Islam, whether Jews or Christians . Do you know why? even not have be argument for you in Judgment Day before God . i mean in judgment all will ask each one ..Have you heard about Islam? Do you believe it ? Then there will be hell or paradise.
I know full well that there is person who want break my head now. Perhaps there are those who say I am stupid perhaps he or she cursed for now . I never care but just i want to tell you that . I am very responsible and must be explained to you the right image of Islam . Islam is not terrorism not terrorism is not terrorism . Just look for the truth and you will find it .
all respect for everyone . whether you be Muslims, Christians or Jews or Buddhists.. or whatever you be. 🙂
best
silver heart
Re: all respect for everyone ..
Originally posted by silver heart
Every ideas of Western people about Islam became wrong .Especially after the events of September 11th
I have no problem with islam even though I live in the west.
Really its extremists who blow up building that scare me (muslim/arab or not)