Originally posted by KillAll
according to showings.... above statement is false. if you can prove otherwise i'd like to see it.the fan base here on the forum is leaning towards juggernaut, and he's proved more than capable of reality shattering/dimension crushing punches... i'd say more than capable of subdueing champion also.
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Originally posted by The_Barbarian
Congratulations on committing the Logic Fallacy of the Appeal to Ridicule and the Fallacy of the Strawman...🙄To admonish and make fun of one's style of debate in relation to a "Comic Book Forum", does not support the validity of one's argument.
Moreover, this argument does not have any relevancy to the main argument being presented in this thread.
And by that same logic -- Juggernaut has a '..terrible record -- period'
Let us presume that you are correct, and that lack of positive results -- does indeed equate to who will be the victor of this battle.
Using this logic, it would then be more logical for one to assume that the Juggernaut has the greater "lack of positive results" when compared to the Champion - seeing as how the former character, has had much more comic book appearances than the latter.
Your personal opinion of the Champion's "Suckiness" does not dismiss his overall ability and potential. That is the reason why we have these debates, which are predominantly based on a character's overall power and skill, rather than the outcomes of battles predetermined by sales and overall popularity of a character.
Moreover, as it has already been stated to you above - by your logic, the Juggernaut has a much "Darker Cloud" hanging over him, since he has lost many more battles than the Champion.
You cannot have it both ways -- either we compare the individuals on basis of comic book history, or we compare them on basis of powers and ability.
History has shown us that Juggernaut has lost many more battles than the Champion.
From a power/ability stance, the Champion is capable of harnessing much more potential than Juggernaut. He receives his power from the residual energies of the big bang, which started all life within the universe. This includes life within the Crimson Cosmos.
Additionally, the Champion cannot be killed until the universe ends, due to the Grandmaster's pact with Death. He also possesses thousands of years worth of fighting skill, and has defeated entire planets full of trained warriors.
Furthermore, the only way the Juggernaut can win this battle, is if he somehow manages to molecularly disperse the Champion's physical form. You have yet to provide any evidence of him being capable of such an attack from a historical or power related perspective - and being as such, the credibility of your argument will continue to be severely lacking.
Heh..Heh..Heh.
Is it just me, or has someone taken his love for comic books, 80's cartoons, philosophy, and own opinion a little bit too far?
this is champions power
Height: 9 ft. 2 in.
Weight: 5,050 lbs.
Eyes: Silver
Hair: Red
Strength Level: The limits of the Champion's strength are not known. In Earth's gravity, he can lift (press) at least 100 tons. His strength derives from the channeling of cosmic energy for physical use.
Known Superhuman Powers: The Champion controls the power primordial, the energy derived from the Big Bang itself. He has channeled this power into the development of his physical form: his musculature, his reflexes, his stamina, and his strength, while the exercise of human strength taps electro-chemical energies of the complex molecules in the body, the Champion's strength taps cosmic nuclear energies. His physical strength is only determined by the amount of cosmic energy his finite form can contain. This limit has yet to be seen. He apparently never tires since his body has the ability to tap whatever energies it needs to recuperate. He cannot be hurt by any means short of molecular dispersion. Having channeled all of the cosmic energy as his command into making his body a perfect fighting machine, the Champion can no longer direct that energy from his body into force-blast as many other energy manipulators can.
Abilities: The Champion has mastered untold thousands of different martial arts and fighting styles culled from across the known Universe, and spends the majority of his time between championship matches practicing these arts.
Limitation: The Champion's limitations are not known.
heres juggernaut powers
Height: 6 ft. 10 in.
Weight: 900 lbs.
Eyes: Blue
Here: red brown
Strength Level: The Juggernaut possesses Class 100 strength, enabling him to lift (press) over 100 tons. The Juggernaut is said to be unstoppable, and the upper limit to his strength is not known.
Known Superhuman Powers: The Juggernaut possesses untold power, mystical in nature, which enhances his strength to an as yet unknown degree and makes him a seemingly irresistible, unstoppable being. Once he begins to walk in a certain direction, no obstacle or force on Earth has been observed to be able to stop him. Apparently, only he can stop himself. Some obstacles (many tons of rock, for example) or forces (such as plasma-discharge cannons) may slow his pace considerably, but nothing has yet stopped him permanently from advancing.
Besides giving him vast superhuman strength, the mystical energy of Cyttorak gives the Juggernaut an extraordinary degree of resistance to all forms of injury. The Juggernaut can shield himself even further from injury by mentally surrounding himself with a force field. Enveloped by his force field, the Juggernaut has survived the fiery explosion of a truck transporting a huge quantity of oil without any injury whatsoever. The Juggernaut can survive indefinitely without food, water, or oxygen. He is sustained by his mystical energies alone.
In the past the Juggernaut has temporarily possessed telepathic abilities and certain mystical powers, all of which he has since lost.
Originally posted by carver9
this is champions power
Height: 9 ft. 2 in.
Weight: 5,050 lbs.
Eyes: Silver
Hair: Red
Strength Level: The limits of the Champion's strength are not known. In Earth's gravity, he can lift (press) at least 100 tons. His strength derives from the channeling of cosmic energy for physical use.
Known Superhuman Powers: The Champion controls the power primordial, the energy derived from the Big Bang itself. He has channeled this power into the development of his physical form: his musculature, his reflexes, his stamina, and his strength, while the exercise of human strength taps electro-chemical energies of the complex molecules in the body, the Champion's strength taps cosmic nuclear energies. His physical strength is only determined by the amount of cosmic energy his finite form can contain. This limit has yet to be seen. He apparently never tires since his body has the ability to tap whatever energies it needs to recuperate. He cannot be hurt by any means short of molecular dispersion. Having channeled all of the cosmic energy as his command into making his body a perfect fighting machine, the Champion can no longer direct that energy from his body into force-blast as many other energy manipulators can.
Abilities: The Champion has mastered untold thousands of different martial arts and fighting styles culled from across the known Universe, and spends the majority of his time between championship matches practicing these arts.
Limitation: The Champion's limitations are not known.