Originally posted by Tangible God
Were those 8 Jedi former Jedi Masters and discibles of Palpatine and Sith teachings with a powerful command of the Dark Side? No?Vader, if he can't block a barrage of lightning from Dooku, which I seriously don't see him being able to keep up for too long, will be killed by Dooku without much effort. And regardless of Boba winning or not, he will also be killed by Dooku, you know, the whole "crushing their necks into smaller pieces and zapping them into DFB (Dooku Fried Boba)"
There's one problem with that.
AotC Obi-Wan stopped Count Dooku's lightning with absolutely no difficulty. Vader is also much stronger than Obi-Wan, so he would be able to hold off more. Tangible, Dooku would have to go all out in order to overpower Vader with lightning - and then there's the possibility that he can't.
He'd have to aim for his exposed areas, I guess.
Even then - if Vader gets close to Dooku - this fight is over. He'd simply break him in half.
And as for the 'crushing neck' thing, Vader seems to be far more skilled in that department, and could simply crush Jango. If he loses to Dooku, Boba could just turn, whirl, and loose a blaster bolt in Dooku's face.
Originally posted by Prodigal Knight
"Sigh" all right, fine maybe. But by TESB, Vader kills Tyrannus.
He kills him but after a long fight.
Anyway, RODV Vader seems like a chump 'cause he is a n00b in his suit which means Dooku could most definitely pwn the crap out of him.
On a closely related sidenote, Hogan pwns them all in fashion sense.
Originally posted by Prodigal Knight
Well since this is RODJ Vader, who's not as powerful as TESB Vader and has yet to master everything, there is a chance that Tyrannus kills Vader and him and Jango pwn Boba.However, DV and Boba could very much run away with this.
the way i see it, RODV is the most powerful form of Vader because its in the expanded universe, and its written in a book and thus, more things can be possible when read in words, rather than looked at on a screen. kinda like comics, just w/o the pictures. kinda explains how som1 w/ 3 mechanical limbs can beat 8 jedi. and i thought it was in RODV he gained more power from when he was Anakin in Ep. 3, and that he didnt get any more powerful after that when the original movies came out, but idunno, im prolly wrong. 😮
Originally posted by Gideon
No, Darthsith was right. RoDV Vader is not the most powerful incarnation. If this is at the beginning of RoDV, then Count Dooku would most likely win without extreme difficulty. If this is at the end, Dooku's chances are still good - but he'd have a hell of a fight.
Originally posted by GideonThat's true, I'd overlooked that. My rebuttal, I guess, is that Dooku looked like he wasn't trying too hard against Obi-Wan, kind of a lazy attack that was.
There's one problem with that.AotC Obi-Wan stopped Count Dooku's lightning with absolutely no difficulty. Vader is also much stronger than Obi-Wan, so he would be able to hold off more. Tangible, Dooku would have to go all out in order to overpower Vader with lightning - and then there's the possibility that he can't.
He'd have to aim for his exposed areas, I guess.
Even then - if Vader gets close to Dooku - this fight is over. He'd simply break him in half.
And as for the 'crushing neck' thing, Vader seems to be far more skilled in that department, and could simply crush Jango. If he loses to Dooku, Boba could just turn, whirl, and loose a blaster bolt in Dooku's face.
Against RODV: I don't know if Vader was as skilled or talented in Force choke at that time as he likely is later, and Dooku did do that little tossed salad move with Obi-Wan in ROTS. Dooku I believe would have to use his superior maneuvaribility to get in from behind or close enough for a quick saber lock or something, while zapping Vader.
And to braz, though it might have been said already, RODV is NOT the strongest form of Vader, TESB is like his pinnacle. And Vader's maximum level of power in his suit is only equivalent to 80% of Palpatine's. And since RODV is not at that full potential...
Originally posted by darthsith19
What? No, lol, Vader at the begining of the book was upset because he was unable to defeat Bol Chatak without getting injured in the process. Bol would get wasted by Dooku without ever coming close to him. Even by the end he was trouble defeating Roan Shryne, whom Dooku would defeat with easy. I'd put Roan on par with AOTC kenobi, perhaps slightly higher, and Dooku wasted AOTC kenobi easily.So no, it wouldn't even be close.
Well, gosh. Let me put it like this, Darthsith:
You aren't a canon authority. Whom you put on par with whom isn't exactly going to hold water unless you have a lot of proof to support you.
Saying "Gosh, well, y'know... I'd put Roan on par with... err... AotC Kenobi!" is like me saying: "Gosh, well, y'know... Coleman Trebor could kick Marka Ragnos's ass in a straight up fight."
You have yet to prove why this is so.
May I remind you that Vader dismantled an entire bridge and essentially kicked Roan's ass without any use of a lightsaber? When has Dooku dismantled his environment and used it to his advantage? I might be wrong (note that!), but I don't ever recall him doing such a thing.
He'd beat RoDV Vader, yes. But if you think that he's just gonna take two swings and the fight'd be over, you're mistaken.
Originally posted by Gideon
When has Dooku dismantled his environment and used it to his advantage? I might be wrong (note that!), but I don't [B]ever recall him doing such a thing. [/B]
Ripping down a solid stone roof and throwing two large generators at Yoda come to mind. Then he tried collapsing that huge pillar on top of Kenobi/Skywalker. There was also the time that he collapsed a steel balcony on top of Obi-wan, effectively eliminating him from the fight. That in itself is evidence enough that Dooku uses the envirnment, and I havent even included any EU.
Originally posted by GideonI can agree with this.
Well, gosh. Let me put it like this, Darthsith:[B]You aren't a canon authority. Whom you put on par with whom isn't exactly going to hold water unless you have a lot of proof to support you.
Saying "Gosh, well, y'know... I'd put Roan on par with... err... AotC Kenobi!" is like me saying: "Gosh, well, y'know... Coleman Trebor could kick Marka Ragnos's ass in a straight up fight."
You have yet to prove why this is so.
May I remind you that Vader dismantled an entire bridge and essentially kicked Roan's ass without any use of a lightsaber? When has Dooku dismantled his environment and used it to his advantage? I might be wrong (note that!), but I don't ever recall him doing such a thing.
He'd beat RoDV Vader, yes. But if you think that he's just gonna take two swings and the fight'd be over, you're mistaken. [/B]
Originally posted by Gideon
Well, gosh. Let me put it like this, Darthsith:[B]You aren't a canon authority. Whom you put on par with whom isn't exactly going to hold water unless you have a lot of proof to support you.
Saying "Gosh, well, y'know... I'd put Roan on par with... err... AotC Kenobi!" is like me saying: "Gosh, well, y'know... Coleman Trebor could kick Marka Ragnos's ass in a straight up fight."
You have yet to prove why this is so.
May I remind you that Vader dismantled an entire bridge and essentially kicked Roan's ass without any use of a lightsaber? When has Dooku dismantled his environment and used it to his advantage? I might be wrong (note that!), but I don't ever recall him doing such a thing.
He'd beat RoDV Vader, yes. But if you think that he's just gonna take two swings and the fight'd be over, you're mistaken. [/B]
Let's go through this.
Ripping down a solid stone roof and throwing two large generators at Yoda come to mind.
Do we need to get into a discussion about the effort that Count Dooku put into this? Need I remind you that Darth Sidious was chucking handfuls of senate pods without any effort. Vader dismantled that bridge effortlessly. Dooku struggled to rip those generators out of their moorings, and the same goes for the roof.
That - and he did this before the initial engagement. He'd certainly have no chance to do it were his opponent on top of him. In the case of Vader, he manages to find ways to do it in the midst of a fight. He merely puts some distance between them.
In the case of Shryne, he was less than five meters away according to the book.
Then he tried collapsing that huge pillar on top of Kenobi/Skywalker.
He ripped the bottom of the pillar's infrastructure. And he did it to Obi-Wan and Anakin - who were nearly unconscious. He didn't attempt to attack Yoda with the environment, is the point. And it wasn't so much of an attack as it was a distraction.
There was also the time that he collapsed a steel balcony on top of Obi-wan, effectively eliminating him from the fight.
This is, actually, the only example worth citing.
That in itself is evidence enough that Dooku uses the envirnment, and I havent even included any EU.
Not like Vader does in the midst of a fight.
Originally posted by darthsith19
Okay, ybut you can't pretend like Roan's that incredible, Dooku pwnd ROTS kenobi while fending off Anakin, do you really think Roan is stronger than ROTS Obi-Wan? Roan isn't good with the Force, Olee Starstone did betetr things than he did with the Force, and she's only a 13 year old padawan. With a saber he was pretty good so I therefor but him slightly above AOTC Kenobi. Look at what Rampant Ox said. Also, before Vader did that he was losing. Losing to someone who's only slightly above avg. plus we don't know if this is Vader at the end of RODV or at the beginning of it.
I'm not pretending that Roan is incredible. Roan's lack of skills with the Force diminished from the status of the Force itself - due to the Emperor and the genocide of the Jedi. To my knowledge Force skills just don't randomly diminish of their own accord, especially when Roan was a Jedi General who saw a lot of wartime.
Secondly, Olee was not "a thirteen year old Padawan." Try higher.
Thirdly, Vader wasn't losing. In fact, if I may quote the book, Roan "owed as much to luck as to skill" for his assault on Vader.
Dooku struggled to rip those generators out of their moorings, and the same goes for the roof.
He ripped the bottom of the pillar's infrastructure. And he did it to Obi-Wan and Anakin - who were nearly unconscious. He didn't attempt to attack Yoda with the environment, is the point.
Roan's lack of skills with the Force diminished from the status of the Force itself - due to the Emperor and the genocide of the Jedi. To my knowledge Force skills just don't randomly diminish of their own accord, especially when Roan was a Jedi General who saw a lot of wartime.
Secondly, Olee was not "a thirteen year old Padawan." Try higher.
Thirdly, Vader wasn't losing. In fact, if I may quote the book, Roan "owed as much to luck as to skill" for his assault on Vader.
No, the generator had more mass, thus required more force to move, and thus had a slower acceleration time. With the ceiling Dooku had to make sure he didn't accidentally collapse the entire hanger by accident, and it still seemed relatively easy.
The generator had more mass than what? As far as the ceiling concerned, where does it state that Dooku was concerned about collapsing the entire thing? Seemed to me that he only took chunks out of it - and small chunks at that considering the many layers of the cave itself.
Didn't he? Dropping the Force on him, ripping objects off the walls and throwing them at Yoda ect. After they started dueling he didn't because his otehr efforts were in vain and he knew that he had a better chance against Yoda in a saber duel than he did in a Force duel.
No, lol. I meant that he did not try to do it against Yoda when they had initiated the saber duel. Even when he had Yoda in a lightsaber lock, he chose to attack Kenobi and Skywalker - not Yoda himself.
Whatever, think what you want, his Force skills still got weaker no matter what the reason was.
I never denied that. You said he was weak in the force. I told you that he wasn't, but his powers diminished. There is a difference.
Really? I thought the cover of the book said she was 13 years old, but maybe not. Tell me then, how old do you think she was?
The cover doesn't say that. She's in her twenties, I believe, as Roan thought that she would end up in a relationship with Filli, I believe.
In the saber duel Roan was winning, hence why he cut Vader many times whiole never getting touched himself, and why Vader had to resort to using the Force to win.
Dude, he wasn't winning the saber duel - and again: "he owed as much luck to skill."
The generator had more mass than what?
As far as the ceiling concerned, where does it state that Dooku was concerned about collapsing the entire thing?
Seemed to me that he only took chunks out of it - and small chunks at that considering the many layers of the cave itself.
No, lol. I meant that he did not try to do it against Yoda when they had initiated the saber duel. Even when he had Yoda in a lightsaber lock, he chose to attack Kenobi and Skywalker - not Yoda himself.
I never denied that. You said he was weak in the force. I told you that he wasn't, but his powers diminished. There is a difference.
The cover doesn't say that. She's in her twenties, I believe, as Roan thought that she would end up in a relationship with Filli, I believe.
Dude, he wasn't winning the saber duel - and again: "he owed as much luck to skill."