Comic books and literature

hey guys, i found this forum while searching for some scans, and obviously noticed that it's really well organized and stuff. Now living in Romania, i didnt have much access to comics, comic books, whatsoever, exept for a bunch that i bought from the states, the hungarian versions (in hungarian of course) of Marvel and DC famous books and some old french and belgian comics. Nontheless, being a comics fan since i was little, and considering the fact that i`m in my final year at college right now (studying foreign languages), i decided to make my final paper out of the history of comics (in general that is, no need for really detailed stuff)

well, this being said, i`m asking you guys for some help if you're willing to. Basically the most important thing would be some argument(s) that comic books belong to literature (even though it's obvious). Also some tips, ideeas how to structure the paper and stuff like that would be well apreciated

well, hope to hear from you soon 😄

well, it depends what you mean

comics are literature in the same way that harlequin romances are. They are mass produced for financial gain, rather than being works of art.

There are obvious exceptions, but for the most part, the experimental and expressive side of comics is lost in the niche industry.

What would be interesting would be a comic that penetrates the mainstream as a respected work of art rather than as just an exceptional work from the genre.

Watchmen's been used on some philosophy courses and the likes... just mumble some stuff about Alan Moore and wave Watchmen around vaguely in the air and you'll get pass no problem...

Anything by Alan Moore can be used. Look at V for Vendetta. Also, many comic books integrate themselves into known literature. Spawn is essentially Faust or Daniel Webster. In Uncanny X-Men, the arc She Lies With Angels is a parallel to Romeo and Juliet. Twilight of the Superheroes is about the fall of Gods. Also, you could write a paper itself on how Superheroes are esentially they mythology of today.

Originally posted by Howard_Jones
Also, you could write a paper itself on how Superheroes are esentially they mythology of today.

thats debateable

for instance, nobody really believes that Spiderman exists, whereas they did for Zeus

Originally posted by inamilist
thats debateable

for instance, nobody really believes that Spiderman exists, whereas they did for Zeus

Well, I know that, but speaking in a figurative sense they are.

Originally posted by Howard_Jones
Well, I know that, but speaking in a figurative sense they are.

i guess so

its not an argument I'd try to make, but you could probably sell it

Originally posted by inamilist
thats debateable

for instance, nobody really believes that Spiderman exists, whereas they did for Zeus

That's more theology ... mythology is stuff like the Minotaur and Medusa

Neil Gaiman is pretty good as well

Originally posted by Scoobless
That's more theology ... mythology is stuff like the Minotaur and Medusa

most of the people who fought those monsters were the hercules's and other spawns of dieties

its really hard to believe in a western modern context, but yes, for the most part, these people would have believed in medusa, if only that they believed that she had once lived and was slayed by whichever of those heroes it was

The only differance between mythology and theology really is culture. Humans stopped propogating one set of beliefs for another, so thus truth was redefined. The same thing will clearly happen to the modern religions if they ever fall from preference.

Originally posted by inamilist
for instance, nobody really believes that Spiderman exists, whereas they did for Zeus

I have just started taking Classical civilisation lessons and my teacher told me that not even that many people at one time believed in Zeus. It wasn't considered a major religion when compared to other religious beliefs across the area at the time, such as Judaism or the like ✅

Last year I used Apocalypse and his Horsemen for a class over Revalation. Got an A. 😄

Originally posted by willRules
I have just started taking Classical civilisation lessons and my teacher told me that not even that many people at one time believed in Zeus. It wasn't considered a major religion when compared to other religious beliefs across the area at the time, such as Judaism or the like ✅

wow

so like the people that built the Temple of Zeus didnt believe he was God?

Originally posted by inamilist
wow

so like the people that built the Temple of Zeus didnt believe he was God?

I'm not entirely sure because I have only just started the subject, but from what I can gather there wasn't really an overwhelming belief in it at one time, or the majority of the population didn't really believe this to be true but did it anyway and just kept to themselves.

But yeah I find it difficult to understand that if many people didn't really believe this then why did they build such grand temples in their honour? I suppose it might be because they didn't really have much alternative 🙂

But that's just what I was told so don't take my word for it, in fact I would be delighted if you could prove otherwise as I take interest in the subject and have only just started studying it. ✅

Originally posted by willRules
I'm not entirely sure because I have only just started the subject, but from what I can gather there wasn't really an overwhelming belief in it at one time, or the majority of the population didn't really believe this to be true but did it anyway and just kept to themselves.

But yeah I find it difficult to understand that if many people didn't really believe this then why did they build such grand temples in their honour? I suppose it might be because they didn't really have much alternative 🙂

But that's just what I was told so don't take my word for it, in fact I would be delighted if you could prove otherwise as I take interest in the subject and have only just started studying it. ✅

i love the subject, but really have little knowledge about it

hmmm, you have a good point though. People might have just done as they were told....

Originally posted by inamilist
i love the subject, but really have little knowledge about it

hmmm, you have a good point though. People might have just done as they were told....

Yes it's quite interesting. In the lessons we are reading Horace's satires and its weird because you have the Greek mythology, the Roman mythology (Which is the greek Gods but with the names changed to what we call our planets) and also Horace keeps referring to the Jewish nation which at the time, the religion rose and fell like a roller coaster, the Bible can confirm this to be true.

And then a few hundred years down the line you get this bloke called Jesus who comes along and turns alot of the religious theories upside and inside out. Before you know it Christianity is persecuted and then a bit later made the official religion by emperor Constantine.

And that's the basics of it as far as I know ✅ It's rather interesting ✅

There's really only 2 "really good" places to start for making a case that comics are a viable art form, on par with nearly any other medium:

1. Watchmen (Moore)

2. Sandman Series (Gaiman)

...there's others, but those are the big ones.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
There's really only 2 "really good" places to start for making a case that comics are a viable art form, on par with nearly any other medium:

1. Watchmen (Moore)

2. Sandman Series (Gaiman)

...there's others, but those are the big ones.

You forgot V for Vendetta because of it's portrayal of Anarchy, and Twilight of the Superheroes on Fallen Gods. 😄

Originally posted by Howard_Jones
You forgot V for Vendetta because of it's portrayal of Anarchy, and Twilight of the Superheroes on Fallen Gods. 😄

Nah. I agree it's very good, but Watchmen is really his best work, both in critical acclaim and also in my personal opinion.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Nah. I agree it's very good, but Watchmen is really his best work, both in critical acclaim and also in my personal opinion.

No argument there. I'm just saying that because of it's portrayal of Anarchism and symbolism to the general public. One of my sociology teachers during my sophomore year of college called it one of the best literary examples out there.