This is never going to end...
The old caps aren't congruent. It's almost impossible to find 4 characters that meet all those variant levels in each specific aspect of ability. There's always a catch. Somone could be around Dr. Light in energy manipulation but have light speed flight which would equal banning. Somone could be not as strong as Namor but more durable and be banned.
The composite cap is more logical.
It's your decision, of course, but I personally have to say these fluctuating caps are the cause of all the headaches. Everyone has different interpretations of what each character that is the embodiment of a specific cap is capable of.
All KMC bullshit (flying tables) aside, everyone knows what Apocalypse is capable of, and he alone embodies all of the caps. If we keep every pick under him it takes away a lot of guess work.
I'd rather keep the old caps, because it REQUIRES guess work. 2nd, if we raise the caps to sub-apoc, then it's not an iron man level tournament anymore. However, that's an interesting idea for a tournament. Next time. But this one will stay in the old caps. the problem last time was BW and others trying to cheat.
there is no flight speed cap, just the speed cap.
erm.
so . . . after all that . . . nothing has changed? ❌
we are -- basically -- doing this all over again because . . . you didn't like a couple of the guys who were allowed in even though they weren't THAT far above (except MAYBE engineer . . .) the caps?
ill is exactly correct -- the caps ARE the problem. how do we compare versatility, for example? ironman>vision? and if one character exceeds a single cap, is he then illegal entirely? what about neutering guys? who from the last draft are you planning to ban?
all the same problems exist, except now you say you'll be more stringent with these very fluid caps. that's a bit of a paradox. i never really saw a problem with 99% of the picks last time rd. too many people last time became too concerned that they couldn't win because someone had a character who MAY HAVE BEEN a little above a cap or 2.
suck it up and learn to debate. again, the differences were NOT so great that a good debater could not have overcome them.
meh, i like you tp, and wish you well, but i think i'll sit this one out.
ps--there is no question at all that ironman could give apoc a battle. he's beaten HERALDS. no doubt he gives apoc hassles.
Leo makes valid points. But my counter-problem (which is a problem for many teams) is that we were planning for the lower, Iron Man, level. A few teams want the Apoc limit because the picks they wanted were OVER the current caps.
But the ones of us who remained legal would get punished by a cap increase....my team, for example, would be thrown for a loop and would likely have to drop out. Is this punishment really needed for participants who played by the rules from the beginning?
Increase to Apoc = me dropping out. I can't speak for my team, but they wouldn't be happy either. As it is, I'm likely done anyway, but the only way I'll even consider it is if the caps stay the same....flawed or not.
Yeah I'm with Leo I think I may be rolling out of this one.
I was hoping to get into a quick tourny, that could be done quickly but still with a fun feel. I think this tourny has kind of gotten away fro mthat and those invloved will have to be i nfor the long haul.
I think I'll wait for the tourney I was planning on running.
Originally posted by leonidas
erm.so . . . after all that . . . nothing has changed? ❌
we are -- basically -- doing this all over again because . . . you didn't like a couple of the guys who were allowed in even though they weren't THAT far above (except MAYBE engineer . . .) the caps?
ill is exactly correct -- the caps ARE the problem. how do we compare versatility, for example? ironman>vision? and if one character exceeds a single cap, is he then illegal entirely? what about neutering guys? who from the last draft are you planning to ban?
all the same problems exist, except now you say you'll be more stringent with these very fluid caps. that's a bit of a paradox. i never really saw a problem with 99% of the picks last time rd. too many people last time became too concerned that they couldn't win because someone had a character who MAY HAVE BEEN a little above a cap or 2.
suck it up and learn to debate. again, the differences were NOT so great that a good debater could not have overcome them.
meh, i like you tp, and wish you well, but i think i'll sit this one out.
ps--there is no question at all that ironman could give apoc a battle. he's beaten HERALDS. no doubt he gives apoc hassles.
I'm gone for a bit and look what happens 🙄
Look people the caps should be there as guidelines as th whatthe power level of a person should be in this tournament not what they have to be.
For example Doom is arguably> Ironman
but I'd allow him in this tourney
no one drafted so far is herald level
some of them may ne a little bit more pwoerful than Ironman
but none of the characters would win more than6-7/10 against someone like namor
stop complainig peple jeez 🙄
......Im so f*cking confused. Whats going on now?
Why not take in both Digi/Leo's suggestions?
Leo thinks the caps are wack, but he was willing to take in almost everyone except Engineer (and if she goes, Box should as well. He can do almost everything she can. Period).
Others such as Superboy/Captain Marvel can be decided by others, but SB does have an S-shield 😬
Reinstate Danger, and Cyborg Guardian for our team. He only has one feat that even suggests him being over and it was a weakened non-powered galactus. Even Leo, who I have agreed with for almost everything he has said, didnt consider him to be over and was fine with it
Other than that let everyone keep their picks. Lets just keep this going. No point re-doing everything because we tried to get Engineer (only because Box was let in, and well, they = eachother dammit. He can do anything she can do, and even create atomic blasts) Plus for anyone who cares, she has at least one very exploitable weakness. Look it up 😬
We should be on round 3, and maybe a few picks here and there can be taken out and people can repick. I feel especially bad for Digi since he went and bought 50+ issues. For his sake, lets just GO!
Originally posted by Blair Wind
......Im so f*cking confused. Whats going on now?Why not take in both Digi/Leo's suggestions?
Leo thinks the caps are wack, but he was willing to take in almost everyone except Engineer (and if she goes, Box should as well. He can do almost everything she can. Period).
Others such as Superboy/Captain Marvel can be decided by others, but SB does have an S-shield 😬
Reinstate Danger, and Cyborg Guardian for our team. He only has one feat that even suggests him being over and it was a weakened non-powered galactus. Even Leo, who I have agreed with for almost everything he has said, didnt consider him to be over and was fine with it
Other than that let everyone keep their picks. Lets just keep this going. No point re-doing everything because we tried to get Engineer (only because Box was let in, and well, they = eachother dammit. He can do anything she can do, and even create atomic blasts) Plus for anyone who cares, she has at least one [b]very
exploitable weakness. Look it up 😬We should be on round 3, and maybe a few picks here and there can be taken out and people can repick. I feel especially bad for Digi since he went and bought 50+ issues. For his sake, lets just GO! [/B]
Can I have Winter the only problem anyone had was her flightspeed. Mah vells is interplanetary.
🙂
-FO!!
Originally posted by TricksterPriest
I don't care if it's annoying. We're doing a complete redraft. But I'll wait till sunday or monday before I restart it. And judging by the time, DL's time is up.
So, with some regret, and considerable annoyance, I'm resigning from the tournament and retaking my place as host.Redraft starts sunday or monday, whichever is better. And unlike DL, I'm going to be alot stricter on the caps. I can wait till tuesday if absolutely needed, but sunday at the bare minimum. I'm also gonna look over the rules and see if I we missed any loopholes.
Don't be a dick, TP.
Just toss out Engineer, and we'll be fine.
We're taking a week or two to give people time to fix their ideas. Same caps and limits. We are not changing from an IM level tournament. And this time, I'll have 3 judges helping me with the questionable picks. Galan, Nataku, and a third judge yet to be determined.
Edit: I'm tossing MJ, Guardian and Engineer and Mar-vel. Still fine? If yes, then ok, we'll go from there. If no, then redraft.