Quasar vs. Wonder Woman

Originally posted by complexbrother
Quasar . that was pure PIS when she broke his construct. when in his book the majority of the heroes present couldn't break though his dome construct to stop him from using the ultimate nullifier.

the roster that was trying to break through was ..

herculese
Thor,
Photon,
Captain America,
Colosus
Rogue
Jean Grey,
Vision
Human Torch
She Hulk
Wolverine,
Wonder Man
Sasquash
James Proudstar

Slight correction, Photon was not on the team.

Anyway, I give the fight to Wonder Woman, in my opinion her speed gives her the win.

Now keep in mind that Quasar could create something that could hold Diana if given time.

Originally posted by Tazer
Yo.

&

throughout just about every appearance he's ever been in he travelled FAR, [B]FAR UNDER l-speed; his best/fastest mode of travel was Q-jumping.

if it takes him 2 hours to get from NYC to Cali, then yea he flies fast, but no faster than a commuter jet.

which IMNSHO is pretty damn slow.

Tazer [/B]

This won't help him beat Wonder Woman. Just sayin'.

Yo.

Originally posted by Priest
I'm pretty sure that was a rookie Quasar that fought absorbing man, never the less Quasar did manage to pull off the win even after absorbing man absorbed the properties of the Q Bands.

umm, it was BECAUSE of Creel mimicking the QBs that he managed to win there, not despite it.

Originally posted by Priest
Im not sure wat incident you mentioned about with the 3 imperial Guard members breaking Q's contruct :/ BUT he was still able to make a contruct that sheild him from the whole guard including Gladiator for a while.
http://img510.imageshack.us/my.php?image=quasar032126xd.jpg

U dont have the later pages from that story which show that, in act, there was really only *3* IG-members there; all of the rest were really illusions.

Originally posted by Priest
yeah Nefaria is pretty uber, he took on the entire Avengers imo, The Count>>Diana

considering the team he fought, I think Diana could do the same

Originally posted by Priest
Quasar constructs have been broken by lesser force that can be produced by Diana, but his shields and constructs have a pretty good track record of being un-broken...

sure, in giant group showing and in his own book. but against top-tiers solo he doesnt fare anywhere near as well, especially if its a story NOT written by Gruenwald.

Originally posted by Priest
he was able to hold Hercules withing his constructs on more than one occasion, and i believe their is a minimal margin difference in strength between Herc and WW imo..

in that example shown earlier its not like we see Herc make any effort to try and break free, and if Thor can break a construct w/his bare hands (done in that same story) then I dont see Herc being unable to if he wanted to.

Originally posted by Priest
Elvis several times has been known to successfully make constructs strong enough to even withstand Galactus and other uber cosmics....

that they withstood a SINGLE hit, sure. but in that Galactus showing IIRC we also saw some being eliminated too IIRC.

and lets be honest a sec: Galactus was really taking him serious, now was he?

Originally posted by Priest
I could go on and list many examples of being that are more powerful than Dina that failed to bipass the contructs.

that would be a VERY small list.

Originally posted by Priest
I never seen Diana break though experienced GL's constructs like Hal which leads me to believe that Q constructs would hold up to Diana more time than not. Diana is strong but she not at the same level as Thor/Superman/Gladiator/Nefaria.

Q man for the win.

fair enuff on who U like to win, but for the record how many times have U seen Diana go up against *any* GL really??

Originally posted by Priest
yo taz, thought u ment Nefaria instead of Nefarius.

nope

Tazer

Yo.

Originally posted by Acrosurge
Yeah, but then Gladiator took a couple minutes to travel a similar distance and he has been shown to be far, far faster. I mentioned two examples of Quasar speed: ground to orbit in seconds and chasing Silver Surfer through an asteroid field. The two hour, continental flight should be seen as a low showing, as opposed to his top flight speed, especially when even the lame Power Grid readings list him as having warp speed (which, obviously isn't usable in an atmosphere, but he is capable of it).

This won't help him beat Wonder Woman. Just sayin'.

but the diff 'tween Glads & Elvis is that it SHOULD only take him a small fraction of time to go the same distance; Elvis for the most part has never been painted as a srp-fast flyer. hell, when he was trapped in the New Universe it took him something like 8hrs to go from here to the moon, and in his origin story it took him FOUR YEARS to fly to Neptune/Uranus (forgot which it was).......his long-as-hell flight to Cali was FAR from a "low showing" and more like a "typical depiction".

and when was he chasing Norrin thru an asteroid field?? was it Star Masters??

Tazer

Originally posted by Tazer
Yo.

but the diff 'tween Glads & Elvis is that it SHOULD only take him a small fraction of time to go the same distance; Elvis for the most part has never been painted as a srp-fast flyer. hell, when he was trapped in the New Universe it took him something like 8hrs to go from here to the moon, and in his origin story it took him FOUR YEARS to fly to Neptune/Uranus (forgot which it was).......his long-as-hell flight to Cali was FAR from a "low showing" and more like a "typical depiction".

and when was he chasing Norrin thru an asteroid field?? was it Star Masters??

Tazer

As for the Surfer chase, it is from Cosmic Powers Unlimited and scans can be found here.

http://img265.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cospowunlim1996005038ul.jpg

http://img265.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cospowunlim1996005049gf.jpg

Now, I don't know how fast Surfer was traveling through that field, but it wouldn't make much sense for him to be doing a mere 700 mph, especially if he much wanted to be rid of Quasar.

Now, what are we to do with Quasar's latest flight speed showing in Annihilation? Should we throw it away just because he had slow showings early in his career? He is supposed to be a universal guardian, yes? It seems odd that a universal guardian be limited to Mach 1 speeds or less. That, and his Marvel.com bio outright states that he can fly faster than light. There's proof from the recent comics, logic, and Marvel's official bio all in one.

Yo.

Originally posted by Acrosurge
I'm familiar with his origin story. He was pretty new with the Q-bands then. Wasn't it heavily suggested he would get gain more powers? 8 hrs to the moon is still much faster than 2 hrs continental. The same is true of a four year trip to Uranus (he'd need to travel at an average speed of 50,000 miles per hour).

he had the QBs for quite some time b4 he set off on his 4yr trip, so I wouldnt say he was "new" to having them.

also, I dont remember him gaining more powers, inasmuch as he'd learn how to get more usages outta the QBs.

Originally posted by Acrosurge
As for the Surfer chase, it is from Cosmic Powers Unlimited and scans can be found here.

http://img265.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cospowunlim1996005038ul.jpg

http://img265.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cospowunlim1996005049gf.jpg

Now, I don't know how fast Surfer was traveling through that field, but it wouldn't make much sense for him to be doing a mere 700 mph, especially if he much wanted to be rid of Quasar.

neither can U say they were doing 186,000 mps (approx speed of light), right? the only thing that that scene really shows is that Quasar doesnt have SS's manueverability

Originally posted by Acrosurge
Now, what are we to do with Quasar's latest flight speed showing in Annihilation? Should we throw it away just because he had slow showings early in his career? He is supposed to be a universal guardian, yes? It seems odd that a universal guardian be limited to Mach 1 speeds or less. That, and his Marvel.com bio outright states that he can fly faster than light. There's proof from the recent comics, logic, and Marvel's official bio all in one.

as his *simgle greatest* example of flight, Id say thaqt it would/should be aplied to his average showing, rather than it being the sole marker by which we judge his ability to travel.

Tazer

Originally posted by Tazer
Yo.

but the diff 'tween Glads & Elvis is that it SHOULD only take him a small fraction of time to go the same distance; Elvis for the most part has never been painted as a srp-fast flyer. hell, when he was trapped in the New Universe it took him something like 8hrs to go from here to the moon, and in his origin story it took him FOUR YEARS to fly to Neptune/Uranus (forgot which it was).......his long-as-hell flight to Cali was FAR from a "low showing" and more like a "typical depiction".

Tazer

When he flew to the moon in the NU he stated he was cut off from the Quantum Zone in that universe and therefore couldn't draw any of its power and was a lot slower than usual.

In Avengers Annual #18 which takes place earlier Captain America times Quasar and Q was able to fly to the moon AND back in 9 minutes and 57 seconds then fight Firelord to a draw straight after.

Originally posted by Tazer
Yo.

he had the QBs for quite some time b4 he set off on his 4yr trip, so I wouldnt say he was "new" to having them.

also, I dont remember him gaining more powers, inasmuch as he'd learn how to get more usages outta the QBs.

as his *simgle greatest* example of flight, Id say thaqt it would/should be aplied to his average showing, rather than it being the sole marker by which we judge his ability to travel.

Tazer

Quasar seemed to learn about and improve his powers far more in the period after the start of his own mag than he did in the years before, e.g he hadn't learned how to quantum jump before that, or how to block psionics, create atmosphere etc. I'm not sure when he started energy leeching.

In #2 he still needed 4 years and stasis to reach Uranus, while not long after he could jump a trip like that instantaneously. Even without the jump at his later straight flight speed above he could have reached Uranus in a matter of weeks, not 4 years, so his flight speed definitely improved by orders of magnitude. His other power likewise seemed to improve.

His constructs were always a matter of concentration. A quick effort could be broken by mid-levellers, a bit more effort could protect him from the likes of Watchers, the Stranger, and Galactus, and hold 100-tonners for a while.

quasar is just above ww. its the way it is.

Originally posted by basilisk
When he flew to the moon in the NU he stated he was cut off from the Quantum Zone in that universe and therefore couldn't draw any of its power and was a lot slower than usual.

In Avengers Annual #18 which takes place earlier Captain America times Quasar and Q was able to fly to the moon AND back in 9 minutes and 57 seconds then fight Firelord to a draw straight after.

Quasar seemed to learn about and improve his powers far more in the period after the start of his own mag than he did in the years before, e.g he hadn't learned how to quantum jump before that, or how to block psionics, create atmosphere etc. I'm not sure when he started energy leeching.

In #2 he still needed 4 years and stasis to reach Uranus, while not long after he could jump a trip like that instantaneously. Even without the jump at his later straight flight speed above he could have reached Uranus in a matter of weeks, not 4 years, so his flight speed definitely improved by orders of magnitude. His other power likewise seemed to improve.

His constructs were always a matter of concentration. A quick effort could be broken by mid-levellers, a bit more effort could protect him from the likes of Watchers, the Stranger, and Galactus, and hold 100-tonners for a while.

Yo.

Originally posted by basilisk
When he flew to the moon in the NU he stated he was cut off from the Quantum Zone in that universe and therefore couldn't draw any of its power and was a lot slower than usual.

he did say he wasnt able to access Infinity, however no mention was made of that causing him to be *any slower* than normal.

it also certainly didnt stop him from creating those 15-something giant letters in the sky calling for Captain Manhattan.

Originally posted by basilisk
In Avengers Annual #18 which takes place earlier Captain America times Quasar and Q was able to fly to the moon AND back in 9 minutes and 57 seconds then fight Firelord to a draw straight after.

with a headache too I might add, but seeing as how in his own book it took him the times given to go the distances stated, more than likely happend was he flew up into the upper atmosphere then Q-jumped to Moon & back.

Originally posted by basilisk
Quasar seemed to learn about and improve his powers far more in the period after the start of his own mag than he did in the years before, e.g he hadn't learned how to quantum jump before that, or how to block psionics, create atmosphere etc. I'm not sure when he started energy leeching.

well, he didnt know how to do any of that due to him not having yet met Eon. which is understandable.

Originally posted by basilisk
In #2 he still needed 4 years and stasis to reach Uranus, while not long after he could jump a trip like that instantaneously. Even without the jump at his later straight flight speed above he could have reached Uranus in a matter of weeks, not 4 years, so his flight speed definitely improved by orders of magnitude. His other power likewise seemed to improve.

I dont remember that there was any indication of his flight speed being increased by THAT much after he met Eon (even if it was, I doubt it wouldve been too explicit); I'll have to go back & re-read that ish.

Originally posted by basilisk
His constructs were always a matter of concentration. A quick effort could be broken by mid-levellers, a bit more effort could protect him from the likes of Watchers, the Stranger, and Galactus, and hold 100-tonners for a while.

in most of his showings his concentration was never much of anything to be concerned about beyond coming up with the idea to do *watever*. and as for Watchers its not like that 1 he fought actually did much of anything for HIM to protect against, nor did Stranger as I recall.

so saying that is quite presumptous.

Tazer

Originally posted by Tazer

he did say he wasnt able to access Infinity, however no mention was made of that causing him to be *any slower* than normal.

it also certainly didnt stop him from creating those 15-something giant letters in the sky calling for Captain Manhattan.

Tazer

Yes, he did say he was cut off from Epoch in the NU. Before that he also noticed he couldn't open a quantum portal to jump. I don't have scans, but the comic goes like this: he says while flying to the moon:
"Quantum bands acting sluggishly. Why can't I get these darn things to go any faster?..." So yes, he does note that he is slower than normal. Then he answers his own question:
"Wait I know, because I'm cut off from the quantum zone -- the source of my power. I'm cruising on the power I happened to have in my bands at the time I was blasted here. And when that's gone --?"

Also since it states it takes him "several" hours to reach the moon at that speed it is far slower than his 5 min speed in the annual a few years earlier.

After he does the giant letters he says "After this, better conserve all the energy I can.. 'cause once it goes, it's gone."

Originally posted by Tazer

with a headache too I might add, but seeing as how in his own book it took him the times given to go the distances stated, more than likely happend was he flew up into the upper atmosphere then Q-jumped to Moon & back.

Tazer

Again, no scans but in the backup story Quasar explains to Cap how he can fly using gravitons, and Cap says "How fast?"
Q: "I'm not sure. I have different speeds in an atmosphere than in space. I don't want to break the sound barrier while I'm near buildings or people."
Cap: "Let's devise a test. I want you to fly as far from here as you can in five minutes grab something... a clump of dirt or a rock, and head back, ready?"
Cap is suprised when Q returns in 9'57'' with a rock from the Sea of Tranquility.

So I'm fairly sure he didn't quantum jump, since
a) it would make no sense, since Cap wanted to test his flight speed not teleportation and it goes against the whole point of the test.
b) if he did quantum jump, then 9'57'' would be enough time for Q to hop to the Andromeda galaxy, discuss the local weather with a Skrull, and hop back.

Originally posted by Tazer

well, he didnt know how to do any of that due to him not having yet met Eon. which is understandable.

Tazer

Yes, he learned a few completely new powers shortly after meeting Epoch that he didn't learn in his years at SHIELD/PP etc.

Originally posted by Tazer

I dont remember that there was any indication of his flight speed being increased by THAT much after he met Eon (even if it was, I doubt it wouldve been too explicit); I'll have to go back & re-read that ish.

Tazer

Well, going from taking 4 years to fly to Uranus then being able to fly to the moon in under 5 min is certainly one indication, since the second feat is a big improvement on the first. There may be others. Frankly, most of his powers seemed a lot weaker in his early days.

Originally posted by Tazer

in most of his showings his concentration was never much of anything to be concerned about beyond coming up with the idea to do *watever*. and as for Watchers its not like that 1 he fought actually did much of anything for HIM to protect against, nor did Stranger as I recall.

so saying that is quite presumptous.

Tazer

I should clarify that I meant the concentration to build the initial construct, not to actively maintain it, since his constructs seemed to be "fire-and-forget" and did not need to be actively maintained once created. He would occasionally mention making "quick shields", "reinforced shields", "my strongest shield" etc so there must be some difference involved.

I agree the fight with the rogue Watcher was quick, but his energy aura protected him from a massive Watcher-punch that was too fast to see (after W charged up with "off-the-scale" energy to do it), something that surely must be >> class 100. There was also some weird phase energy attack, not sure what it was supposed to achieve, but it didn't hurt him. Then Q used the bands to disrupt the Watcher's energy form, force him back to normal, then Q-punch him. Q was actually on the attack more than defence.

You're right, Overmind was the other guy he fought in that story not Stranger. But Q's shields did hold off a few Galactus attacks in the FF (and many other powerful beings over the years).

Anyway, not trying to be picky or anything, it's just that I had a lot of those Quasar issues (still have some) and remember some of these things.

bumprav

Current Quasar may win 2
Classic Quasar wins 5/10

Quasar should never lose this battle

Quasar wins this.

Still Q.