The Offical Prophecy Discussion Thread · Harry Potter

The Phantom Angel of Music

The Offical Prophecy Discussion Thread

This thread is here purely to discuss the Prophecy and find out all we can about it and what it means and what effects it might have had throughout the books and what effects it might have in the upcoming books.

Now, something interesting came to me while I was finishing rereading book 1. Voldemort isn't really alive during this time, yes? But in a sense, he wasn't either throughout the rests of the books, is he? Yes, he sure does have a body. But is he really alive alive? Especially with ones soul in several places. Remember, one cannot live while the other is still alive. The reason his spell backfired on his first attempt to kill Harry (when he was a baby)? A sort of time limit? One was alive while the other was, but maybe there is a set amount of time this is allowed. And time was up and just as he performed his spell, it messed up. Thus, as DD says in book 1, US, page 298, Voldemort isn't really alive. And thus the prophecy is being fulfulled as we speak. Voldemort is not really alive because the other is. But if this is true, here is my other curiousity. DD says Voldemort cannot die because he is not truly alive. And if this is true, how can Harry kill Voldemort. Will destroying the horcruxes make Voldemort, the final part of his soul, whole and alive? Thus when they face it is time for one to die while the other lives? Maybe Voldemort had this all planned out with the prophecy, the reason why he made horcruxes in the first place. Which is driving me away from what I said earlier. If he made the horcruxes after finding out the prophecy, he thus wasn't truly alive then. Probably when Harry was born this happened. And thus, when Voldemort tried killing Harry as a baby it didn't work because he wasn't alive, and perhaps one needs to be alive, so he couldn't kill the boy and thus it backfired... theories, theories, theories...

What do you guys think?

Biscuit yummy!

when was the prophecy made? do we know if it was before or after harry was born? before or after the night harry got his scar?

The Phantom Angel of Music

Originally posted by Biscuit
when was the prophecy made? do we know if it was before or after harry was born? before or after the night harry got his scar?

Before. That's why Voldemort went to kill Harry.

Biscuit yummy!

from wikipedia -
When Dumbledore interviewed Sybill Trelawney for the Divination post sixteen years ago at the Hog's Head Inn in Hogsmeade, she unknowingly lapsed into a trance and prophesied that:

"The one with the power to vanquish the Dark Lord approaches...born to those who have thrice defied him, born as the seventh month dies...and the Dark Lord will mark him as his equal, but he will have power the Dark Lord knows not...and either must die at the hand of the other for neither can live while the other survives...the one with the power to vanquish the Dark Lord will be born as the seventh month dies..."

This was interpreted to mean that Voldemort would kill either Harry or Neville Longbottom who were both born at the end of July, or one of them would kill him. However, Voldemort only heard part of the prophecy, as his spy, who was eavesdropping on the conversation between Trelawney and Dumbledore, was thrown out before Trelawney completed the prediction. (The eavesdropper is later identified in Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince.) After Voldemort attacked baby Harry, the latter part of the prophecy was realised, and Harry, not Neville, became his foe and would kill, or be killed by, him. Had Voldemort heard the entire prophecy, he would have known that by attacking Harry he would transfer some of his own powers to him.

Biscuit yummy!

so...the prophecy was made before harry was born, voldemort heard the first bit of it and went to kill harry to stop harry killing him, but his spell backfired and he transferred some of his power to harry thus 'marking him as his equal' (so we know its harry not neville that the rest of the prophecy applies to).

as for why the spell backfired, i seem to remember someone, perhaps dumbledore, saying that it was because his mother died to save him...?
BUT
voldemort must have made the horcruxes before this and thats why he didnt die completely, so maybe thats why he couldn't kill harry - because his soul was in seven pieces so his power was not as strong...

the prophecy also says 'born to those who have thrice defied him'...when were the three times that lilly and james defied voldemort???

and who was the eavesdropper in the Hogs Head who heard the prophecy? we are told in the half blood prince but i cant remember...

also the way the prophecy is worded...it says 'neither can live while the other survives'... well living and surviving are not the same thing, so maybe this means something different to what we first think...