your right adarksidejedi.
And the end of the day if they married jack and liz off, it would be out of BOTH of their characters to do so 🙂
Jack and liz both seek freedom.
Therefore, if they got married to eachother then they wouldn't exactly be free...
Whereas, if they were simple lovers/parters/knew there was something sexually attactive about eachother then they would still have the freedom that they want, and yet know that they do indeed belong to the other 🙂
I know Jack seeks freedom, but where is it specifically stated that Elizabeth also seeks freedom, or at least freedom as a pirate?
Also, what are the chances that a Jack and Elizabeth relationship would actually last, since they are both so freedom-loving? Would that put their relationship at risk, and if it would, who do you suspect would wander first?
Originally posted by Surreal_44
She's saying that the order of the film is this:1. The battle ends.
2. Will and Liz say good-bye. So sad, what a bummer.
3. Jack and Liz have thier little exchange of "It would never have....etc" scene.
4. Liz smiles, like she knows that it COULD work between them, especially since there's no Will visible in that scene.
5. Jack says goodbye to Gibbs in Tortuga.
I assume that from then on it's assumed that Jack goes searching for Elizabeth, or in a zippy and unexpected plot twist, she is standing behind Jack in Tortuga, they'll laugh together at Jack's silliness at the thought that he would ever have gone anywhere with the Strumpets, and they share a kiss right there.
Am I close? 😉
you did not understand me,ladies??? 😆 hah so sorry next time i will be trying to write more understandable 😄
Surreal you mean they (JL) share a kiss right there in Tortuga?? jack and liz???Everything you wrote was it...it´s what i generally wanted to say...but the kiss... i didn´t mean a kiss...
i wrote these things you, Surreal, explained but i didn´t give it ending...Coz it´s the thing i don´t know at all but i was trying to say something like W/L scene isn´t the very end-by my opinion... Because somehow i don´t think she would be smiling at Jack after his little sentence about them, possibly, to be together, with the idea Will is still here for her and loves her....that´s it, i think...
Now...do you understand???Or should i just explain more??? 🙂 just tell me 🙂
"Jack and liz both seek freedom.
Therefore, if they got married to eachother then they wouldn't exactly be free...
Whereas, if they were simple lovers/parters/knew there was something sexually attactive about eachother then they would still have the freedom that they want, and yet know that they do indeed belong to the other"--------T. Maria
I have to respectfully disagree with you here, T. Maria. I think Jack and Liz are both pragmatic enough to know that the kind of unmarried relationship you're talking about (basically a common-law marriage) would be pretty much the same thing as a legitimate marriage. I think it would be out of character for them to marry right away, but after a few years of being together, I think they would be more open to it.
Liz may long for freedom, but she also longs for intimacy. She was willing to marry Will, so if she does in fact end up with Jack, she would probably want to marry him.
Jack, I can see how people would think he would cheat on her, but you also have to remember he doesn't let go of things. If you think about it, he can actually commit to things easily. Think about it. He managed to get a career in the EITC, so he can hold a steady job. He might have held onto it a lot longer if a shipload of slaves hadn't changed his mind. Fast forward a few years. Jack spends TEN YEARS looking for the same ship. He's been "in the market" for it for 10 years. I know it's a ship and not a person, but it shows resolve, dedication, and perseverance. Ok? If you're in a J/E mood, which I nearly always am, then you'll remember that the girl he couldn't get out of his head had been separated from him for a whole year. Yet he can't forget her or stop wanting her.
I think it is in character that in time (not right away) they could marry and still consider themselves free. An unmarried relationship where they live together, fight together, all of that, is pretty much marriage without all the frills.
that was beautifully said willofthewisp 🙂 ...Yeah that´s totally true...everything you said I must agree...
And Jack was kind of faith whole year and he even wasn´t with her...Does this mean he would cheat her after he will FINALLY stand a chance to have her by his side???...i doubt...It would be amazing if AWE was about to tell us that freedom does not have to mean ONLY freedom as being free that you can be free with one you love....how nice idea 🙂
But well...i know probably in our dreams only...but i still hope they somehow get together they deserve it,we ALL deserve it!!! 🙂
Let´s hope SPARRABETH ALL THE WAY 🙂
Ah, the kiss was me own special touch to the scene, Jacksweet. I knew you didn't have Jack and Liz kiss, but I added it in because I assume that's what would happen after Jack and Liz reunited. 😛
ETA: Just a little nit-pick, but, if Jack has been thinking about Elizabeth ALL YEAR, why didn't he recognize her on the docks? Her voice wasn't that disguised. 😛
Originally posted by Surreal_44
Ah, the kiss was me own special touch to the scene, Jacksweet. I knew you didn't have Jack and Liz kiss, but I added it in because I assume that's what would happen after Jack and Liz reunited. 😛ETA: Just a little nit-pick, but, if Jack has been thinking about Elizabeth ALL YEAR, why didn't he recognize her on the docks? Her voice wasn't that disguised. 😛
lmao! 😄
ok im stumped on that one 🙂
Willo, yeah i actually agree with your comments, ive seen that im actually talking utter crap, as i tend to do sometimes 🙂
REMEMBER THOUGH:
At the end of DMC, jacks exact words were;
"Shes only a ship, mate"
This to me indicates a change in him.
What kind of change, im not so sure. But i'll bet all that will be figured out by AWE 🙂
That's very true, Iheartpocky. Along with that, it's the same logic why people don't get the fact that Clark Kent is Superman. If you aren't looking for a person, would you really notice them in a crowd? Jack is not expecting her.
I do like the follow-up question, Surreal. You and your eye for detail. However, even T&T admit in the director's commentary that Liz has been playing into Jack's thoughts for an entire year. And since she is on his mind that makes the compass move, it opposes his other want, which is to save himself from Davy Jones. Self-preservation is a pretty powerful thing and few things can override it. Love is one of them, although at that point, I wouldn't call Jack's feelings love. Just getting there.
Originally posted by willofthewisp
That's very true, Iheartpocky. Along with that, it's the same logic why people don't get the fact that Clark Kent is Superman. If you aren't looking for a person, would you really notice them in a crowd? Jack is not expecting her.I do like the follow-up question, Surreal. You and your eye for detail. However, even T&T admit in the director's commentary that Liz has been playing into Jack's thoughts for an entire year. And since she is on his mind that makes the compass move, it opposes his other want, which is to save himself from Davy Jones. Self-preservation is a pretty powerful thing and few things can override it. Love is one of them, although at that point, I wouldn't call Jack's feelings love. Just getting there.
I've said this before, too, willo..but Surreal always tells me I'm missing other points of the plot...but sorry, DMC was promoted as Jack having a debt to pay to Davy Jones..his soul...and how can he save his soul...by using that stupid compass to lead him to the chest...which is what he should want most in this world because...if Jack wanted to live and escape Davy most of all...then why wasn't the compass working for him..gahhhhaggrrrrr...this is soo frutrationg...t and t what have you done to me, to jack to all of us....Jack's compass wasn't working cuz Elziabeth was playing into his thoughts...and that's why Jack's compass wasn't working..and from the clips in AWE it appears his compass still isn't working.....
Lovethemtigers, the compass in itself is confusing and sucks and is open to interpretation, but the writers blatantly say that the compass wavers to Elizabeth and only wavers back because Jack does not want to want her. She complicates his life, probably doesn't want him (in his mind), and isn't his type (or so he thinks). It's a huge plot turn that the compass doesn't work for him. There would be no reason in the world for him to interact again with Will and/or Liz if it worked for him. There would be no story.
Now, I'll admit. It doesn't always point to her. It wavers. In fact the writers say that if it pointed to her all the time, Jack wouldn't be surprised to see her in Tortuga. But he was. But it points to her enough that it vexes him.
Agreed! I always thought that the compass points to variouse places for Jack. It points to Elizabeth at times but then cause Jack wants to NOT want her the most sometimes it points to the furthest point from portroyal. make sense? (I think u can most want to NOT want right?)
Then at times when his selfish side kicks in it points to what he NEEDS but than it points back to PortRoyal or whatever. Just my thought.
So I think Jack was pretty surprised. I agree with willo but T&T DID confirm that even in the bar scene the compass WAS pointing to Elizabeth and so it moves around more than ever making Jack more confused. Savvy?!
As for Jack not recognizing her. hmmm. I think when u think about someone for a YEAR u start thinking that ur paranoid even if u DO see that person but my honest opinion is that while this scene IS telling for the characters this whole Jack not recognizing Liz thing?
It's more plot neccessary than character telling . It was there so it could lead to all those great entertaining lines. "Hide the rum!" "My first and only love is the sea!"
I know T&T rarely do anything without being true to the characters but they NEED to make those complications. YES we JE shippers do take everything as a sign but I personally agree that maybe SOMETIMES it's more about entertainment than the characters.
Sorry rambled on again. I'll stop now 😄
"So I think Jack was pretty surprised. I agree with willo but T&T DID confirm that even in the bar scene the compass WAS pointing to Elizabeth and so it moves around more than ever making Jack more confused. Savvy?!"---------tee pirategirl
Yeah, the first time I listened to the director's commentary, I completely didn't understand what they were saying. Then it made sense that the compass wavers. I can't remember what one of them was starting to say, but it was about the compass and it sounded important and then the more outspoken one blurts, "Sh! It's Jack Davenport!" And while Jack Davenport's entrance is enchanting, I really wanted the other one to finish his thought.
Yeah, so that confuses me. They state in the commentary the compass wavers when Jack holds it. They've pretty much stated that it always did point to the chest when Liz held it, but she interpreted it as pointing to Jack which is very suggestive about how she feels about him anyway.
Back to when Jack holds it:
What do they mean by saying it's always pointed to x when they've said it wavers? They hint and hint that it points to Elizabeth at times for whatever reason, but I'm confused as to what they were going to talk about in the part you mentioned, tee pirategirl.
See, I thought at first the compass was just over-complicated by a lot of people and it was truly a simple little device, but it really isn't.
Originally posted by T.Maria
your right adarksidejedi.
And the end of the day if they married jack and liz off, it would be out of BOTH of their characters to do so 🙂Jack and liz both seek freedom.
Therefore, if they got married to eachother then they wouldn't exactly be free...
Whereas, if they were simple lovers/parters/knew there was something sexually attactive about eachother then they would still have the freedom that they want, and yet know that they do indeed belong to the other 🙂
Thanks for argeeing with me!As Jack always say to her
"It would had never had worked out between us Elizabeth!"Or something like that!jm 🙂