Well IMO loving money is never good. Not only can it lead to greed as mentioned above, but many negative actions stem from it like murder, defamation, battery, the list goes on and on. Money doesn't bring people happiness anyway. You can't find happiness from the outside, though putting money in it's right perspective does no harm. Loving and obsessing over it ruins your character and can ruin lives.
Originally posted by Boris
I'm greedy and love it.Sins are fun.
Greedy people are one of the most vile people, as are the selfish.
Greed is selfish excessive or uncontrolled desire for possessions. Greed makes people ultimately unhappy, friendless, and ruins lives.
Apart from Christianity, thats what Islam, Judaism, Hinduism and Buddhism will tell you.
Its what Ancient cultures saw as undesirable, because of what kind of people greedy people are.
It is something which is not praised anywhere, and never was.
Your blatant spite for religion is not clever. This proves that you're not thinking objectively.
You are kind of the JesusIsAlive/muslimscholar of Atheism.
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Greedy people are one of the most vile people, as are the selfish.Greed is selfish excessive or uncontrolled desire for possessions. Greed makes people ultimately unhappy, friendless, and ruins lives.
Apart from Christianity, thats what Islam, Judaism, Hinduism and Buddhism will tell you.
Its what Ancient cultures saw as undesirable, because of what kind of people greedy people are.It is something which is not praised anywhere, and never was.
Your blatant spite for religion is not clever. This proves that you're not thinking objectively.
You are kind of the JesusIsAlive/muslimscholar of Atheism.
Not really.
And Greedy people have always been put in a bad light, but when you look at it they have done some of the best things for us ever. The way we can live now is because of greedy capitalist people, even if you don't like to admit it.
Greed when applied with reason is not evil. What is evil are the greedy people that claim that it is evil so they can use it without having to do anything themselves.
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
No, ambition and disire when applied with reason is not ''evil''.People who were ambitious have done so much for us.
Greed by definition is application of want and desire in excessive and uncontrollable manner.
And you don't think that greed was in many cases the reason why they were ambitious?
Greed is a very human desire. And just because it might be excessive, doesn't mean it is uncontrollable, now does it?
It depends how you see greed. If you only see it as wanting something at any cost it can be harmful (doesn't need to be), but if you also see a strong desire for something as greed then it is actually rather healthy.
Wikipedia explanation -
Greed is selfish excessive or uncontrolled desire for possession or pursuit of money, wealth, food, or other possessions, especially when this denies the same goods to others.
...
Some desire to increase one's wealth is nearly universal and acceptable in any culture, but this simple want is not considered greed. Greed is the extreme form of this desire, especially where one desires things simply for the sake of owning them. Greed may entail acquiring material possessions at the expense of another person's welfare
some of other definitions, from a dictionary -
greed, noun.
- Excessive desire for more than one needs or deserves:
- Excessive or rapacious desire, esp. for wealth or possessions.
- An excessive desire to acquire or possess more than what one needs or deserves, especially with respect to material wealth
.....
Also, please quote me one person who has done wonders to society, who is described his success due to greed.
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
Wikipedia explanation -some of other definitions, from a dictionary -
greed, noun.
- Excessive desire for more than one needs or deserves:
- Excessive or rapacious desire, esp. for wealth or possessions.
- An excessive desire to acquire or possess more than what one needs or deserves, especially with respect to material wealth.....
Also, please quote me one person who has done wonders to society, who is described his success due to greed.
Ayn Rand
Of course that is an unfair question, since the word greed is stigmatized by people like you. No one would claim to be greedy, but of course many people are greedy.
I mean, do you think Henry Ford, Sam Walton, John Rockefeller, Andrew Carnegie, John Morgan ... did what they did for giggles? Not really, they wanted money and as much of it as possible.
Originally posted by Bardock42
Ayn RandOf course that is an unfair question, since the word greed is stigmatized by people like you. No one would claim to be greedy, but of course many people are greedy.
I mean, do you think Henry Ford, Sam Walton, John Rockefeller, Andrew Carnegie, John Morgan ... did what they did for giggles? Not really, they wanted money and as much of it as possible.
People like me?
I wasn't aware I made up the dictionary entry, nor the wikipedia explanation. I am simply quoting.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/greed
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
People like me?I wasn't aware I made up the dictionary entry, nor the wikipedia explanation. I am simply quoting.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/greed
No, I am saying it is stigmatized. I read the dictionary entries as well. But they are not as negative as you make them out to be. They state that it is an excessive desire for material possession.
The uncontrollable none of them states.
So, what about the guys I named? All just in it for the good of humankind?
Apperantly there are different kinds of Greed too -
Greed is the acquisition of a desirable good by one person or a group beyond need, resulting in unequal distribution to the point others are deprived.
Competitive greed is the same type of acquisition deliberately to create that inequality.
Punitive greed is the same type of acquisition deliberately to leave the deprived suffering, powerless or disabled.
from www.g-r-e-e-d.com
(although this seems strictly in economic terms, which leaves out pesonal greeds, but ah well)
Originally posted by Bardock42
No, I am saying it is stigmatized. I read the dictionary entries as well. But they are not as negative as you make them out to be. They state that it is an excessive desire for material possession.The uncontrollable none of them states.
So, what about the guys I named? All just in it for the good of humankind?
That is simply YOUR attribution to them. Nothing more.
I am asking to show me (anyone who did any good in society including people you mentioned) they describing their success due to greed.
In fact, I would like to see anyone describing their success due to greed, or even speaking about greed in a favorable manner.
(The Wall Street springs to mind)
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
That is simply YOUR attribution to them. Nothing more.I am asking to show me (anyone who did any good in society including people you mentioned) they describing their success due to greed.
In fact, I would like to see anyone describing their success due to greed, or even speaking about greed in a favorable manner.
(The Wall Street springs to mind)
How does it matter what they describe it as?
You are trying to create a scenario that proves nothing and it impossible to achieve? Why? It has nothing to do with the discussion.
Originally posted by Bardock42
How does it matter what they describe it as?You are trying to create a scenario that proves nothing and it impossible to achieve? Why? It has nothing to do with the discussion.
You claimed to me, in your first post addressed to me, that greedy people have done so much for us, and that people like me are making greedy people look bad.
I have shown you all the definition by different people, and websites, including dictionary which proves that greed is undesirable.
The word and its definitions are the ones which project something negative. Greed by deffinition is something bad, undesirable for humans.
You challenged that, but have provided me with nothing other than your own opinion to support that.
You challenged my reply, to begin with, so you should present something on which your challenge was based, assuming you knew the accepted definition and idea of greed was bad, beyond the pages of Bible and years before it.
Originally posted by lil bitchiness
You claimed to me, in your first post addressed to me, that greedy people have done so much for us, and that people like me are making greedy people look bad.I have shown you all the definition by different people, and websites, including dictionary which proves that greed is undesirable.
The word and its definitions are the ones which project something negative. Greed by deffinition is something bad, undesirable for humans.
You challenged that, but have provided me with nothing other than your own opinion to support that.
You challenged my reply, to begin with, so you should present something on which your challenge was based, assuming you knew the accepted definition and idea of greed was bad, beyond the pages of Bible and years before it.
Yes.
No, it doesn't.
No, not really. Where in "greed (grēd) Pronunciation Key
n. An excessive desire to acquire or possess more than what one needs or deserves, especially with respect to material wealth:" is it implied that that is negative?
Well, what could I provide you with? It is clear that many people wanted more that they had or needed over the years and created things that are now to our favour. Whether someone admitted that they did it out of greed is hardly important, because, as you said, greed had be seen as very negative over the years....
You didn't provide any proof that greed is entirely bad. You just stated that because it is the general opinion. Tell me, what were the reasons the people I stated aspired more wealth? Was it not greed? How can I prove to you that it was greed?