Originally posted by Menetnashté
Decepticons were rarely able to defeat the dinobots if memory serves me correctly, I remember one time Megatron tricked them into fighting optimus but they learned he was lying and Megatron and the rest of the decepticons ran away like scared dogs.
yep...
in G1, the dinobots appearance in the battle = collective decepticon "holy shit were f*ckin' screwed"
Originally posted by Scythe
Starscream is a lying, conniving, cheating bastard. He'd probably find a way to get Grimlock to destroy himself.
with prep i agree...
Starscream is a scheming, cheating sonovagun, it doesn't matter how many times Megs bitchslaps him, if there's a way to usurp leadership he'll do it first chance he gets...
in the cartoons, was he 2nd in command? or was it Shockwave or Soundwave?
Originally posted by Menetnashté
Starscream's not smart enough to do that, he'd want to go head on into battle, he lacks strategy.
What are you talking about? Starscream is uber manipulative. He would have to find a way to make Grimlock destroy himself out of his own fear of loss and he could pull that off, considering Grimlock is as dull as a plastic butter knife.
In direct combat... Grimlock overwhelms Starscream in every which possible way.
Beleive itor not, Grimlock isn't stupid when it comes to fighting, the guy is very effective, and commands the loyalty of his Dinobots, each of whom is a distinct powerhouse in their own right.
When it comes to matching physically or in terms of firepower, Grimlock will beat the nuts and bolts out of Screamer...
BUT... whenit comes tofiness, cunning and strateigic thinking... Star Screams got it in spades, and although Grimlock has no real physical weakness, one thing he does have, is a less then average proccessing speed. Screamer may very well find a weakness in our Dino buddy.
7/10 in favour of Grimlock. 3/10 for Starscreams better thought proccesses... It's simply not enough to overcome Grimlocks physical dominance and battle prowess for the majority.
Originally posted by draxx_tOfU
with prep i agree...Starscream is a scheming, cheating sonovagun, it doesn't matter how many times Megs bitchslaps him, if there's a way to usurp leadership he'll do it first chance he gets...
in the cartoons, was he 2nd in command? or was it Shockwave or Soundwave?
That's true. And I believe he was second in command.
OK, here's some videos to show Grimlock's strength in previous battles.
In this Grimlock hits starscream during flight causing him to retreat for a moment, though he comes back to wield Megatron, and he also takes down Skywarp during flight. Also notice Starscream fires a horde of bombs at Grimlock and he isn't even affected.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=xtcyUlUgH5M
Grimlock scares the crap out of Megatron causing him and the Decepticons to retreat.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=rz4yH8PFWGA
-Grimlock shoots Galvatron's ship, along with another Decepticon ship.
-Scares Sharkticons into fighting their leader
-quickly dodges Unicron's attack.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=BtGdfulu5KI
This next video doesn't really show anything good of him, but I'm just trying to point out that most of his slowness comes from him being forgetful or not thinking things through, and considering we've seen how starscream attempts to fight him in the past it's unlikely that he'd all of a sudden attempt to confuse him, I doubt Grimlock would even give him the chance.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=iVhqCNRNvbY
http://youtube.com/watch?v=iVhqCNRNvbY
Originally posted by Scythe
Those are all convincing videos that provide evidence of Grimlock's awesomeness, but come on, Starscream would retreat and come back with Megatron to blow Grimlock away. It's completely possible.
Originally posted by Menetnashté
Starscream's attacks haven't been shown to even hurt Grimlock, maybe if it was Megatron and Starscream, or Soundwave and Starscream. But I seriously doubt Starscream can take him down alone.
Grimlock's tough hide is able to stand up to Starscream's weak laser blasts, but I'm sure Starscream would get the big guy stuck between two trees or something. Not exactly the best show of a fighter, but Grimlock will be just like Winnie The Pooh stuck in a tree after Starscream munipulates him enough. Then Optimus will come running after Grimlock with Eeyore's voice.
"Don't worry Grimy The Poo, I'm comin' to get ya!"
Originally posted by Scythe
Grimlock's tough hide [b]is able to stand up to Starscream's weak laser blasts, but I'm sure Starscream would get the big guy stuck between two trees or something. Not exactly the best show of a fighter, but Grimlock will be just like Winnie The Pooh stuck in a tree after Starscream munipulates him enough. Then Optimus will come running after Grimlock with Eeyore's voice."Don't worry Grimy The Poo, I'm comin' to get ya!" [/B]
I stand by my earlier statements, I just don't think Screamer can win on his own... even with his Cluster bombs, Null Rays and various missiles, he can't damage Grimlock substantially, even with a sustained assault.
Grimlock's brain may have all the intelligence of a carrot, but one thing he is, and thats an effective warrior, and beleive it or not, he is actually tactically brutal and capable commander. When it comes to fighting, they don't have many more effective fighters than Grimlock, especially earlier in the series when the Dinobots where first created.
The most effective warriors the Autobots had at the time where Prime, Skyfire/Jetfire, Ironhide and Brawn. Grimlock easily surpasses all of em exept Prime in sheer batte strength and capability.