I think it hard to call where the dead wood in the PT is, though I think most agree it was trying to do too much in too short a time, and we can all agree that ROTS isn't a waste (though possibly told too fast)
True, literally it is in AOTC where the middle is some of the dullest stuff there- well, the Anakin bits, anyway.
But I feel that might be a symptomn of TPM being pretty mucn a prequel to the second two films (which are in turn prequels to the next three). Now, TPM had lots of important things- Anakin's origin, introduction of the Sith etc. but the point is that that didn't have to happen in an entirely separate plotline, which is what TPM really was. It is true that battle droids and the Feds appear later on but that's just gloss; none of it has plot significance. There coould have been no droids in the other films- the Confederate armies could have been Ninja Commando Reptiles- and the plot would have been identical; the droids are there for the sake of making it LOOK like it is all linked but... no, not really.
So AOTC is then left with the job of establishing a plotline all over again, thus crippling part of what made ESB so good- that it didn't need to establish anything. And then AOTC is ALSO trying to introduce the love-with-Padme plotline as well. And it's also got Obi-Wan investigating a mystery, which is actually the best part of much of the film but in TPM we had Qui-Gon investigating a mystery as well and that's all part of the repetition that's come around...
SOMETHING had to go from all this squeeze. And I think it was the TPM plot that is the one to go. If you take the fundamentals of TPM- discovering a growing threat to the Galaxy that has gone unnoticed due to the Sith- but mix it with the actual plot details of AOTC- that the conspiracy is about the upcoming Clone Wars and all that jazz- then you still have room to introduce Anakin, establish the Sith and have your big Darth Maul duel and then have two films in hand, with a lot more room now.
Anyway. I think if a better structure of rall three films had come in advance- instead of the extent to which it was made up as it went along, same thing that caused ROTJ such problems- then AOTC may have suffered a lot less.
Originally posted by Ushgarak
I think it hard to call where the dead wood in the PT is, though I think most agree it was trying to do too much in too short a time, and we can all agree that ROTS isn't a waste (though possibly told too fast)True, literally it is in AOTC where the middle is some of the dullest stuff there- well, the Anakin bits, anyway.
But I feel that might be a symptomn of TPM being pretty mucn a prequel to the second two films (which are in turn prequels to the next three). Now, TPM had lots of important things- Anakin's origin, introduction of the Sith etc. but the point is that that didn't have to happen in an entirely separate plotline, which is what TPM really was. It is true that battle droids and the Feds appear later on but that's just gloss; none of it has plot significance. There coould have been no droids in the other films- the Confederate armies could have been Ninja Commando Reptiles- and the plot would have been identical; the droids are there for the sake of making it LOOK like it is all linked but... no, not really.
So AOTC is then left with the job of establishing a plotline all over again, thus crippling part of what made ESB so good- that it didn't need to establish anything. And then AOTC is ALSO trying to introduce the love-with-Padme plotline as well. And it's also got Obi-Wan investigating a mystery, which is actually the best part of much of the film but in TPM we had Qui-Gon investigating a mystery as well and that's all part of the repetition that's come around...
SOMETHING had to go from all this squeeze. And I think it was the TPM plot that is the one to go. If you take the fundamentals of TPM- discovering a growing threat to the Galaxy that has gone unnoticed due to the Sith- but mix it with the actual plot details of AOTC- that the conspiracy is about the upcoming Clone Wars and all that jazz- then you still have room to introduce Anakin, establish the Sith and have your big Darth Maul duel and then have two films in hand, with a lot more room now.
Anyway. I think if a better structure of rall three films had come in advance- instead of the extent to which it was made up as it went along, same thing that caused ROTJ such problems- then AOTC may have suffered a lot less.
I don't entirely agree with Ush's AOTC assesment though. My big problem with OB1's so-called detective story is that it didn't really lead anywhere, other than revealing the fact that a Clone Army was being made and that a, to the viewer completely new character, may or may not have been behind it (i.e. Dooku). So we get half a film filled with one little bit of exposition that doesn't bring us one bit closer to the real question of the entire PT: who and where are the Sith?
Plus OB1's detective story starts with finding out who is behind Padme's attack. That too is never satisfactorily explained. The TF wanted her dead but why was risking the entire operation by a sloppy and very loud assasination attempt worth the TF's involvement? We already knew they were easily manipulated.
But the thing that gets me most is that the FACT of a Clone Army and the TF's desire to kill Padme has absolutely nothing to do with the main plot: namely a Sith is pulling the strings, Jedi are losing it and Anakin is.... well, what was Anakin supposed to be in AOTC?
A promising Jedi? All we saw was a grumpy, whining, arrogant brat who THINKS he is the greatest and fails at just about everything he does (he is diosobedient, fails to capture a bounty hunter, gets caught, falls in love and loses a lightsabre battle in a very stupid way).
The only revelant plot points that drive the story forward is Anakin falling in love with Padme. And those were the worst love scenes ever. And there was the Clone Army's origin maybe... but since the entire plot BEHIND the origin of the Clone Army is not told or revealed, who cares? There are Clones, they will fight... who needs to know more?
And then... these plot points are quite simply fitted anywhere (just see how easily ESB sandwiches a credible love story betwen great scenes of a great plot). Which all comes down to my feeling that AOTC is very obsolete and GL should have gone for two films at the Beginning of the Clone Wars and at the end (i.e. current ROTS). At least then we would have been able to see Anakin as the great Clone War hero (which we never really see in ROTS) and the good friend of OB1.
Empire Strikes Back and A New Hope are worth discussing, although that's pretty much a dead bush by now anyway, but the rest?
Jeez. Some films are worth discussing, say Hook or Always, more than they are worth watching, but the rest of the SW films, possibly with the exception of Return of the Jedi (simply for the conclusion of the OT) aren't. Let it die.
The days of George Lucas being a respected Mogul-Turkey-Neck have evaporated and all we have left is the more talented Peter Jackson to step into his shoes, a few meandering SW spin-offs and Turning Japanese by the Vapors, simply for the fact that using "evaporated" reminded me of them. Take my effin picture.