Originally posted by Eon Blue
Josh, we all get that you’re a mental midget and the equivalent to a pre-pubescent teen girl, but try to man up a bit. You’re embarrassing yourself amongst us men.
"We all". Who? You and your real account? 😂
You are dilusional, old man.
P.S. Broly doesn't count either, I own the guy; his word is what I say it is.
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
[B]Refutations:1.) The elephant in Nibe’s room
Nibe’s post focuses primary on denying the existence of external factors affecting the feat, but fails and barely manages to address the elephant in the room, which is the source that proves this external factors exist in the form of the inconsistency of the feat.
Nibe’s entire defense against this elephant focuses on “the feat is simple” and “it’s a movie; movie/plot errors are OKAY”.
This is fallacious under the subject at hand. For dear judges, a feat being “simple” and “a movie making mistakes is OKAY” doesn’t translate into a feat being valid to debating! Specially if said feats falls outside continuity/character’s arc. Sure, it can be valid movie material, but plot holes aren’t debatable!
Writers intentionally creating plot-holes in favor of drama doesn’t translate into them being valid for debating. Sure, the feat is okay in order to create entertainment and make the kids happy at their seats, but certainly it doesn’t eliminate the fact that it is a plot hole.
But Nibe doesn’t stop there, he further tries to validate plot holes by saying that feats are independent of continuity. Make no mistake judges, this is a FALLACY.
Merriam Webster Dictionary:
Plot holeBy the definition itself, we can already realize that plot holes aren’t valid for debating. This is common knowledge; you don’t need to be some pro debater to know that inconsistent evidence is ignored.
Arguments can’t be drawn from plot holes! The most you can draw from plot holes are opinions and assumptions. Nibe himself knows this! And he knows that assumptions are INVALID for debating.
In the above post Nibe recognizes that you can’t really defend a side with a plot hole, but are limited to draw your OWN conclusions/opinions (asumptions).
Note: I am not accusing Nibe of double standards. I know he is an honorable man; the very reason I accepted his BZ. But, probably he just ignored or forgot that plot holes are invalid2.) Ambiguity and valid assumptions
Besides ignoring/belittling the plot-hole he spends most of his post attacking the existence of external/unknown factors in the feat. Again, despite all his efforts, he fails to realize that the existence of the plot hole creates this “external unknown factors” like magic.
Now I never said she was like Odin, but I definitely PROVED that her magic is extreme and UNKNOWN.
However, I NEVER said that it was an absolute. Me saying that the presence of magic is a factor in Mjolnir’s destruction is my opinion and way of explaining the PLOT HOLE.
So , dear judges, I bring this argument to prove that the plot hole creates an ambiguity. Why? Because if the feat isn’t a plot hole, something has to explain the inconsistency! In this case, the presence of unknown external factor, like Hela’s powerful and unknown magic, can eliminate the plot hole. Despite this however, the feat remains invalid, because since we don’t really know how this factors influence in the feat (they are unknown), and therefore the feat is ambiguous.
And we all know, that ambiguous feats are invalid for debating, since we can only draw personal interpretations and opinions from these. Nibe also knows this:
Conclusion: Plot holes aren't debatable
Arguments:
1.) INSANITY: A massive strength inconsistency
Appreciated judges and audience, with this post I will prove to you all, that should the Hela-Mjolnir feat be one of SOLE strength (no external factors involved/ no ambiguity) then we would be dealing with a PLOT HOLE
As I’ve stated before, and everyone agrees with, Mjolnir is created from Uru, a metal whose physical properties would outmatch ANYTHING we have in our periodic table.
-An Earthly Mjolnir:
Let’s follow Nibe’s game. Let’s all assume that there are no external factors on the feat, and that strength is the only thing playing a role.
Uru is a material definitely stronger than anything we use on Earth. But let’s assume Mjolnir is made from a material we have on Earth. A material whose strength could come at least somewhat close to Uru.
Lets use diamond.
Mjolnir was crushed. We know that crushing involves compressive forces. In this case, such compressive forces are applied by Hela’s fingers.
Diamond has a compressive force of 470Gpa!!! on its strongest section! Again, I will use the strongest section in order to come the closest to an INSANELY strong material like Uru.
Source: https://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jp102037jusing simple tools:
https://www.translatorscafe.com/unit-converter/en/pressure/19-5/newton%2Fcentimeter%C2%B2-gigapascal/
http://www.kylesconverter.com/mass/newtons-to-tonnesWe get that it would require 47,000,000N to crush 1cm2 of diamond material or 4792 tons over a surface area of 1cm2.
If we take the pinky fingertip area (not the entire finger), we get an area of approx. 2.7cm2! this means that Hela would require to apply a pressure of nearly 13,000 tons on a diamond Mjolnir!!!
Let’s see how insane this is!
In other threads, we’ve settled that a Leviathan would weight from 1000-2000 tons! Should that be the case, Hela would be able to lift several leviathan’s on her PINKY FINGERTIP!
THIS IS NUTTSSS! INSANE!Let’s now consider that Hela applied strength on 5 fingers (not fingertips) and that she wasn’t even STRUGGLING. Also, that she isn’t even struggling nor is angry.
-Hela vs Thor:
Now, here is where the inconsistency lies! Thor and Hulk’s strength lie on similar scales.
Odin All-father:
So, if she has this INSANE strength on Earth, then on Asgard we should expect a strength buff on Asgard. And yet, when fighting her brother, she was actually pissed and yet Thor manage to hold her for a while.
Minute 4:59 to 7:21
YouTube videoAgain, Hela was clearly pissed by Thor, and yet Thor was able to endure her for some time. If Hela can lift 13,000 tons in her fingertips, then a punch from her WOULD DEFINITELY knock out if not KILL Thor! He would have 0 chance of facing her in a H2H! Specially when considering she gets stronger on Asgard!
Plot Hole proved!
2.)Ambiguity = no plot hole
But there is another possibility. The presence of external unknown factors, which would remove the plot hole, but create an ambiguous feat.
The filmmakers clearly introduce us with a high tier magical being, in that aspect, it’s completely valid and possible that magic is an external unknown factor influencing the feat. Contrary to what Nibedicus has said, we do have explicit intel that there could be external factors influencing the feat (strength inconsistency and Hela’s magic).
The issue here however is that we don’t know the exact influence these factors have on the feat, and therefore, we have an ambiguous feat. We can't debate ambiguous feats, for it allows for too many opinions.
Conclusion:
Considering that I’ve proven the MASSIVE inconsistency in strength and that external factors are possible, the feat is INVALID to debate.
Judges, I implore you not to validate this feat. Should such a feat be validated, a ripple effect would affect this entire forum, several, if not most threads would be affected. Plot holes would be valid, ambiguity permitted. This cannot stand!
To my opponent, there’s still time for you to correct your stand [/B]
Look at this awful reasoning. What you say makes zero sense.
"Besides ignoring/belittling the plot-hole he spends most of his post attacking the existence of external/unknown factors in the feat. Again, despite all his efforts, he fails to realize that the existence of the plot hole creates this “external unknown factors” like magic.
Now I never said she was like Odin, but I definitely PROVED that her magic is extreme and UNKNOWN."
Originally posted by BrolyBlack
Look at this awful reasoning. What you say makes zero sense."Besides ignoring/belittling the plot-hole he spends most of his post attacking the existence of external/unknown factors in the feat. Again, despite all his efforts, he fails to realize that the existence of the plot hole creates this “external unknown factors” like magic.
Now I never said she was like Odin, but I definitely PROVED that her magic is extreme and UNKNOWN."
Your butthurt is evident. You are not participating in the BZ; your word means nothing boy.
Cry all you want. 😂
Originally posted by Josh_AlexanderYou are a joke. We just mock you. You are used to it by now.
Ohhh I had forgotten!!!Man!! 2 pages dedicated to me!! The Tribunal is flattered!!
Poor Quan and Broly! They really struggled to call my attention. Sorry my boys!! I feel bad now for being bad with my hounds! 😂
Don't worry boys (not Quan, he is old and dying), I promise to pamper you more oftenly.
(Won't address Eon, he is a sock so he is irrelevant).