Mad Jim Jaspers VS Jamie Braddock

Originally posted by Utrigita

Because she wasn't upsetting a balance.
She was changing a factor not bringing disturbance
(either way that is how I see it)

I don't think this was a job for conceptualized power,
for all Concepts were at the whim of Wanda's desires during HOM.

While her power was crashing all things together,
the Writer states,
that her power was beyond the comprehension of "any Sentience,
no matter how grandiose it's opinion of itself"

Originally posted by Mr Master
Actually good friend, she was collapsing the Omniverse,
and ultimately did morph everything into chaos.

I don't think this was a job for conceptualized power,
for all Concepts were at the whim of Wanda's desires during HOM.

While her power was crashing all things together,
the Writer states,
that her power was beyond the comprehension of "any Sentience,
no matter how grandiose it's opinion of itself"

And ended up putting everything back together again.

It's a bit like Thanos W/IG that brings Chaos to one Universe that is fine with LT (for reasons beyond me), then we have Warlock that is entirely unstable etc etc LT acts.

Because I hope not that you are suggesting Wanda > LT?

Originally posted by Utrigita

And ended up putting everything back together again.

Originally posted by Utrigita

It's a bit like Thanos W/IG that brings Chaos to one Universe that is fine with LT (for reasons beyond me), then we have Warlock that is entirely unstable etc etc LT acts.

Warlock on the other hand, with the IG, was mentally unstable,
and so, with infinite power over all creation in his hands,
the fabric of existence was in danger,
thus, the LT had to interfere.

Wanda didn't just endanger all creation, she literally tore all of it down.

Originally posted by Utrigita

Because I hope not that you are suggesting Wanda > LT?

Also, check this out, the writer talking:

"No coherence to Causality.
Only Primal Chaos,
beyond the comprehension of any Sentience
no matter how grandiose its opinion of itself

And this is just the beginning"

srugyellowshoes

Originally posted by Mr Master
Right, but ... ok, doesn't mean there wasn't reason to come through before hand.

And erase the prime universe that powers everything else when everything would eventually work out with a small adjustment... Now I could be wrong but wasn't they about to use the CN on her?

Originally posted by Mr Master
Actually, LT didn't interfere with Thanos,
because Thanos wanted to replace Eternity, and was mentally fit to do so,
and thus, there was no harm to the fabric of existence.

Agreed.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Warlock on the other hand, with the IG, was mentally unstable,
and so, with infinite power over all creation in his hands,
the fabric of existence was in danger,
thus, the LT had to interfere.

Agreed.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Wanda didn't just endanger all creation, she literally tore all of it down.

And rebuilded it, something Warlock showed no interest in doing since he was mentally unstable (wanda was not quiet okay too but not on Warlocks level)

Originally posted by Mr Master
I haven't said that, I said I wouldn't be surprised if it were so.

Imo No. Wanda can warp the omniverse yes and that is impressive, LT can replace the entire foundament of the Marvel Omniverse overwriting the sentience of the Abstracts that exist in all the marvel Multiverse, taking away their independence and leaving them mindless.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Also, check this out, the writer talking:

"No coherence to Causality.
Only Primal Chaos,
[B]beyond the comprehension of any Sentience
no matter how grandiose its opinion of itself

And this is just the beginning"

srugyellowshoes [/B]

How great do you think LT think of himself? Galactus that is shown thinks very highly of himself, Eternity too. LT doesn't think Grandiose about itself it carries out it assignment to the letter.

Originally posted by Utrigita

And erase the prime universe that powers everything else
when everything would eventually work out with a small adjustment...

Not looking for an answer, I'm just saying.

Originally posted by Utrigita

Now I could be wrong but wasn't they about to use the CN on her?

Although, there's no way we'll ever know if that would've worked,
especially since Wanda was there.

Originally posted by Utrigita

And rebuilded it, something Warlock showed no interest in doing since he was mentally unstable (wanda was not quiet okay too but not on Warlocks level)

While Wanda did.

Imo, Wanda was definitely more insane than Warlock.

The only thing Warlock wanted to do, was purge the Universe of evil,
which Strange convinced him not to do.

Originally posted by Utrigita

Imo No. Wanda can warp the omniverse yes and that is impressive, LT can replace the entire foundament of the Marvel Omniverse overwriting the sentience of the Abstracts that exist in all the marvel Multiverse, taking away their independence and leaving them mindless.

Although technically,
the LT would've had to re-configure the laws of creation on an Omniversal scale.

So ... hmm.

Originally posted by Utrigita

How great do you think LT think of himself? Galactus that is shown thinks very highly of himself, Eternity too. LT doesn't think Grandiose about itself it carries out it assignment to the letter.

The LT doesn't hold his tongue when it comes to stating his majestic status.

Besides, I was focusing more on:

"[i]beyond the comprehension of any Sentience"

The LT is a Sentience.

Originally posted by Mr Master
True, LT probably knew she was going to fix it,
but LT knows everything, and sometimes things work out by themselves,
even when he does interfere, one has to ask, why did he interfere in those other occasions?

Not looking for an answer, I'm just saying.

Absolutely no Idea at times it seems random what he does.

Originally posted by Mr Master
On 616 actually, to cut off where Wanda's power was spilling from.

Although, there's no way we'll ever know if that would've worked,
especially since Wanda was there.

Well technically she was bound to her reality much like 238 Jaspers was, if she would have been capable of withstanding the CN I'm not aware of however Jamie destroying just in case gives me a hint that just perhaps.

Originally posted by Mr Master
But Warlock never destroyed/warped/or created anything out of madness or greed.

While Wanda did.

Didn't Wanda create the new reality out of Love for her Father ore something like that?

Originally posted by Mr Master
Imo, Wanda was definitely more insane than Warlock.

A matter of perspective I think.

Originally posted by Mr Master
The only thing Warlock wanted to do, was purge the Universe of evil,
which Strange convinced him not to do.

Still that counts more in LT's book then reality warping on a omniversal scale... 😕 upsetting the balance...

Originally posted by Mr Master
hey, believe me when I say that feat was uber, beyond cosmic laws,
but Wanda did that, on an Omniversal level.

Although technically,
the LT would've had to re-configure the laws of creation on an Omniversal scale.

So ... hmm.

Exactly, we know from the Handbook that their is only one above LT, we know that the Beyonders powers (that is immense powerful) is nothing next to LT. We know that LT can with a blink of his eyes repower the Gauntlet the leftover from a previous supreme being.

Originally posted by Mr Master
The LT always states that he is the "Tri-Judge" of "any and all realities"
"there is none above the LT" ... "I represent forces that dwarf your might"
"I could be all"

The LT doesn't hold his tongue when it comes to stating his majestic status.

Besides, I was focusing more on:

"[i]beyond the comprehension of any Sentience"

The LT is a Sentience.

That is more stating his role, just like Thanos with Heart of the Universe Stated it, on the other side we have Galactus jumping around screaming "power incarnated"

Couldn't MJJ just take Jamies powers away once he's enveloped in the Jaspers warp?

Originally posted by Utrigita
Well technically she was bound to her reality much like 238 Jaspers was, if she would have been capable of withstanding the CN I'm not aware of however Jamie destroying just in case gives me a hint that just perhaps.

I don't think it would work on Wanda anyway.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Exactly, we know from the Handbook that their is only one above LT, we know that the Beyonders powers (that is immense powerful) is nothing next to LT. We know that LT can with a blink of his eyes repower the Gauntlet the leftover from a previous supreme being.

So could Wanda do it. She didn't close shown limits. BeyonderS powers are also nothing next to Wanda.

Originally posted by Xplosive
I don't think it would work on Wanda anyway.

No you don't think it would, I have not decided yet but Jamie toke no chance whatsoever.

Originally posted by Xplosive
So could Wanda do it. She didn't close shown limits. BeyonderS powers are also nothing next to Wanda.

Repower the Infinity Gauntlet? I disagree, imo the Beyonders are at Wanda's level given the circumstances concerning the Cosmic Cubes and what they are capable of and their power is only a fraction of the Beyonders. According to Mephisto a newly founded Cosmic Cube is potentially equal to the Infinity Gauntlet ore at the Infinity Gems seperated and even seperated they can collapse the omniverse by creating countless realities then they can warp all those realities into a single reality... so go figure what the full power of the Beyonders can produce.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Repower the Infinity Gauntlet? I disagree, imo the Beyonders are at Wanda's level given the circumstances concerning the Cosmic Cubes and what they are capable of and their power is only a fraction of the Beyonders. According to Mephisto a newly founded Cosmic Cube is potentially equal to the Infinity Gauntlet ore at the Infinity Gems seperated and even seperated they can collapse the omniverse by creating countless realities then they can warp all those realities into a single reality... so go figure what the full power of the Beyonders can produce.

Everything you mentioned is nothing that would even bother Wanda. Wanda made a joke of everyone. No one came close to her power.
And with that scan that no sentience (and LT belongs among word sentience), who knows, maybe also LT was tossed around like nothing.
Aside of that, I am pretty sure Wanda stomps BeyonderS like nothing (actually, probably she already did stomp them).

Originally posted by Xplosive
Everything you mentioned is nothing that would even bother Wanda. Wanda made a joke of everyone. No one came close to her power.
And with that scan that no sentience (and LT belongs among word sentience), who knows, maybe also LT was tossed around like nothing.
Aside of that, I am pretty sure Wanda stomps BeyonderS like nothing (actually, probably she already did stomp them).

So Wanda could easily repower the Infinity Gauntlet? I'm very interested to see where you draw that conclusion from.
LT Second only to Toaa tossed around like nothing? So now we should begin seeing Wanda at the same powerlevel as Thanos with Heart of the Universe ore what?
I don't know why you mention that nothing of what I mentioned would either bother Wanda since I only mentioned what a fraction of the Beyonders power are capable of. The Beyonders in case you didn't know it desire changes, Wanda was a change even assuming that they could stop Wanda (which they imo can) it would be directly against their most important goal to combat her.

Originally posted by Utrigita
So Wanda could easily re-power the Infinity Gauntlet? I'm very interested to see where you draw that conclusion from.
LT Second only to Toaa tossed around like nothing? So now we should begin seeing Wanda at the same powerlevel as Thanos with Heart of the Universe ore what?
I don't know why you mention that nothing of what I mentioned would either bother Wanda since I only mentioned what a fraction of the Beyonders power are capable of. The Beyonders in case you didn't know it desire changes, Wanda was a change even assuming that they could stop Wanda (which they imo can) it would be directly against their most important goal to combat her.

I didn't say re-power it (and a matter of affect, I think Wanda could do with IG what ever she would want to do it). What the BeyonderS did, that doesn't mean anything towards Wanda and wouldn't bother her. Protege also wasn't at the level of THOTI, but would curbstomp LT (so much about second to TOAA, while potentially and a fact that he was already surpassed by a being).

And you mention a fraction of BeyonderS power. Did you forget that what Wanda was doing was doing effortlessly?

She stomps them. LT is the only one to stop her.

Destroys them if she chooses. And where they were when she was playing with MU? They were probably getting stomped.

Originally posted by Xplosive
I didn't say re-power it (and a matter of affect, I think Wanda could do with IG what ever she would want to do it). What the BeyonderS did, that doesn't mean anything towards Wanda and wouldn't bother her. Protege also wasn't at the level of THOTI, but would curbstomp LT (so much about second to TOAA, while potentially and a fact that he was already surpassed by a being).

And you mention a fraction of BeyonderS power. Did you forget that what Wanda was doing was doing effortlessly?

She stomps them. LT is the only one to stop her.

So now Wanda can overwrite the effects of LT judgement... This is becoming rather strange... Again have I said that it would? No I haven't what I have done is mentioning what feats a fraction of their power can accomplishe, based on that I don't think Wanda will be capable of producing anything looking like a Stomp towards them, And yet Protege wasn't more powerful then LT then a simple drawing from a amulet could amp him beyond Protege. Furthermore the only we have seen on panel defeat LT is the Heart of the Universe which is the power of God, Protege never directly attacked LT so we have no idea what would have happened had he attacked and lastly it was PIS.

I remember them finding her afterwards, depowered.

Stomps the Beyonders? I disagree I also disagree on that LT is the only one to stop her, Captain Britain with all his nice artifacts could apparently sunder the omniverse and rebuilt it wait that is what Wanda did...

Originally posted by Xplosive
Destroys them if she chooses. And where they were when she was playing with MU? They were probably getting stomped.

The Beyonders?

I believe I have already once mentioned why the Beyonders didn't interact against Wanda, they desire changes to even if they had the power they would in interacting be fighting their own primary goal.

Mad J.

At first when I saw this thread, I thought it was Jamie Madrox AKA Multiple Man and I was like WTF? 😆 😆

Originally posted by Utrigita
So now Wanda can overwrite the effects of LT judgement... This is becoming rather strange... Again have I said that it would? No I haven't what I have done is mentioning what feats a fraction of their power can accomplishe, based on that I don't think Wanda will be capable of producing anything looking like a Stomp towards them, And yet Protege wasn't more powerful then LT then a simple drawing from a amulet could amp him beyond Protege. Furthermore the only we have seen on panel defeat LT is the Heart of the Universe which is the power of God, Protege never directly attacked LT so we have no idea what would have happened had he attacked and lastly it was PIS.

PIS, no, Protege was simply more powerful, like it's destined mortal to become more powerful than LT.
And amulet is not just like that, it taps into infinite essence of Eternity power (and if not for Scathan who contained Protege, I don't think amulet would help him. And he would simply that + power LT had from amulet, he would easily copy it, making himself even more powerful). And Protege was too much for LT+Eternity+Hawkgod and some others.
So he was more than just a tad above LT, he was clearly above him to stomp him along others. LT didn't say for nothing that all realities lies on Protege shoulders. So that means LT knew that Protege can erase them all together and LT knew with all other he wouldn't be able to stop him. So he was pretty much waiting for Protege to send them to oblivion.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Stomps the Beyonders? I disagree I also disagree on that LT is the only one to stop her, Captain Britain with all his nice artifacts could apparently sunder the omniverse and rebuilt it wait that is what Wanda did...

Apparently. Wanda actually did it with ease.

Originally posted by Utrigita
The Beyonders?

I believe I have already once mentioned why the Beyonders didn't interact against Wanda, they desire changes to even if they had the power they would in interacting be fighting their own primary goal.

Where were they, because Wanda destroyed completely whole Omniverse?
They are not LT, they were probably getting stomped.

Originally posted by Xplosive
PIS, no, Protege was simply more powerful, like it's destined mortal to become more powerful than LT.
And amulet is not just like that, it taps into infinite essence of Eternity power (and if not for Scathan who contained Protege, I don't think amulet would help him. And he would simply that + power LT had from amulet, he would easily copy it, making himself even more powerful). And Protege was too much for LT+Eternity+Hawkgod and some others.
So he was more than just a tad above LT, he was clearly above him to stomp him along others. LT didn't say for nothing that all realities lies on Protege shoulders. So that means LT knew that Protege can erase them all together and LT knew with all other he wouldn't be able to stop him. So he was pretty much waiting for Protege to send them to oblivion.

[B]Apparently. Wanda actually did it with ease.

Where were they, because Wanda destroyed completely whole Omniverse?
They are not LT, they were probably getting stomped. [/B]

PIS, LT could have removed his ability to copy from a multiverse away and then have arrived. It's funny because Protege already had Eternity power yet LT is capable of amping himself beyond Protege by calling on that very power. Really? all you see is Protege beginning to charge up and then Scathan Blast him from behind the end I don't see any fear from either abstracts nore those "normal heroes" present. You bases this on what? They never battled like LT and Thanos did, you are basing your judgement on the handbook and the supposedly battle, but the very same that places Protege above LT also places LT second only to Toaa. I could be wrong but I don't recall Wanda having been mentioned as being above LT in any handbook...

Merlyn fused the compined power of the omniverse into crystals and could have broken each and every one of them, Captain Britain could have done it but didn't.

They where in their own dimension, the Beyonder Dimension, everything was put back the way it was correct (minus the mutants)? so they are still there most likely observing the changes that Wanda has brought. No they isn't but you don't think that LT can take Wanda either so what is the difference?

Originally posted by Utrigita
PIS, LT could have removed his ability to copy from a multiverse away and then have arrived.

No. Protege was only an early example of what we know will eventually happen. So, nothing weird of him being above LT.

And BeyonderS dimension isn't part of the Omniverse? It's reality part of the omniverse.

Originally posted by Utrigita
[B]No they isn't but you don't think that LT can take Wanda either so what is the difference?

No no, I clearly stated that the LT is the only one to stop her. LT should be able to stop her, I only said I wouldn't be surprised, if Wanda was more powerful, but I still think LT would stop her.