Originally posted by shivHey if the Mods want to enforce it more then I'm all for that, I'm just not proposing that they should have to.
Goob w.r.to your x and y dialogue on page 8. you speak of an ideal. One which only a minority on this forum deign to practiceI favor a reality in which the ideal is enforced.
My random scribble/notes:
Part of the issue is also that in general people want to make sequential sense of a medium in which is purely for entertainment. Sure in the last 10-15 years things have been getting better in terms of story cohesion, but the fact it that with multiple titles, writers, and simple time there will never be an truly standard version of a character. Power levels can vary per title, per era or even per issue.
People will always pick and choose what they want to believe, whether it's the comics forum or their personal life. As long as a logical argument can be made, it's fair game.
One particular issue is open ended power sets. If it isn't shown, then it shouldn't be implied that it can be done. One particular issue is with energy based characters. Unless that character is shown with 100% success rate at easily controlling every form of energy thrown at them, then it should be taken with a grain of salt.
Green Lantern's don't share feats despite having the same base power set, neither should other energy based characters.
Feats where help is required should also be something that is looked at. For example, a particular poster argued that Quasar can absorb practically any energy easily...an example was named. However, the poster knowingly forgot to mention the outside assistance in that particular example. Thus the example falls into a separate category since it's not viable for the character to perform on their own.
Speedblitz is another one. Traveling vs battle speed is a hot topic a lot of the time. My proposal:
Superspeed isn't limited to traveling or fighting. One way to quantify it is "it something that the character uses often in a myriad of ways?"
For example. Both Flash and Captain America will be shown to dodge lasers as a feat. However, Flash will also be seen vibrating his hands to make fires, changing clothes before someone can blink, mentally calculating complex scenarios at faster than supercomputer speeds ect. We know Flash is far faster because he can do anything at superhuman speeds and while Cap is fast/skilled, he can't duplicate any of flash's other feats in any way.
Is it an inherent ability or is it something that looks cool on panel? Captain Cold may occasionally hit the flash but is that reason to believe that the captain has FTL reflexes?
One time events should be taken with a grain of salt for characters that have a long history. I see some far out stuff from the 70's being used in debates sometimes that is hilarious and that probably will never be duplicated again since the suspension of disbelief would never fly now. Unless these things are at least shown a couple of times, then it shouldn't be a used as undeniable proof.
For now, I'll leave my "notes" as is and hopefully it will makes sense to most of you. Sleep is starting to call me.
Rules That I believe should be enforced.
1. Absolutely no prep feats should be allowed ever unless given by the thread starter.
2. No Real world or 4th wall writers are Gods Bull should be allowed to be brought up on a COMICS forum.
3. Speed blitz should only be realistic if the characters have myriad uses of Superspeed. I need to see super fast hands, Feat, spinning, flight etc. Not just super fast reaction times and flight.
4. No arm bar shit.
5. I believe we should have a sliding effect where we say the last 10 or 15 years worth of feats count. That leaves out crappy hyperbole and silly shit like PC superman sneezing out stars and Thor and Herculese rocking the planet out of orbit with no actual evidence that they did. It also leaves out shit that doesn't go with the current status quo.
6. Repeated multiple scans of the same thing over and over should be banned.
7. Characters with Unlimted ampming abilities should be limited to what they have done on panel. I get sick of this cosmic God can amp his power. But never does. This cosmic guy can amp his strength. But never does. Blah blah.
Originally posted by Avlon
My random scribble/notes:Part of the issue is also that in general people want to make sequential sense of a medium in which is purely for entertainment. Sure in the last 10-15 years things have been getting better in terms of story cohesion, but the fact it that with multiple titles, writers, and simple time there will never be an truly standard version of a character. Power levels can vary per title, per era or even per issue.
People will always pick and choose what they want to believe, whether it's the comics forum or their personal life. As long as a logical argument can be made, it's fair game.
One particular issue is open ended power sets. If it isn't shown, then it shouldn't be implied that it can be done. One particular issue is with energy based characters. Unless that character is shown with 100% success rate at easily controlling every form of energy thrown at them, then it should be taken with a grain of salt.
Green Lantern's don't share feats despite having the same base power set, neither should other energy based characters.
Feats where help is required should also be something that is looked at. For example, a particular poster argued that Quasar can absorb practically any energy easily...an example was named. However, the poster knowingly forgot to mention the outside assistance in that particular example. Thus the example falls into a separate category since it's not viable for the character to perform on their own.
Speedblitz is another one. Traveling vs battle speed is a hot topic a lot of the time. My proposal:
Superspeed isn't limited to traveling or fighting. One way to quantify it is "it something that the character uses often in a myriad of ways?"
For example. Both Flash and Captain America will be shown to dodge lasers as a feat. However, Flash will also be seen vibrating his hands to make fires, changing clothes before someone can blink, mentally calculating complex scenarios at faster than supercomputer speeds ect. We know Flash is far faster because he can do anything at superhuman speeds and while Cap is fast/skilled, he can't duplicate any of flash's other feats in any way.
Is it an inherent ability or is it something that looks cool on panel? Captain Cold may occasionally hit the flash but is that reason to believe that the captain has FTL reflexes?
One time events should be taken with a grain of salt for characters that have a long history. I see some far out stuff from the 70's being used in debates sometimes that is hilarious and that probably will never be duplicated again since the suspension of disbelief would never fly now. Unless these things are at least shown a couple of times, then it shouldn't be a used as undeniable proof.
For now, I'll leave my "notes" as is and hopefully it will makes sense to most of you. Sleep is starting to call me.
Energy manipulators like Quasar, GL, and Surfer can't possibly be shown manipulation EVERY form of energy because there are just too damn many types and more are being introduced all the time. If a characters powerset dictates that he can control virtually all forms of energy then he should be considered to be able to unless the energy type in question is something that has a track record of foiling energy manipulators, and even then it shouldn't be considered impossible(or even improbable) if a specific energy manipulator has never happened run into it but has instances of manipulating energy of similar types.
Originally posted by fangirl101basically everything said against you in the surfer/superman thread, those "rules" are specific to that thread.
Rules That I believe should be enforced.1. Absolutely no prep feats should be allowed ever unless given by the thread starter.
2. No Real world or 4th wall writers are Gods Bull should be allowed to be brought up on a COMICS forum.
3. Speed blitz should only be realistic if the characters have myriad uses of Superspeed. I need to see super fast hands, Feat, spinning, flight etc. Not just super fast reaction times and flight.
4. No arm bar shit.
5. I believe we should have a sliding effect where we say the last 10 or 15 years worth of feats count. That leaves out crappy hyperbole and silly shit like PC superman sneezing out stars and Thor and Herculese rocking the planet out of orbit with no actual evidence that they did. It also leaves out shit that doesn't go with the current status quo.
6. Repeated multiple scans of the same thing over and over should be banned.
7. Characters with Unlimted ampming abilities should be limited to what they have done on panel. I get sick of this cosmic God can amp his power. But never does. This cosmic guy can amp his strength. But never does. Blah blah.