Conspiracies that i believe in

good to know

more like 80 innacurate, and all in the right places to subtly mislead

if you dont mind having ur privacy invaded then its ur own perogitive. however, many people value it and do not consider{rightly so} any rationalisations made by the government based on flimsy evidence and the WAR AGAINST TERROR, as justifying it. furthermore, by keeping a watch on the activities of society in general, and having personal info, organisations/government hold the power to manipulate people without people even knowing it {imagine stalking a girl 24/7 for a couple of months without her knowing, and using all that you find out to ask her out, say all the right things, pick all the the nice places, make urself the person she wants, and bam, u score. when se actually is judging u, thinking you just randomly are this compatible wonderful person}

again, first world poverty, well, ISNT poverty. or i guess it is, but only in a reletive sense. try living in a dangerous feudal owned area where government and services are corrupt to the core and living on less than a pound a day for the majority of ur life. not saying its all roses for u, just drawing a comparison.

hrmmm, are you the one whose worked with the actual DISTRIBUTION of charitable funds in third world countries or know people who coordinate them or politicians and beaurecrats of the highest echelon concerned with such activities{im not mocking u btw} ? i didnt think so. are you aware that over 85-90% of all charitable aid that reaches this part of the world goes into private pockets of politicians and NGO owners/workers???????????? lol, non profit NGOs are BIG business, but i guess u have no way of knowing that. so really, im not paranoid.

you're not understanding me...i'm not having my privacy invaded...that's my point...it's a myth...it's a conspiracy theory...there's no one sticking cameras in my bedroom window...there's no shady government official following my every move...

as for your poverty jibe (which it is)...it's all relative (as you seem to have a grasp of the concept) to the cost of living...which is infinitely higher in the UK than in Pakistan...infact it's one of the most expensive places in the world to live..so while the earnings of an average Brit may seem like a world above the average Pakistani...it doesn't go far...one area i lived in has a child poverty rate as 95%....squalor is squalor wherever you live...and i'm guessing that if you're talking about relatives then i'm guessing you having internet access in Pakistan makes you closer to the top % of wealth in your country than i to mine.

and yes...i've worked with the distribution of charitable donations to 3rd world countries...namely i've worked in Tanzania and Sudan...i've worked on the front lines...i've seen the difference it makes .i'm not saying your allegations are entirely unfounded...quite the opposite...that's why many charities now only deal with the people directly and only go to a country's government for permission to be there (Burma being a recent example...the 2004 tsunami relief effort also)...

yes there have been corruptions of organisations that were meant to be for the good (Iraq oil for food programme for example)...but on the whole...certainly not 80% of charity money goes to waste...and certainly not 80% of charities are corrupt

your opinion that corporations are almost entirely corrupt is also falicious...look at microsoft and the Bill Gates foundation...2 men gave 90% of their combined fortunes to combat AIDS, Malaria and general poverty...a total of some $60,000,000,000

their contributions to health care in the world are equal to the of the WHO...

so, the phone line tapping which bush admitted to himself is a conspiracy theory????? orrrrr r u thinking that im suggesting the US government is monitoring ur every move and reading ur brainwaves????? lol

but i also know that the people here who earn a dollar a day dont have near enough to even pay for their own very basic food, forget their families or any other basic necessities, so no, the fact that its more expensive to live in britian doesnt nearly counteract the difference in purchasing power of the individuals in the two places.

but ur forgetting the band aid for the bullet wounds analogy. governments and large organisations DONATE a lot at times, but thats mostly for PR and public image of the companies and said governments{cause usually they have caused/precipitated the crisis to begin with, or many other crisis worldwide and now just wanna better their position}. if ur talking about actual collecting and allocating agencies in the word for charities then no, im not generally suggesting that its some great conspiracy to take away money, {other than local NGOs in third world countries} , contrary to what u might think, i dont see conspiracis everywhere i go.

i assure you, the corruption figures i gave u for this part of the world are horrifyingly accurate. but then, this is fact and not conspiracy{albeit fact that media in the west isnt fond of throwing about unless it furthers propagandist ends}

i said MOST corporations have heavy ulterior motives and dabble in subterfuge, specially, seeing as the larger the organisation, the more contacts it generates witht he rest of the market and society, and well, putting it gently, the people who have the greatest control of both these things are SNEAKY. the IT business{outside the type used for military or intrnet filtering, e.g. google/wikipedia etc} is one of the few mainly technological/development based businesses, where the valued commodity is the newer invention in software/hardware. not much use or point or advantage, for that matter, for subterfuge there. on the ther hand, any organisation which is a significant mover of the world market, you bet ur ass theres subterfuge and dirty/morally corrupt dealings with governments etc.

and again, these CHARITABLE donations are nuthing compared to the amount of money being poured into the world to take advantage of society.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
and again, these CHARITABLE donations are nuthing compared to the amount of money being poured into the world to take advantage of society.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
so, the phone line tapping which bush admitted to himself is a conspiracy theory????? orrrrr r u thinking that im suggesting the US government is monitoring ur every move and reading ur brainwaves????? lol

but i also know that the people here who earn a dollar a day dont have near enough to even pay for their own very basic food, forget their families or any other basic necessities, so no, the fact that its more expensive to live in britian doesnt nearly counteract the difference in purchasing power of the individuals in the two places.

but ur forgetting the band aid for the bullet wounds analogy. governments and large organisations DONATE a lot at times, but thats mostly for PR and public image of the companies and said governments{cause usually they have caused/precipitated the crisis to begin with, or many other crisis worldwide and now just wanna better their position}. if ur talking about actual collecting and allocating agencies in the word for charities then no, im not generally suggesting that its some great conspiracy to take away money, {other than local NGOs in third world countries} , contrary to what u might think, i dont see conspiracis everywhere i go.

i assure you, the corruption figures i gave u for this part of the world are horrifyingly accurate. but then, this is fact and not conspiracy{albeit fact that media in the west isnt fond of throwing about unless it furthers propagandist ends}

i said MOST corporations have heavy ulterior motives and dabble in subterfuge, specially, seeing as the larger the organisation, the more contacts it generates witht he rest of the market and society, and well, putting it gently, the people who have the greatest control of both these things are SNEAKY. the IT business{outside the type used for military or intrnet filtering, e.g. google/wikipedia etc} is one of the few mainly technological/development based businesses, where the valued commodity is the newer invention in software/hardware. not much use or point or advantage, for that matter, for subterfuge there. on the ther hand, any organisation which is a significant mover of the world market, you bet ur ass theres subterfuge and dirty/morally corrupt dealings with governments etc.

what Bush says and does doesn't concern me in that way...i dont live in the US...something that i've made abundantly clear

so the fact that in areas of my city, 95% of children live below the poverty line isn't significant?...the fact that the ridiclulous price of fuel in this country means that many people are having to choose whether to heat their homes or have enough food this winter....like you say...this is supposed to be a 1st world country....one of G8...regardless...this is a bit off-topic

the Bill Gates foundation isn't a case of a corporation merely donating a small % of it's money...we're talking, in the Case or Bill and Warren Buffett (who is no 1 on the Forbes rich list) given away an average of 90% of their wealth...that's more thanthe GDP of over 2/3 of all the countries in the world...it's hardly a mere band-aid analogy

the last point you seem to be mistaking government corruption (which there undoubtably is in many poor parts of the world...your country included) for corruption in charity organisations, which i believe isn't the huge problem you believe it to be. sometimes a charity has no choice but to funnel funds through a government or government agencies...it's at that point the money starts to disappear...which is the fault of the government officials and not the charities.

your point about the IT business not having need for subterfuge is another minomer...if anything, the IT sector would be more prone to subterfuge at all levels, not just at the top....for example software writers writing code into banking software to funnel money out of accounts for their own benefit...or the government colluding with software manufacturers to install spying software into home computers...the fact that IT equipment is so hugely pervasive in all aspects of business and personal lives means it has a much larger possibility to be used against huge numbers of people....and those with close to monopolistic control (microsoft) over the market are the ones with the power....and they're certainly not the evil, world domination desiring corporation that you would have them portrayed as...it's a company built up by a bunch of middle class geeks....

on a lighter note..this is a fun debate...i'm enjoying this...