DBZ contest of morality

Started by Hewhoknowsall3 pages
Hewhoknowsall Restricted
Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
yes he is a hero and Goku has a no killing rule. What is wrong with you? When faced against the impossible the hero will choose to go down fighting instead of breaking their morals and code. Batman could've saved hundreds of lives over the years if he just killed people like Joker, two-face, Riddler, etc. yet he doesn't because he doesn't kill people.

No, what I am saying is that you said that Goku wouldn't kill Gohan only because people would hate him for doing it.

Wei Phoenix One-Eyed Dragon Of Oshu

no he wouldn't do it because he doesn't kill people let alone his son. People hating him is just an added bonus.

TheBadguy Senior Member

Goku- maybe, he doesn't like to kill but has and its been his intention more than once
Vegeta - yes (even though he's mostly good at the end he still killed all those innocent people as Maijin Vegeta knowing they could just be wished back)
Tien- no
Trunks- probably not but future Trunks grew up through some harsh shit
Picollo - yes if he has too
Android 18- Yes
Yamcha- who

Even if he destroys the dragonballs they just get some namekians to make more or Goku ITs to Namek and finds their dragonballs.

Hewhoknowsall Restricted

Originally posted by TheBadguy
Goku- maybe, he doesn't like to kill but has and its been his intention more than once
Vegeta - yes (even though he's mostly good at the end he still killed all those innocent people as Maijin Vegeta knowing they could just be wished back)
Tien- no
Trunks- probably not but future Trunks grew up through some harsh shit
Picollo - yes if he has too
Android 18- Yes
Yamcha- who

Even if he destroys the dragonballs they just get some namekians to make more or Goku ITs to Namek and finds their dragonballs.


Would he kill Gohan?
Originally posted by TheBadguy
Goku- maybe, he doesn't like to kill but has and its been his intention more than once
Vegeta - yes (even though he's mostly good at the end he still killed all those innocent people as Maijin Vegeta knowing they could just be wished back)
Tien- no
Trunks- probably not but future Trunks grew up through some harsh shit
Picollo - yes if he has too
Android 18- Yes
Yamcha- who

Even if he destroys the dragonballs they just get some namekians to make more or Goku ITs to Namek and finds their dragonballs.


Yes
Originally posted by TheBadguy
Goku- maybe, he doesn't like to kill but has and its been his intention more than once
Vegeta - yes (even though he's mostly good at the end he still killed all those innocent people as Maijin Vegeta knowing they could just be wished back)
Tien- no
Trunks- probably not but future Trunks grew up through some harsh shit
Picollo - yes if he has too
Android 18- Yes
Yamcha- who

Even if he destroys the dragonballs they just get some namekians to make more or Goku ITs to Namek and finds their dragonballs.


Why not?
Originally posted by TheBadguy
Goku- maybe, he doesn't like to kill but has and its been his intention more than once
Vegeta - yes (even though he's mostly good at the end he still killed all those innocent people as Maijin Vegeta knowing they could just be wished back)
Tien- no
Trunks- probably not but future Trunks grew up through some harsh shit
Picollo - yes if he has too
Android 18- Yes
Yamcha- who

Even if he destroys the dragonballs they just get some namekians to make more or Goku ITs to Namek and finds their dragonballs.


He was willing to take out Vegeta
Originally posted by TheBadguy
Goku- maybe, he doesn't like to kill but has and its been his intention more than once
Vegeta - yes (even though he's mostly good at the end he still killed all those innocent people as Maijin Vegeta knowing they could just be wished back)
Tien- no
Trunks- probably not but future Trunks grew up through some harsh shit
Picollo - yes if he has too
Android 18- Yes
Yamcha- who

Even if he destroys the dragonballs they just get some namekians to make more or Goku ITs to Namek and finds their dragonballs.


What about the last one?
Originally posted by TheBadguy
Goku- maybe, he doesn't like to kill but has and its been his intention more than once
Vegeta - yes (even though he's mostly good at the end he still killed all those innocent people as Maijin Vegeta knowing they could just be wished back)
Tien- no
Trunks- probably not but future Trunks grew up through some harsh shit
Picollo - yes if he has too
Android 18- Yes
Yamcha- who

Even if he destroys the dragonballs they just get some namekians to make more or Goku ITs to Namek and finds their dragonballs.


Why?

Hewhoknowsall Restricted

Oops...

Wei Phoenix One-Eyed Dragon Of Oshu

Originally posted by TheBadguy
Goku- maybe, he doesn't like to kill but has and its been his intention more than once
Vegeta - yes (even though he's mostly good at the end he still killed all those innocent people as Maijin Vegeta knowing they could just be wished back)
Tien- no
Trunks- probably not but future Trunks grew up through some harsh shit
Picollo - yes if he has too
Android 18- Yes
Yamcha- who

Even if he destroys the dragonballs they just get some namekians to make more or Goku ITs to Namek and finds their dragonballs.

Goku has only killed one person canonnically and that was Buu.

Majin Vegeta is not Vegeta now. that was past hatred awakened.

Piccolo would never kill Gohan.

TheBadguy Senior Member

Originally posted by Wei Phoenix
Goku has only killed one person canonnically and that was Buu.

Majin Vegeta is not Vegeta now. that was past hatred awakened.

Piccolo would never kill Gohan.

Goku killed grandpa gohan, he meant to kill Freeza, he helped Piccolo kill Raditz, he took Cell to King Kai's planet knowing they would be killed, he meant to kill Tao Pai, he wanted Gohan to kill Cell, he let Gohan and the others die to save Hercule and Dende because they were closer to him. Goku will kill if he has too. MVegeta was in control of himself, he wanted to kill those people to get Goku to fight him, Babidi didn't make him do that. Vegeta will have no problems doing this list especially knowing they can just wish them back. Piccolo won't be as willing as Vegeta but I can see him doing it as long as he has the dragonball card.

Wei Phoenix One-Eyed Dragon Of Oshu

No if Goku wanted to finally kill frieza then he could have and if even if he did then he still didn't do it.

Grandpa Gohan wasn't intentional.

Yeah he wanted Gohan to do it, but he didn't do it. He possibly could've done it with that Kamehameha he was charging but didn't and just warped in his face.

Letting someone die because you can't save everyone is not the same as killing. Piccolo is not going kill Gohan.

TheBadguy Senior Member

I only mentioned Grandpa gohan because you said it was only Buu canonically. He intended to kill Freeza with that blast. Thats how the series was going to end. A kameha that blows off a head usually means death. all that aside that still leaves

"he helped Piccolo kill Raditz, he took Cell to King Kai's planet knowing they would be killed, he meant to kill Tao Pai"

Goku will kill when he has too and has intended to kill more than once so what are we arguing about.

Hewhoknowsall Restricted
Originally posted by TheBadguy
Goku killed grandpa gohan, he meant to kill Freeza, he helped Piccolo kill Raditz, he took Cell to King Kai's planet knowing they would be killed, he meant to kill Tao Pai, he wanted Gohan to kill Cell, he let Gohan and the others die to save Hercule and Dende because they were closer to him. Goku will kill if he has too. MVegeta was in control of himself, he wanted to kill those people to get Goku to fight him, Babidi didn't make him do that. Vegeta will have no problems doing this list especially knowing they can just wish them back. Piccolo won't be as willing as Vegeta but I can see him doing it as long as he has the dragonball card.

I think that Gohan and the others are a little teeny weeny bit closer to Goku than Hercules and Dende, but that is just me.

And all of those characters were evil (except for Gohan, the others and Grandpa Gohan, but that was unintentional). So...

Placidity Chief Executive Officer

Re: DBZ contest of morality

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall

Goku
Vegeta 🙁
Tien
Trunks
Picollo
Android 18
Yamcha

1. Freiza
2. 10 murderers
3. 1 innocent person
4. A family of 4
5. A city's population
6. All of America
7. 25% of the world
8. Gohan
9. 50% of the world
10. All of Namek and 15 other peaceful alien worlds

What a freaking amazing thread.

Goku

1. Freiza - No Problemo.
2. 10 murderers - struggles past this one.
3. 1 innocent person - Stops here. Too much of a boy scout.

Vegeta 🙁

He would get through the whole list with pleasure, especially 1.

Trunks

Probably make it up to 8. Gohan. Don't think he could ever kill his old mentor.

Android 18

Clears it with ease.

Not sure about Tien and Yamcha

he from beyond Restricted

I think Goku could make it to 7 or 8.

jimBOFH Senior Member

Both Vegeta and Goku have the potential to be infinitely powerful.
How so? Because of these 2 facts from Dragonball canon:
1: The longer a Saiyan fights, the more his strength increases. Furthermore, if a Saiyan survives an injury, his strength increases proportionally to the severity of the injury.
2: The Dragonballs are quite capable of conferring true immortality upon an individual, as demonstrated by Garlic Junior. By true immortality, i mean that they can NEVER be killed, unlike Buu and Cell who are almost immortal but can be killed if every cell/molecule of their body is destroyed by an overwhelming attack.
Therefore, if Vegeta was to use the Dragonballs as he originally intended and gain immortality, (he could still be injured, but like Garlic Junior he would recover immediately), then he would simply start fighting, and eventually would be stronger than any other character.

jimBOFH Senior Member

and, morals-wise:
Goku would not surrender to that sort of blackmail, even in situations where it was clearly the best option. He's too honourable, and would fight to the end.
Vegeta wouldn't have much problem with either option, he'd probably take whichever option offered the best tactical chance of victory (imo, the 1000 survivors one, seeing as it leaves the Namekian dragonballs intact). Not because he's evil, by the end of DBZ he's officially "good", but he's still calculating, pragmatic, and potentially ruthless- an "ends justifies the means" kind of guy.
Piccolo would probably refuse to kill Gohan and the Namekians, and seeing as i've already explained why the 1st option was tactically better, he'd accept that and use the namekian dragonballs if possible.
Number 18- as long as the survival of her friends and family was assured in the 1000 survivors, she'd take that option.
Tien and Yamcha- well, if Goku and Vegeta aren't going to fight, then they'd have to be suicidal to do so themselves, and there's no way they could kill Gohan, so they'd have to take the surrender option.

Hewhoknowsall Restricted
Originally posted by jimBOFH
and, morals-wise:
Goku would not surrender to that sort of blackmail, even in situations where it was clearly the best option. He's too honourable, and would fight to the end.
Vegeta wouldn't have much problem with either option, he'd probably take whichever option offered the best tactical chance of victory (imo, the 1000 survivors one, seeing as it leaves the Namekian dragonballs intact). Not because he's evil, by the end of DBZ he's officially "good", but he's still calculating, pragmatic, and potentially ruthless- an "ends justifies the means" kind of guy.
Piccolo would probably refuse to kill Gohan and the Namekians, and seeing as i've already explained why the 1st option was tactically better, he'd accept that and use the namekian dragonballs if possible.
Number 18- as long as the survival of her friends and family was assured in the 1000 survivors, she'd take that option.
Tien and Yamcha- well, if Goku and Vegeta aren't going to fight, then they'd have to be suicidal to do so themselves, and there's no way they could kill Gohan, so they'd have to take the surrender option.

I think that Goku will certainly get past 1, probably 2, and push himself to get to 25% of the world or Gohan.

jimBOFH Senior Member

Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
I think that Goku will certainly get past 1, probably 2, and push himself to get to 25% of the world or Gohan.

I don't think he would- he really is honourable to the point of idiocy, as seen in the fight against Kid Buu- Vegeta was unable to move, and so would have been killed by the Spirit Bomb. However, knowing that he could eventually be wished back anyway, and recognising that defeating Buu was more important than his own survival, he urges Goku to attack- but Goku refuses, and just stands there taking hits from Kid Buu until Fat Buu saves Vegeta.
If he can't bring himself to sacrifice Vegeta, even when Vegeta is yelling at him to do it, and when the fate of the universe hangs in the balance- I don't think he'd be able to sacrifice anyone.

Hewhoknowsall Restricted

He actually did decide to in the end, when he says "forgive me vegeta". That is why I said "push himself". And that is why he probably couldn't kill 25% of the world or gohan.

jimBOFH Senior Member

He says "Forgive me Vegeta- I can't do it!", so either he changes his mind, or he's asking Vegeta to forgive him for failing to destroy Buu. And Goku has mercy on everyone, to the point of idiocy- not only does he help Frieza, who then attacks him again, but he also orders Krillin to spare Vegeta, even though Vegeta tells Krillin to get on with it rather than beg for mercy, or surrender.