Stoic doesn't even know that Batman has taken shots from stronger beings than the Lizard he doesn't know that Batman is not a normal human I don't even think he knows what he's typing. Clay face has pounded on Batman on more than one occasion and Bruce is still kicking yet he thinks the Lizard can one shot him which = fail. Batman wins a majority because he's a normal guy 😐
Originally posted by Stoic
You are so wrong, Wolverine is not Batman, Wolverine has a healing factor, and can take hits from class 100's because everything about Wolverine is superhuman right down to his bones...
Wolverine has his healing factor and adamantium skeleton, but try to explain how his grey matter isnt jellow after taking just one shot from a class 100 guy. Sure it'll heal, but not instantly. He should be KO'd everytime he takes a shot like that for at least a moment or so.
It was just a comparison and I dont want to derail the thread, but I wanted to clear up my stance. Carry on.
Originally posted by tkitnaYou are awesome.
Wolverine has his healing factor and adamantium skeleton, but try to explain how his grey matter isnt jellow after taking just one shot from a class 100 guy. Sure it'll heal, but not instantly. He should be KO'd everytime he takes a shot like that for at least a moment or so.It was just a comparison and I dont want to derail the thread, but I wanted to clear up my stance. Carry on.
Originally posted by iceman24567
Stoic doesn't even know that Batman has taken shots from stronger beings than the Lizard he doesn't know that Batman is not a normal human I don't even think he knows what he's typing. Clay face has pounded on Batman on more than one occasion and Bruce is still kicking yet he thinks the Lizard can one shot him which = fail. Batman wins a majority because he's a normal guy 😐
Skills, Abilities, and Resources
Unlike many superheroes, Batman has "NO SUPERPOWERS" <---- NONE and instead relies on "his own scientific knowledge, detective skills, and athletic prowess."
Do what you like and think what you want, Batman is a normal guy with no powers, I know that you know what CIS.This is what you're using in your argument. Batman is famous for being written more powerfully than he is which is CIS, if you have a hard time understanding this perhaps you should check up on that problem it could become a serious one as you begin to grow older.
Originally posted by tkitna
Wolverine has his healing factor and adamantium skeleton, but try to explain how his grey matter isnt jellow after taking just one shot from a class 100 guy. Sure it'll heal, but not instantly. He should be KO'd everytime he takes a shot like that for at least a moment or so.It was just a comparison and I dont want to derail the thread, but I wanted to clear up my stance. Carry on.
Wolverine has a healing factor, an indestructible skeleton, superhuman strength.... Batman can not lay claim to any of these thing. He's a flesh and blood hero, and there is nothing super about him whatsoever.
"No PIS" Rule
PIS = Plot Induced Stupidity
At times, for the sake of the plot, characters that are immensely more powerful than their opponent will "job" to carry on the plot of the story, even though the characters powers and history would clearly show that they are more than capable of destroying their opponent. For this reason we have a No PIS Rule. This rule prohibits the use of such instances of PIS from being used as evidence in debates.
No Mentioning Events of PIS
Plot Induced Stupidity, or PIS, is when characters don't use their abilities or skills to the fullest extent as shown before, even within their personality ranges, for the sake of the story plotline. It makes lesser powered characters an actual challenge against higher powered characters in the comics. Examples of PIS include Flash stories lasting longer than three panels, or Toy Man as a threat to Superman.
Character Induced Stupidity, or CIS, on the other hand, refers to any natural mental limitations that characters impose upon themselves and reduce their ability to use their own skills and powers effectively. Unlike PIS, CIS does not occur because the plot requires it, but because the character is genuinely that dumb. Examples of the CIS-afflicted include characters such as Rhino or Jar Jar Binks. Events of CIS are not exempt from debates.
Fanboy! Biased! Influenced!
So you're debating over who is stronger, The Flesh or The Incomprehensible Bulk. Each has feats that could match each other in strength; maybe they've leveled a building or two with a single punch, and so on. You have perfect proof that The Flesh could obviously beat The Bulk in a fist fight.
However, the person you are debating with is known to the forum as IncomBulkFan87. Every time he posts, you find that he completely ignores your proof of the Flesh's victory and asserts that the Bulk is invincible or could easily beat anyone in a fist fight.
At this point, it may be very tempting to shout to him the following:
"You're a fanboy!"
"You're biased against The Flesh!"
"You're influenced by Miracle Comics against Lightpony Comics!"
You consider them to be completely pointless to debate with because of their obvious enjoyment of The Incomprehensible Bulk from Miracle Comics.
So Batmans showing all must be Cis because he beats more powerful characters ALL the time. Not having powers does not mean he's a "normal" guy Bruce would take offence to that 😐. By all means his scientific genius, deductive reasoning and equipment makes up for him not having powers his abilities make him more than "normal" is Cap normal? Is Tony Stark normal? No you wouldn't say they are would you?
Captain America has superhuman stamina and endurance he has even healed from taking a mortal bullet wound to the head. Ironman is superhuman, Tony Stark however outside of that suit is not and would be equally beaten down by a character that is not just superior to him in every way, but is leagues above him.
Yes when Batman beats a superhuman it is CIS, and PIS... the very fact that he is able to hurt opponents with heavy enough body armor capable of taking hits from speeding vehicles without being harmed is in itself PIS/CIS. The Lizard would be such a character.
I was about to concede myself because due to Batman being a comic Icon most of his wins are just that... take Frank Castle for example; he's written to be a normal flesh and blood man with great combat skills, he has no super powers at all, and without a gun or other offensive weaponry he would have no business beating Luke Cage, the Rhino, or Spiderman.
The Punisher however isn't the icon that Batman is, and so he has been dulled down and appears to be more human in his appearances than another character on his physical level (Batman) even though Batman would beat the Punisher any day due to his better H2H skills.
Originally posted by namorsubbyBatman fights metas all the time from Killer Croc to Man-Bat, Blockbuster, Solomond Grundy so on sure he has taken on more street level threats but he makes sure his gear can take on metas he very anal evidence of this is brother eye.
batman doesn't even regularly engage people of lizard's stats.......he mainly operates in gotham, remember.
Originally posted by StoicH2h lizard kills & eats him. W/Gadgets Bats should be able to pull off a few Ws. It would be cool if DC made up a standard equip list for Bats. Otherwise the belt is a plot device.
There's no prep here.Batman loses this so badly the Lizard would make it look like a Friday the 13th movie, and Bruce would be one of those helpless chicks.
How do Lizard & Croc compare in powers & stats?
Originally posted by I-Drop
H2h lizard kills & eats him. W/Gadgets Bats should be able to pull off a few Ws. It would be cool if DC made up a standard equip list for Bats. Otherwise the belt is a plot device.How do Lizard & Croc compare in powers & stats?
Croc was put away by Bane, and Bane was his superior in strength, speed, and skill. How strong would you say Bane is? Can Bane lift a subway car, and toss it, or survive tons of concrete collapsing on hin while being in a sewer cave in?
The Lizard seems to be far above Croc in both speed, strength, durability, and natural offensive weaponry.
Each strand of Spidermans webbing was compared to tensile steel cables, and the Lizard has broken out of many layers of Spideys webbing in past battles.
You tell me how you'd compare the two, would Killer Croc stand a chance against the Lizard?
Originally posted by iceman24567
Batman fights metas all the time from Killer Croc to Man-Bat, Blockbuster, Solomond Grundy so on sure he has taken on more street level threats but he makes sure his gear can take on metas he very anal evidence of this is brother eye.
I dont think any of those guys are as fast as The Lizard, maybe Man-bat does. Also Solo Grundys incarnations vary in powers.
The lizard is physically superior to Spider-man, can wall crawl like Spider-man, and his tail is a deadly weapon that he is quite skilled at using. Batman would be ripped to shreds after his first failed attack attempt (If his first attack can win the fight then what would that attack be?) The Lizard is more in tune with his animal savagery and can move faster than Batman can react in most cases. His speed has given Spider-man problems evading his attacks even with the spider-sense
Originally posted by tkitna
Although I agree with you, this logic doesnt work here. This is the type of logic I used to use when Wolverine would be pitted against class 80-100 characters. Theres no possible way he should win, but by God, thats how he's portrayed in the comics. Unfortunately, Batman is portrayed in a way that he doesnt lose to D-class characters like the Lizard. He wouldnt lose here either.
Strength is not be all end all, based on your logic, wolverine being the faster more skilled fight should simply stabb them in the head well before sluggish class 80 touches him, but that does not happen. also according to that logic which ever class 80 and higher hit the other first the fight would end in a single hitt......