Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
Explain how he would die at Dooku please. Caedus was more than capable of fighting Luke Skywalker to a near standstill. He MIGHT have difficulty with all of those but the only two that truly pose a threat are Windu and Yoda.
Please explain to me how Windu is more powerful than Dooku?
They were equals.
Re: Darth Caedus runs the gauntlet
Originally posted by wolfpack86Ragdolled.
Caedus is at full power for each battle, can he make it?1) ROTS Aayla Secura
2) ROTS Kit Fisto
3) Clone Wars Assaj Ventress
4) TPM Darth Maul
5) ROTJ Darth VaderSliced to ribbons in a duel; Caedus is more powerful and vastly more dangerous in close combat.
6) ROTS Darth TyranusSome combination of the above.
7) ROTS Mace WinduCaedus should be able to kill him with the Force, but I wouldn't be too surprised if Mace managed a win.
8) ROTS YodaI don't see fatigue or injury being an issue here; Caedus is superior to everyone else by a notable degree in at least one category each and his stamina is simply inhuman. Pain empowers him, lightsabers wounds barely slow him down.
But Yoda is Yoda. Caedus most likely dies.
Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
Have you not been reading Gideon's posts? They were equals, except for Windu having Vaapad and Shatterpoint, which made Mace superior.
They were equals when Dookie was a Master years prior. What should make anyone believe he isn't equal to Mace Winfield during the events of RoTS?
Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
Explain how he would die at Dooku please. Caedus was more than capable of fighting Luke Skywalker to a near standstill. He MIGHT have difficulty with all of those but the only two that truly pose a threat are Windu and Yoda.
Fatigue. I was envisioning a no break/rest situation.
But yeah- I wouldn't normally see anyone below Mace providing a threat at all.
7 would be extremely close in saber combat, though shatterpoint is pretty much negated for Mace since Caedus posses the "charisma" too, he still has Vapaad. Caedus's advantages in saber combat would be his use of unarmed combat moves which I don't believe Mace users nearly as much(correct me if im wrong) and the fact that Caedus has shown that can take a remarkable of injuries in a duel and still nearly kill his opponent. But I'd give a slight edge to Mace in saber combat, while Caedus has the advantage in the force. I' would lean towards Caedus, because I think there is a greater gap in their force powers than in their lightsaber technique/skill, but ROTS proves that wont always help so I guess this is 50/50.
8. He would die to Yoda but this will be a really close fight.
7. Mace did not fight unarmed, but on rare occasions when he did, he was just as proficient as Caedus. However the force is negated via the loop, just like shatterpoint. With the loop, the lightsaber duel would be over fairly quickly. Regarding the force, this is much closer, but lightning is useless.
8. Yoda would gut him.
Originally posted by The Ground
With the loop, the lightsaber duel would be over fairly quickly. Regarding the force, this is much closer,
Not necessarily even if Mace manages to stab him, it doesn't mean he would go down as we seen in "Invincible" he takes a wound that just about would render all other humans unable to continue to fight.
but lightning is useless.
8. Yoda would gut him.
After a really hard fought duel....
Originally posted by Lord Tyranus
Please explain to me how Windu is more powerful than Dooku?
No one said that Windu was "more powerful" than Dooku; we've just said that he'd beat Dooku in a fight. And with good reason.
Windu is the creator of the "deadliest" lightsaber form, Vaapad, which is a variant of Juyo, the most technical and demanding of all other forms. In order to be a master of Juyo, you must be "a high end master of multiple forms," according to Fight Saber, the Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia, and the Essential Guide to the Force. All that we know of Count Dooku is that he was an extremely accomplished Makashi expert; nothing suggests that he has anything but a working knowledge of other forms. So Windu enjoys an extreme advantage in overall lightsaber expertise.
More to the point, Windu enjoys the paranormal advantages afforded by Vaapad; the novelization shows us that he was not as fast as Sidious was in single combat, hence why he was unable to prevent the deaths of his teammates and was driven back into the larger office, but that Vaapad allowed him to eventually negate the Sith Lord's superior speed. The shatterpoint charism allows him to detect flaws in events and people, which extends to how they duel with a lightsaber.
Dooku, though probably more powerful in the Force and a better swordsman in terms of strict ability, doesn't possess any of these advantages. The Battle of Boz Pity was particularly telling; despite the fact that Dooku told his companions to "leave the Jedi to him," he still relied on General Grievous's Magnaguards to blindside and overpower Windu.
They were equals.
Not really. In the Force, it's likely in Dooku's favor, as in terms of strict dueling ability. But in overall combat, Mace is better.
Originally posted by Elite Hunter
Not necessarily even if Mace manages to stab him, it doesn't mean he would go down as we seen in "Invincible" he takes a wound that just about would render all other humans unable to continue to fight.Again it isn't that simple to me, because the novel states that Mace was choking on the ozone of his own lightning before Palpatine broke it due and we know he could have continued it. Plus there is of course other force powers that a lightsaber wont be useful against.
After a really hard fought duel....
Yes, but if he stabs him, the chances of him winning with a serious wound are dramatically decreased.
Palpatine lightning is NOT Caedus lightning. Plus Mace learned partially from Dooku, a sith lord. You don't think that Dooku wouldn't teach him about how to defend himself from the dark side?
Originally posted by Gideon
No one said that Windu was "more powerful" than Dooku; we've just said that he'd beat Dooku in a fight. And with good reason.Windu is the creator of the "deadliest" lightsaber form, Vaapad, which is a variant of Juyo, the most technical and demanding of all other forms. In order to be a master of Juyo, you must be "a high end master of multiple forms," according to Fight Saber, the Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia, and the Essential Guide to the Force. All that we know of Count Dooku is that he was an extremely accomplished Makashi expert; nothing suggests that he has anything but a working knowledge of other forms. So Windu enjoys an extreme advantage in overall lightsaber expertise.
More to the point, Windu enjoys the paranormal advantages afforded by Vaapad; the novelization shows us that he was not as fast as Sidious was in single combat, hence why he was unable to prevent the deaths of his teammates and was driven back into the larger office, but that Vaapad allowed him to eventually negate the Sith Lord's superior speed. The shatterpoint charism allows him to detect flaws in events and people, which extends to how they duel with a lightsaber.
Dooku, though probably more powerful in the Force and a better swordsman in terms of strict ability, doesn't possess any of these advantages. The Battle of Boz Pity was particularly telling; despite the fact that Dooku told his companions to "leave the Jedi to him," he still relied on General Grievous's Magnaguards to blindside and overpower Windu.
Not really. In the Force, it's likely in Dooku's favor, as in terms of strict dueling ability. But in overall combat, Mace is better.
But isn't common knowledge that they were equals? It would be a fantastic fight, but i see it as a stalemate. Neither would best the other.
Vapaad is a strong form but Makashi was made to fight other Saber wielders.
Dooku knew enough of the other forms to teach them to Grievous and I believe Ventress...
Not really. In the Force, it's likely in Dooku's favor, as in terms of strict dueling ability. But in overall combat, Mace is better.
I don't even see how Dooku is more powerful than Windu with the force. Dooku was captured by about 30 pirates, while Mace took out hundreds of battle droids with the force alone. But i guess you can argue Dooku did not want to take a chance of getting shot, because they did give him a choice to surrender, whereas Mace had no choice.
Not necessarily even if Mace manages to stab him, it doesn't mean he would go down as we seen in "Invincible" he takes a wound that just about would render all other humans unable to continue to fight.
I can't remember exactly how severe the blow Jacen took was, but didn't Mace fight all his saber duels during Shatterpoint after being stabbed in the gut by Depa? (Implying that Mace has similar levels of pain tolerance)