Man: The Flawed Design of God

Originally posted by Da Pittman
I thought God did create us perfect with free will, hence they ate the apple.

That's the idea. The apple was understanding. Of course, free will without understanding hardly seems well thought out. On the other hand understanding without free will would be sadistic and giving people neither would be boring.

Originally posted by Beliver
If God is all powerful, all knowing, omnipitent, and all the omni's...why is man flawed?

To put another spin on it: how capable God must be that He could create a being which can actively choose not to believe He exists.

Created a false dichotomy, pretended that a subjective opinion was objective and then acted as though you were some how not an idiot?

Nah. You need new glasses, or to explain other alternatives to my dichotomy.

You clearly haven't look at a single other post in the thread.

The threads about why God didn't make us perfect, as being imperfect will lead to suffering and thus a creator who creates something knowing that they will suffer despite the fact that they could stop it is evil. So therefore the choice is either God couldn't make us perfect, by not being omnipotent or God didn't what to make us perfect, by being evil.

Also, my assertion was that a non-omnipotent being is undeserving of worship, being nothing more than a glorified dictator, and that an omnipotent but evil being is undeserving of worship becuase it Is a dictator.

Explain where I went wrong please.

What if we are perfect, and this man made idea of perfection is not real?

mmm

That's too metaphysical for my liking. Makes my brain twist. ❌

Buuuut.... Even if what we imagine to be perfection, isn't, logically the concept that we originally had is still possible, as anything less still proves God to be limited and therefore unworthy of our worship.

Originally posted by Da Pittman
I thought God did create us perfect with free will, hence they ate the apple.

Which actually turned out to be a good thing, because the knowledge from the tree gave us creativity, the urge to explore.... practically all of the left side of the brain plus all the work that goes into math and science....

So we had to sin so we could be more.

moral of story! [or a million other interpretations. herein lies the flaw of 'the bible is THE WORD OF GOD' denominations.]

Originally posted by Nephthys
mmm

That's too metaphysical for my liking. Makes my brain twist. ❌

Buuuut.... Even if what we imagine to be perfection, isn't, logically the concept that we originally had is still possible, as anything less still proves God to be limited and therefore unworthy of our worship.

However, point out to me something that is perfect. 😄

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
However, point out to me something that is perfect. 😄

nothing perfect, but how about the golden ratio seen nature, esp. bees and their ....instinct? to make golden ratio honeycombs.

However, point out to me something that is perfect.

Apparently only God can possibly be perfect, but if God is perfect then he could create beings who where also perfect. *sees where this is going*. Damn.

Originally posted by siriuswriter
nothing perfect, but how about the golden ratio seen nature, esp. bees and their ....instinct? to make golden ratio honeycombs.

The golden ratio is a good one, also, fractals. Therefore math is about as perfect as can exist.

Originally posted by siriuswriter
nothing perfect, but how about the golden ratio seen nature, esp. bees and their ....instinct? to make golden ratio honeycombs.

Please elaborate.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos Okay, not all. Though the difference between all and all except for one is meaninglessly trivial.

It's not meaninglessly trivial because of the fact that sheer logic disproves so many of said beliefs.

However virtually all ways of deciding what is good evidence and what those conculsion would be fall into the same area of eventually forcing ones own beliefs on others due to sheer, blind conviction. [/B]

Not the same area, no. Science has given concrete proof to many things, faith doesn't.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Apparently only God can possibly be perfect, but if God is perfect then he could create beings who where also perfect.

Paradox aside, what would be the point of creating a "perfect" being, especially if one already existed? So the being "doesn't suffer"? Without suffering there's no gumption to do anything, so what's the point of creating a being who's just gonna sit on his (or her) ass all day?

Originally posted by Eon Blue
Not the same area, no. Science has given concrete proof to many things, faith doesn't.

How many doctorates do you have? If it's less than five you're probably taking huge pieces of what modern science says on faith.

Also, not the point. Just because you have evidence and proof (or rather have convinced yourself you have them) doesn't mean that you won't try to force others to agree with you, using the "universal" you not targeting you. Strong belief in virtually anything will end up causing you to preach it and turn it into dogma and try to spread it. Religion is the most common example, without it people would probably turn to political and economic theories since they already tend to treat them like that.

Originally posted by Mindship
Perhaps Man is perfect in his imperfection. 😎

Paradox aside, what would be the point of creating a "perfect" being, especially if one already existed? So the being "doesn't suffer"? Without suffering there's no gumption to do anything, so what's the point of creating a being who's just gonna sit on his (or her) ass all day?

Then if god was perfect, wouldn't "he" also sit on his ass all day?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Then if god was perfect, wouldn't "he" also sit on his ass all day?

In a manner of speaking, though, in order to create, He must become imperfect.

Originally posted by Mindship
He's perfect on the Sabbath...whichever day that is.

😆 But you had a good point. If you are perfect, then why would you create anything? Perfection does not need or want.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
😆 But you had a good point. If you are perfect, then why would you create anything?

Interest? Laughs?

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Perfection does not need or want.

Why does perfection not want?