Originally posted by HewhoknowsallIt depends on what you mean by mind tricks. Now as far as someone waving their hands, and magically forcing someone to do what they want, is IMPOSSIBLE.
We could sometime in the future have the ability to simulate certain Force powers, such as TK and Mind Tricks, much easier than we can go FTL. Although pre-cog is probably impossible or close to impossible.
TK is not just a possibility, it's a certainty. Humans perform it on their own body every time they perform a physical action. Decision (thought) --> (telekinesis) Movement (matter). I decide to walk from A to B, and my body follows the command of my mind. Even assuming what Science tells us is true and accepting all of the indirect processes that result in our movement, an original application of telekinesis is still required.
Originally posted by Mr Omiverseria
TK is not just a possibility, it's a certainty. Humans perform it on their own body every time they perform a physical action. Decision (thought) --> (telekinesis) Movement (matter). I decide to walk from A to B, and my body follows the command of my mind. Even assuming what Science tells us is true and accepting all of the indirect processes that result in our movement, an original application of telekinesis is still required.
Wow you're confused. You're claiming that the ability to move one's self with one's mind is on the same level as moving objects not directly tied to your brain. Hilarious.
Originally posted by Dr McBeefington
Wow you're confused. You're claiming that the ability to move one's self with one's mind is on the same level as moving objects not directly tied to your brain. Hilarious.
It proves (by that, I mean non philosophically of course, as we are relying on a correlation here (albeit an absurdly strong one)) that the movement of matter can be triggered by thought. Whether or not it's possible to do that to objects not directly tied to your brain is an uncertainty at this point, but the existence of telekinesis, and thought producing physical effects is not.
Originally posted by Mr Omiverseria
It proves (by that, I mean non philosophically of course, as we are relying on a correlation here (albeit an absurdly strong one)) that the movement of matter can be triggered by thought. Whether or not it's possible to do that to objects not directly tied to your brain is an uncertainty at this point, but the existence of telekinesis, and thought producing physical effects is not.
No, it proves body parts directly tied to the brain can be controlled by the brain. That is ALL.
Originally posted by Mr Omiverseria
It proves (by that, I mean non philosophically of course, as we are relying on a correlation here (albeit an absurdly strong one)) that the movement of matter can be triggered by thought. Whether or not it's possible to do that to objects not directly tied to your brain is an uncertainty at this point, but the existence of telekinesis, and thought producing physical effects is not.
I think you need to go and take Biology 101.
We can move our limbs because our brain sends commands to the muscles via the nervous system. It does not correlate to "thinking" about moving an inanimate object and suddenly making it move. Unless we somehow figure out some kind of "bluetooth" brain (a laughable concept), TK isn't happening. Not to mention such a brain would only work on similarly equipped objects.
Originally posted by Autokrat
We can move our limbs because our brain sends commands to the muscles via the nervous system.
Explain this in entirely precise, singular, literal terms, and then illustrate how cause and effect takes place, again, in precise terms, without some application of TK (thought causing physical change), because it would appear you're not looking at this as precisely as required.
"TK is not just a possibility, it's a certainty. Humans perform it on their own body every time they perform a physical action. Decision (thought) --> (telekinesis) Movement (matter). I decide to walk from A to B, and my body follows the command of my mind. Even assuming what Science tells us is true and accepting all of the indirect processes that result in our movement, an original application of telekinesis is still required."
As you can see, I am open to there being an extremely indirect application of telekinesis that causes the end result, but the fact remains that even if that were the case, a series of physical processes would have to take place that at the very core of things would have required a trigger following the original decision to make a voluntary movement. Whatever that trigger was, by definition it meets the concept behind telekinesis (thought causing physical change). At some point, thought would have had to have generated physical change for your original decision to cause the end product of the intent behind that decision.
Here, working under the above assumption, let's identify the steps that would be involved.
A - Deciding to make a physical motion.
B - All physical motions following that decision that lead to the intended physical motion.
C - Final, originally intended physical motion.
What you are essentially not addressing is how A ---> B. You are not addressing precisely how the physical changes associated with B are caused by the thought based decision associated with A, and not acknowledging how the necessary step between the two meets the definition of telekinesis.
Originally posted by Hewhoknowsall
What if we could have a device that acts as like a third limb and has a special nerve that connects to your brain? And your brain can send signals to it, like "move that rock". So the device projects a force field around the rock and moves it.It's plausible.
you honestly believe that? there's no such thing as telekinesis, and if you honestly believe there is, i'd like to see some hardcore evidence of this "telekinesis" in action...
everyone so far that has said the brain can only send messeges to things attached to it have a grasp on the real world...
now, the closest thing to this i can think of is: an implant being placed in the brain of a scientist that allowed him to control - very basically may i add - a mechanic arm across the internet...THAT is it...
Define "send messeges", and if it's an entirely physical thing, as I would imagine you're alluding to, a link between the original thought to do something, and the very immediate physical change that occurs, would have to exist if we were to assume a causal relationship between decision and motion, in which case telekinesis would be required by definition.
Disregarding what Science may suggest which I am personally rather dismissive of in the first place, it's entirely possible that the only reason we can apply telekinesis on our own bodies is because our senses essentially originate and extend outwards from our body, and that our thoughts and senses are extremely interconnected and interdependent and as such our application of telekinesis (an extension of our ability to think) has to act in accordance with our senses and their "location" with respect to the physical world. Thoughts?