Originally posted by Wild Shadow
you guys seem to the avoid the most obvious attack taht each team member would most likely go for that would put hulk down regardless.the neck stab. each member is known for using such an attack WWH or not he will not walk away from that when they manage to dogpile on him and exploit the attack.
WWH was near torn in half by Strange and recovered. A "neck stab" won't bother him. He'll definitely be walking away from that.
Dogpile? Do you know how strong WWH was? They will get flung away with the greatest ease.
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Ehh, I agree WWH wins this, most of the people WWH handled easily weren't that impressive. The top tiers he faced, he struggled against.
I dunno. The Avengers were easily put down.
The X-Men (though they slapped WWH around a bit) lay in crumpled heaps at WWH's feet before he decided to leave.
The FF4 got crushed.
Iron Man didn't stand a chance after the Spin Tech didn't work.
Though admittedly Juggernaut had the upper-hand I think and it was a stalemate against Sentry.
Edit: Struggled against Strange was well. He was getting whooped until Strange took over from the demon to help the people from getting crushed.
Originally posted by The Pict
I dunno. The Avengers were easily put down.
The X-Men (though they slapped WWH around a bit) lay in crumpled heaps at WWH's feet before he decided to leave.
The FF4 got crushed.
Iron Man didn't stand a chance after the Spin Tech didn't work.Though admittedly Juggernaut had the upper-hand I think and it was a stalemate against Sentry.
Edit: Struggled against Strange was well. He was getting whooped until Strange took over from the demon to help the people from getting crushed.
Well, i meant mostly that the fights were indeterminable. Sentry, Zom/Strange, Juggernaut.
Originally posted by jrodslam
In WWH when Darwin was draining, it was the gamma energy he was trying and not Hulks actual life force. Red's life drain via tentacles also work pretty fast.I think that may be the groups only chance to win. They lack a powerhouse.
Hulks gamma energy is his lifeforce ("gamma irradiated lifeforce"😉 As seen in these scans. When hulk isnt that angry pariah is able to drain him of his lifeforce. However when he gets pissed it just stops working. WWH is hulk at anger levels never before seen. Omega red isnt doin jackshit
Edit- here the right first scan http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/76f8fa91
http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/fa056157
Originally posted by Naija boy
Hulks gamma energy is his lifeforce ("gamma irradiated lifeforce"😉 As seen in this scan. When hulk isnt that angry pariah is able to drain him of his lifeforce. However when he gets pissed it just stops working. WWH is hulk at anger levels never before seen. Omega red isnt doin jackshithttp://mynetimages.com/viewimage/76f8fa91
http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/fa056157
"In a fit of mindless rage, you thrown off the desires of the strone?!?"
Meaning they no longer "desired" or wanted his life force anymore im gathering from that. Difference in not wanting it and it "just stopping" Looked like paiah didnt have control over it as to where Red is in full control of his abilities. Not quite the same.😬
Originally posted by jrodslam
"In a fit of mindless rage, you thrown off the desires of the strone?!?"Meaning they no longer "desired" or wanted his life force anymore im gathering from that. Difference in not wanting it and it "just stopping" Looked like paiah didnt have control over it as to where Red is in full control of his abilities. Not quite the same.😬
The spirits in the stone were what was sapping his energy. The "desires" of the spirits of stone were to absorb his energy. When he got angry HE (hulk) threw off said desires and stopped them from absorbing his energy. As is clearly shown, the absorbing ray is still on banner but when he gets angry he transforms into hulk despite it, which clearly shows its failure to work. Paraih was using the stone to absorb the energy and it failed when hulk got angry. That is clear as day. Whether he was doing it himself or using something else to absorb it is absolutely irrelevant. Further that scan was to show that Hulks lifeforce is his gamma energy and we saw WWH (the hulk in question here) easily ward off his gamma being drained. As i said earlier, Red isnt doing jack.
Originally posted by Naija boy
The spirits in the stone were what was sapping his energy. The "desires" of the spirits of stone were to absorb his energy. When he got angry HE (hulk) threw off said desires and stopped them from absorbing his energy. As is clearly shown, the absorbing ray is still on banner but when he gets angry he transforms into hulk despite it, which clearly shows its failure to work. Paraih was using the stone to absorb the energy and it failed when hulk got angry. That is clear as day. Whether he was doing it himself or using something else to absorb it is absolutely irrelevant. Further that scan was to show that Hulks lifeforce is his gamma energy and we saw WWH (the hulk in question here) easily ward off his gamma being drained. As i said earlier, Red isnt doing jack.
You mention when he got angry and turned to Hulk the stone stopped working because of THAT, but that seems a bit flawed. When the drainage first started, Banner was in Hulk form initially. I dont think it would be correct to assume that it stopped working because Hulk changed. From what was said, the spirits no longer "desired it", thus stopped doing it on its own. Not because it couldnt any longer. Its your assumption that it failed, but the text as well as the initial drainage says otherwise. Also, in WWH, the drainage was working. It was alot of it as Darwin said, but then again i wouldnt expect his draining ability to be as good as someone whos power is a life stealing ability. As youve stated, Red Hulk was able to drain Green Hulk and revert him back. Energy draining is part of Rulks powerset, thus making that ability more potent for him. Same would go for Red i reckon.
Originally posted by jrodslam
You mention when he got angry and turned to Hulk the stone stopped working because of THAT, but that seems a bit flawed. When the drainage first started, Banner was in Hulk form initially. I dont think it would be correct to assume that it stopped working because Hulk changed. From what was said, the spirits no longer "desired it", thus stopped doing it on its own. Not because it couldnt any longer. Its your assumption that it failed, but the text as well as the initial drainage says otherwise. Also, in WWH, the drainage was working. It was alot of it as Darwin said, but then again i wouldnt expect his draining ability to be as good as someone whos power is a life stealing ability. As youve stated, Red Hulk was able to drain Green Hulk and revert him back. Energy draining is part of Rulks powerset, thus making that ability more potent for him. Same would go for Red i reckon.
You are not reading the text properly at all. The text says " In a fit of rage you throw off the desires of the spirits of the stone?!?". IT NEVER says thye spirits no longer desired it. How the hell did u get that? Paraih clearly talks about Hulk throwing off the desires of the spirits of the stone which was referring to his energy being drained. He does this in a fit of rage indicating his anger. The stone didnt stop doing it on its own and there is no where that that is shown, stated or even alluded to in the panel. This is not even debatable as the language used is self explanatory.
Moreover Hulk easily overloaded Darwin when he tried to drain his energy. Saying that it being a part of reds powerset would make it more potent is absolutely baseless. Its a part of Darwins powerset to evolve abilities neccessary for situations. It has never been mentioned that the abilities he evolves are somehow weaker than those naturally born with said abilities. Red hulk has far better absorption feats than Omega red and so they arent even comparable. Being part of ur original powerset is completely irrelevant. Omega Red doesnt have feats showing him absorbing energy from someone with energy on WWH levels or resistance to it and thats what matters. As i said before Red isnt doing jack shit and WWH plows through these guys.
Originally posted by Naija boy
You are not reading the text properly at all. The text says " In a fit of rage you throw off the desires of the spirits of the stone?!?". IT NEVER says thye spirits no longer desired it. How the hell did u get that? Paraih clearly talks about Hulk throwing off the desires of the spirits of the stone which was referring to his energy being drained. He does this in a fit of rage indicating his anger. The stone didnt stop doing it on its own and there is no where that that is shown, stated or even alluded to in the panel. This is not even debatable as the language used is self explanatory.
Moreover Hulk easily overloaded Darwin when he tried to drain his energy. Saying that it being a part of reds powerset would make it more potent is absolutely baseless. Its a part of Darwins powerset to evolve abilities neccessary for situations. It has never been mentioned that the abilities he evolves are somehow weaker than those naturally born with said abilities. Red hulk has far better absorption feats than Omega red and so they arent even comparable. Being part of ur original powerset is completely irrelevant. Omega Red doesnt have feats showing him absorbing energy from someone with energy on WWH levels or resistance to it and thats what matters. As i said before Red isnt doing jack shit and WWH plows through these guys.
When the text says "You throw off the desires of the spirits..." What does that mean? To throw off the desires. To me, it means that if you desire something and try to take it, being thrown off of your desire means you no longer desire that which you crave. If you think otherwise, what is your interpretation? Like i stated, initially, there was no problem, so because Hulk went into a "mindless rage", he then became immune? Its like saying Hulk has 10 levels of anger, and youre able to drain if hes lvl's 1-5, but as soon as he pasts 5, he becomes immune. Yes Darwins powers allow him to evolve to fix situations, so i find it odd, that his powers didnt allow for his draining abilities to be amplified or evolve to where hed be able to take multiple hits. Yet it ported him out? Flawed. Darwin is a walking plot device and his powers are suppose to evolve to whatever is necessary. Overloaded? Where was this stated? He just said that there was so much of it and it was endless, but we all know thats not the case ala Red Hulk, so flawed yet again. Red has drained Wolverine to where he was out in seconds. Seconds. Hell, when Josh(Elixir) applied his death touch, it took away Hulks healing factor for a bit, and that allowed him to take some damage. I have no doubt that Reds Death Factor would be similar.
With all this said, im not saying the team wins nor loses. It will be difficult for them, but i dont see them getting swatted away as easily as most think.
Originally posted by jrodslam
When the text says "You throw off the desires of the spirits..." What does that mean? To throw off the desires. To me, it means that if you desire something and try to take it, being thrown off of your desire means you no longer desire that which you crave. If you think otherwise, what is your interpretation? Like i stated, initially, there was no problem, so because Hulk went into a "mindless rage", he then became immune? Its like saying Hulk has 10 levels of anger, and youre able to drain if hes lvl's 1-5, but as soon as he pasts 5, he becomes immune.
I've read the scan, too. I think Naija's interpretation is correct. The stone was trying (desiring) to drain Hulk of his gamma-irradiated lifeforce, but in Hulk's anger, he formed a resistance to it thru sheer act of will/rage. Seems pretty cut and dry.
Team ftw. Jobber War Hulk was awful. Hulk has always been a team wrecker, but the rest of Marvel Earth was severely downplayed... more than everyone usually is whenever it's the team(s) vs. global threat of the month scenario. Iron Man was doing pretty damned well on his own for a little while. If a few more mid-tiers or top-tiers where there to help him out, it wouldn't be so farfetched to believe they could win.
Xavier couldn't use telepathy on WWH
Hulk was nearly immobilized by Warpath. Brween Wolverine and Gorgon team can do the same, while Sabertooth rips his face off and Omega Red punctures tendons on Hulk's legs with his rentacles, preventing Hilk from shaking the rest off.
After that OR drains life of him, while all vital organs are being ripped and the head being torn off. The end.
Originally posted by jrodslam
When the text says "You throw off the desires of the spirits..." What does that mean? To throw off the desires. To me, it means that if you desire something and try to take it, being thrown off of your desire means you no longer desire that which you crave. If you think otherwise, what is your interpretation? Like i stated, initially, there was no problem, so because Hulk went into a "mindless rage", he then became immune? Its like saying Hulk has 10 levels of anger, and youre able to drain if hes lvl's 1-5, but as soon as he pasts 5, he becomes immune. Yes Darwins powers allow him to evolve to fix situations, so i find it odd, that his powers didnt allow for his draining abilities to be amplified or evolve to where hed be able to take multiple hits. Yet it ported him out? Flawed. Darwin is a walking plot device and his powers are suppose to evolve to whatever is necessary. Overloaded? Where was this stated? He just said that there was so much of it and it was endless, but we all know thats not the case ala Red Hulk, so flawed yet again. Red has drained Wolverine to where he was out in seconds. Seconds. Hell, when Josh(Elixir) applied his death touch, it took away Hulks healing factor for a bit, and that allowed him to take some damage. I have no doubt that Reds Death Factor would be similar.
With all this said, im not saying the team wins nor loses. It will be difficult for them, but i dont see them getting swatted away as easily as most think.
*Sigh*. This is not a matter of interpretation at all. This is a matter of simple reading comprehension and is not up for debate. Your so called interpretation has absolutely no relationship with the text. The text says "You throw off the desires of the stone in a fit of mindless rage!?!" How the hell can you claim that Hulk throwing off the desires of the spirits of the stone means that the spirits of the stone themselves didnt want to absorb his energy anymore? It was the Hulk who threw of the desires of the spirit of the stone and THAT is exactly why Paraih was so shocked and exclaimed the way he did. The spirits of the stone having their desires thrown off by the Hulk indicates that Hulk stopped the spirits "desires" (which were to drain his energy) in a fit of rage. Not that the spirits willfully stopped draining his energy. There is nothing to support that even in the slightest.
Also it seems you dont know much about the hulk. the hulk has shown on NUMEROUS occasions that he indeed does have different levels of anger. And when he gets to a certain stage of anger things which worked on him previously dont work anymore. As seen in the examples below.
http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/125694c8
http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/63c07aab
This is common fact about the hulk.
Darwins powers allow him to evolve to the best means to counter situations and the best strategy against hulk is usually to drain him and return him to banner. However the problem was that WWH was using FAR FAR more gamma energy than past hulks (we saw the amount of energy he contained towards the end of WWH). Equating WWH to current savage hulk and then outright calling the instance flawed is just inane. Darwin said it that it was endless which indicates that he couldnt absorb it all or he would be overloaded. What works on savage hulk will not neccessarily work on WWH or any angrier version of Hulk because of the differing levels of anger and the huge gap in their energy levels.
Red being able to drain wolverine is an absolutely laughable basis for him being to drain WWH who has shown energy levels astronomically higher than anything wolverine can even dream of. Further, Elixirs death touch isnt even at all the same as Red lifeforce draining power. Elixirs death touch isnt a "drain" at all bot rather him manipulating matter on a genetic level. so that is totally irrelevant as well.
Team gets thrashed as i said before.
WWHulk stood in one place for like five to ten minutes being shot up by hundreds of soldiers who were firing thousands of rounds of adamantium bullets. The minute he got free of Strange's spell, WWHulk trashed the army with ease. So adamantium advantages aren't that great.
Also, it's a big stretch to say WWHulk "struggled" against anyone. He was constantly portrayed as solely interested in his ultimate agenda. WWHulk vs Juggernaut was so half-hearted. WWHulk vs Hercules didn't have anything to do with power. That was skill. Hercules has centuries piled on centuries of combat experience. Any top-tier would have problems with him. But at the end of the fight, who was the one with the face that looked like freezer burnt hamburger? Zom/Strange wasn't much of a struggle either. He blew a few holes in Hulk, and then got KTFO. Even the final fight with Sentry was no biggie. WWHulk seemed to know from pretty much the beginning of the fight that he was going to beat Sentry. Saying sh*t like "You don't want this fight." and "You think your stupid machines can stop him?"
This Team is nothing WWHulk can't handle. WWHulk takes this 10/10 in a very one-sided f*cking sh*t stomp. Seriously, four slightly super-human street levelers with adamantium weapons? They lose every time.