Count Dooku vs. Kyle Katarn

Who Wins?

Location - Bespin - Cloud City - On a Landing Pad

Weapons and Environmental Obstacles - Long Drops / Falls around the Landing Pad hence it being ''CLOUD'' city, Cargo Containers and boxes around the Platform hence it being a "LANDING PAD". Also Security Guards. ----- Lightsabers and Force Only.

Level of Skill - Count Dooku <Sith Lord (Episode II)> / Kyle Katarn <Jedi Master (Prime)>

(Please use Canon information and use references to back your claims. I don't want this topic to be turned into a farce.)

Thank You.

Enjoy
(If you can)

Sabers-Dooku.
Force-Katarn.

I could swear this was done recently.

i think i did it recently.

Lol I could swear almost all theversus threads were done recently.

Katarn wins. You said landing pad right? Katarn is more proficient in the force, and isn't afraid of using Dark Side powers. He can just throw dooku off the platform with his superior force powers (I'm not really sure that they are superior though) lol

He also has imp training, and uses various weapons that dooku doesn't. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Kyle_Katarn

the pic that says Kyle Katarn often carried copious amounts of armament.

Out of curiosity what has Kyle Katarn actually displayed with the Force?

I think the Count has this. Katarn is good, but do you think he'd have been able to dominate Obi-wan as easily as Dooku did?

Possibly. You must remember Katarn comes from a completely different Breed of Jedi than Dooku did. NJO Jedi aren't afraid to play dirty.

Even though I would think that Katarn has this.

For reasons of

1 - He's Younger (Does not mean much in terms of the force but it must count for something.)

2 - He killed Dark Jedi of the likes of Jerec and Desann with Desann having fresh Valley of the Jedi energy within himself.

3 - He held his own against Caedus who is more powerful than Anakin Skywalker and we all know what happened to Dooku at the hands of Anakin.

I'm just pointed out what I think would be relevant to Katarn's side.

Now for Dooku

1) More Experience
2) Beat Anakin (EP II) and Obi-Wan-Kenobi (EP II & III) like it was nothing. I did not even see him break a sweat and then he held his own somewhat against Yoda.
3) Roughly the third best Lightsaber Duelist in the entire galaxy at that time.

For number 3 I gotta point out Kyle is third to Luke Skywalker as well. or at least seems to be so. I don't know I still stand by Kyle though.

I'm not negating anything, just contextualizing.

Originally posted by MasterAshenVor
Even though I would think that Katarn has this.

For reasons of

1 - He's Younger (Does not mean much in terms of the force but it must count for something.)

2 - He killed Dark Jedi of the likes of Jerec and Desann with Desann having fresh Valley of the Jedi energy within himself.

3 - He held his own against Caedus who is more powerful than Anakin Skywalker and we all know what happened to Dooku at the hands of Anakin.

2.) Jerec was imbued with the Valley as well. But measuring up Jerec and Desann to Dooku is kinda iffy. I just don't see the High Inquisitor and a scarcely trained failed Jedi Padawan able to compete with Dooku. Least not in sabers. Jerec apparently had some god-powers.

3.) A>B>C, but it can work. Caedus=Vader (in-universe opinions aside) roughly, but does Vader=tEh z0ne Anakin? In terms of clarity and focus as they're combined with a saber duel?

Originally posted by MasterAshenVor
I'm just pointed out what I think would be relevant to Katarn's side.

Now for Dooku

1) More Experience
2) Beat Anakin (EP II) and Obi-Wan-Kenobi (EP II & III) like it was nothing. I did not even see him break a sweat and then he held his own somewhat against Yoda.
3) Roughly the third best Lightsaber Duelist in the entire galaxy at that time.

For number 3 I gotta point out Kyle is third to Luke Skywalker as well. or at least seems to be so. I don't know I still stand by Kyle though.

2.) AotC Anakin would get tooled by both Katarn and Dooku (obviously, he already did with one) so he's a "meh". Same with Kenobi. A little display of Force prowess seems to do it with him. Soresu be damned.

3.) True. And Battlemaster Katarn merits like the same thing.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
1.) Arguable. Experience is measured in deeds more than lifespan. Amount of experience gained per deed is subjective to endless debate. Katarn's many sexy adventures vs. Dooku's many crazy nights. Who knows?

Haha, Dooku has the sexier accent, I think he wins that one. No, youre right, we dont really know.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
2.) AotC Anakin would get tooled by both Katarn and Dooku (obviously, he already did with one) so he's a "meh". Same with Kenobi. A little display of Force prowess seems to do it with him. Soresu be damned.

I really have a hard time seeing Katarn toss Obi-wan around the way Dooku was able to. We know that Dooku's force powers were basically enough that Yoda couldn't defeat him with just the Force.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
3.) True. And Battlemaster Katarn merits like the same thing.

Well, I actually put Dooku at fourth, but its third or fourth out of TEN THOUSAND very capable Jedi and Sith. Katarn was way up their (obviously behind Luke and Jacen, possibly Corran as well.) The bigger difference though is that Dooku, Mace, Yoda, and Sidious were basically in a league of their own. Kyle would have a hard time against Saba, Kyp, Solusar, Jaina, Mara, Lumiya (maybe even lose to her), and so on. He's good, but not in a higher league like Dooku was.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Haha, Dooku has the sexier accent, I think he wins that one. No, youre right, we dont really know.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
I really have a hard time seeing Katarn toss Obi-wan around the way Dooku was able to. We know that Dooku's force powers were basically enough that Yoda couldn't defeat him with just the Force.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Well, I actually put Dooku at fourth, but its third or fourth out of TEN THOUSAND very capable Jedi and Sith. Katarn was way up their (obviously behind Luke and Jacen, possibly Corran as well.) The bigger difference though is that Dooku, Mace, Yoda, and Sidious were basically in a league of their own. Kyle would have a hard time against Saba, Kyp, Solusar, Jaina, Mara, Lumiya (maybe even lose to her), and so on. He's good, but not in a higher league like Dooku was.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I hope you're not insinuating that Jeff Bennett's multi-talented voice loses him ground here? He could voice Saruman if he wanted.

Touche.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Though not as problematic as the KotOR fellas, it's still rather difficult to compare the NJO to the PT. Not to mention I don't know much about Katarn outside Outcast and people's talk of him holding off Caedus--who more or less rivals Vader. In strict use of offensive Force powers I see Katarn winning.

Could you see Katarn obliterating Obi-wan the way Dooku did? How about matching Yoda in a Force fight? I can't, so I'm giving that to Dooku.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Well Kyle was the Battlemaster for a reason. I don't know anything about Saba or Kam so I can't say anything, but placing on par(ish) or under the likes of Kyp, Jaina, and Mara is pretty damn good, especially considering where they themselves stand. And earning recognition from Caedus is something too. That said, Dooku perfected a saber style specifically designed for duelling, and it's a style Katarn is unfamiliar with (I assume). In a strict saber duel I can't see Katarn winning.

The Battlemaster title just means that he was the guy who taught people lightsaber stuff. It's similar to saying that a physics professor at a university is better at physics than a guy running CERN. Yoda, Mace, Depa, Obi-wan, Anakin, and many others were all arguably better than Drallig. I think the same is true for Kyle. He is way up there, but he has the title do to his position as the head lightsaber instructor.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Could you see Katarn obliterating Obi-wan the way Dooku did? How about matching Yoda in a Force fight? I can't, so I'm giving that to Dooku.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
The Battlemaster title just means that he was the guy who taught people lightsaber stuff. It's similar to saying that a physics professor at a university is better at physics than a guy running CERN. Yoda, Mace, Depa, Obi-wan, Anakin, and many others were all arguably better than Drallig. I think the same is true for Kyle. He is way up there, but he has the title do to his position as the head lightsaber instructor.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
As of LotF, I can see Katarn grabbing Kenobi's windpipe and hucking him. And I can also see Katarn bringing down some rocks and blasting a little lightning.

We've never seen Katarn demonstrate anything to show he is that powerful though. Nothing I can think of at least.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I know. Like I said, I don't know much about Katarn's saber skills. I base my position on his abilities on Caedus' recognition of his skills. Sith Lord that's second to Luke saying you're good... way to go Kyle.

Second to Luke by a large margin. And yeah, Jacen said Kyle was good, but I think he'd say the same about Dooku as well.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
We've never seen Katarn demonstrate anything to show he is that powerful though. Nothing I can think of at least.

Originally posted by Darth_Glentract
Second to Luke by a large margin. And yeah, Jacen said Kyle was good, but I think he'd say the same about Dooku as well.

Who said that Makashi was not used in the NJO? I've never seen any evidence of that.

Ataru / Djem So / Shii Cho and Niman were used if I'm not mistaken

So why not Makashi?

There was no one to teach Luke's Order the old styles, that's why they developed the Strong, Medium, and Fast styles. Makashi especially would have been foreign, even amongst the PT Jedi, there were few who practiced it. Being designed for strictly lightsaber-lightsaber combat, it would'nt have been very practical in the age where there were no more saber-wielding opponents.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
There was no one to teach Luke's Order the old styles, that's why they developed the Strong, Medium, and Fast styles. Makashi especially would have been foreign, even amongst the PT Jedi, there were few who practiced it. Being designed for strictly lightsaber-lightsaber combat, it wouldn't have been very practical in the age where there were no more saber-wielding opponents.

Originally posted by mattatom
I'm doing this because i'm bored.

Plus, it's just too damn fun to catch the Canadian on these things. (No whatshesaid stuff!)