Originally posted by Eternal Idol
The Sentry, the Hood, Daken, Bullseye, Ares, Moonstone, Gargan Venom, the resurrected Scourge victims, etc.---All in Osborn's pocket. They aren't his allies, ready to help; they're his mercenaries, ready to carry out his will. Mercenaries count as resources.
Not sure how that helps your point. Normans mercenaries/troops > Ras.
You also need to distinguish between The Hoods troops and Obsborns I have a feeling thats what you might be trying to say. At any rate individually they both have more formidable troops and arguably equal resources.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
I don't know much about Ras Al Ghul, but I know enough to know he has enough assassins to have the Punisher killed without having to enter the fight himself.
More assassins than The Hood? You sure about that?
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
Turning it into a prep match is what wins it for Ras. If it had been "al Ghul + assassins against the Punisher with his Dark Reign arsenal, frontal assault starting x distance apart" scenario, then I'd give it to the Punisher.
I fail to see how hes going to do that when both The Hoods troops are more dangerous. The standard troops that Punisher was fighting were enhanced and highly trained and he killed alot of them. League of assassins are not enhanced in general eventhough some of them might be.
Originally posted by Deadline
Not sure how that helps your point. Normans mercenaries/troops > Ras.You also need to distinguish between The Hoods troops and Obsborns I have a feeling thats what you might be trying to say. At any rate individually they both have more formidable troops and arguably equal resources.
I know we're discussing a comic character who is so bad-ass, he can take on a few metas and entire platoons on his own. Still, the numbers have to count for something after a point. Again, I don't know much about al Ghul's assassins, but I imagine they're more than likely DC's version of the Hand.
Originally posted by Deadline
More assassins than The Hood? You sure about that?
Wouldn't matter if he has more assassins than the Hood. He only needs enough.
Originally posted by Deadline
I fail
Sorry. Couldn't help it.
Originally posted by Deadline
I fail to see how hes going to do that when both The Hoods troops are more dangerous. The standard troops that Punisher was fighting were enhanced and highly trained and he killed alot of them. League of assassins are not enhanced in general eventhough some of them might be.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
The Hood's mercenaries are Osborne's indirect assets.
That doesnt make them part of his organisation. Hoods assests are his own and so are Osborns they could use each others due to their arrangement but Norman is one organisation and the Hood is another. Hell if The Hood wanted to he could tell Norman to **** off it would be harder for members of the DA to do that.
Doesnt help your argument anyway. Norman is still > Ras.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
I know we're discussing a comic character who is so bad-ass, he can take on a few metas and entire platoons on his own. Still, the numbers have to count for something after a point. Again, I don't know much about al Ghul's assassins, but I imagine they're more than likely DC's version of the Hand.
Again...you are missing the point as usual. You need to prove that Ras has more goons, than The Hood because The Hood did the same thing and failed.
Originally posted by Eternal IdolWouldn't matter if he has more assassins than the Hood. He only needs enough.
ha-som
Sorry. Couldn't help it.
Are you serious was that actually supposed to be a point?
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
The Punisher is a total hard-ass and the weapons he had in Dark Reign could give him the edge. I just wiki'd the League of Assassins, and if it only consists of the members listed, then I think Castle takes it every time. If the League includes those listed + countless cannon fodder ninjas, then the League takes it.
At any rate you need to prove he has more goons than Hood.
I don't have to prove anything, because I never claimed Ra's had more henchmen than Osborn or the Hood. What I have said is that large numbers can and probably will overwhelm Castle. It doesn't take groups as powerful as the Dark Avengers and the Hood's criminal syndicate working together to kill the Punisher, which is what you seem to be suggesting.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
The Punisher is a total hard-ass and the weapons he had in Dark Reign could give him the edge. I just wiki'd the League of Assassins, and if it only consists of the members listed, then I think Castle takes it every time. If the League includes those listed + countless cannon fodder ninjas, then the League takes it.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
I don't have to prove anything, because I never claimed Ra's had more henchmen than Osborn or the Hood. What I have said is that large numbers can and probably will overwhelm Castle.
Yes actually you do, but I won't elaborate.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
It doesn't take groups as powerful as the Dark Avengers and the Hood's criminal syndicate working together to kill the Punisher, which is what you seem to be suggesting.
The people that Norman and The Hood sent after The Punisher are more formidable than what Ras has.
The quote changes nothing they do have some of those listed but im pretty sure that some of those listed are not members of the league anymore such as Cassandra and Lady Shiva (not under Ras anyway). Nyssa is also dead.
I suspect they do have 'countless' assassins but so does The Hood and he failed to kill Punisher. Also the people that the Hood sent after the Punisher are more formidable than what Ras has.
Hood goons >>> Ras.
Originally posted by DeadlineFrank has never EVER been able to kill a guy on Ra's level.
Ermm I dunno about that for starters Hood and Norman could pull-off what Ras did in Tower Of Babel because he has an expert ahcker like Microchip on his side.Frank is also an expert on ninjuitsu he doesnt just know about the martialk arts but traps they use and has created an antidote for a poison (the said ninja had been taught poison by a ninja grandmaster).
High Evolutinary has attempted to kill Frank an failed by the way, so has Doom. Doom underestimated him but was still impressed and hes better than Ras
Frank tried to kill kingpin for years and he was never more then an expense post for Kingpin.
Frank is not and has not ever been on a level to threaten someone like Osborn Kingpin or Ra.
Originally posted by godking
Frank has never EVER been able to kill a guy on Ra's level.
Hes come pretty close.
Originally posted by godking
Frank tried to kill kingpin for years and he was never more then an expense post for Kingpin.
You make that sound like thats a small thing.
Originally posted by godking
Frank is not and has not ever been on a level to threaten someone like Osborn Kingpin or Ra.
Wrong. Obvoulsy the reason why those guys were trying to kill him was because he wasn't a threat. facepalm
On at least one oocassion KP has been saved by sheer luck (Punisher got knocked over by Batroc he wasn't even trying to fight Frank and was trying to find an antidote for a posion).
Punisher came extremely close to killing Norman, Sentry saved his arse. Taking into a account that Ras doesn't have somebody like Sentry in his team Punisher wins.
Haterade?
Originally posted by DeadlinePunisher was an expense post for kingpin at best he might have cost kingpin a million here or there but he was never going to bring him down. He was an annoying fly that kingpin once in a while took a swat at.
Hes come pretty close.You make that sound like thats a small thing.
Wrong. Obvoulsy the reason why those guys were trying to kill him was because he wasn't a threat. facepalm
On at least one oocassion KP has been saved by sheer luck (Punisher got knocked over by Batroc he wasn't even trying to fight Frank and was trying to find an antidote for a posion).
Punisher came extremely close to killing Norman, Sentry saved his arse. Taking into a account that Ras doesn't have somebody like Sentry in his team Punisher wins.
Haterade?
Doom wanted to kill punisher as a bet he has no personal interest in him.
Ra does not need a sentry to send frank on a wild goose chase or manipulate him inot killing his enemies as Kingpin did for years.
Originally posted by godking
Punisher was an expense post for kingpin at best he might have cost kingpin a million here or there but he was never going to bring him down. He was an annoying fly that kingpin once in a while took a swat at.
Did you hear what I just said? I just told you he could have killed KP at least once but was saved by sheer luck. Read Eurohit.
No he was more than an annoying fly stop making shit up. Flies don't nearly kill people.
Originally posted by godking
Doom wanted to kill punisher as a bet he has no personal interest in him.
Doom >>> Ras. Actually he had to save face but since Punisher blackmailed him he backed off.
Originally posted by godking
Ra does not need a sentry to send frank on a wild goose chase or manipulate him inot killing his enemies as Kingpin did for years.
Again Punisher almost killed him but was saved. I suspect your twisting the truth, KPs enemies were Punishers enemies.
You missed the point. Punisher nearly killed Norman and Sentry saved his arse.
Norman > Ras.
Ra's wins.
Osborn was going after Punisher plus half of the MU heroes at the time and still got the job done. Imagine what Osborn could have accomplished if he'd focused only on Frank. 😂
Ra's has a worldwide network of people and resources. If he got it in his head that Frank was to be eliminated then it would happen. Just ask the JLA. ✅
ABC logic and hollow comparisons of Character A >>>> Character B >>>> Character C are pointless. I could easily say the same things in reverse order and it would still only be my opinion without some shred of proof. 😬
Frank just doesn't have the resources to trump Ra's. Osborn got him while going after the Mighty Avengers, New Avengers, X-Men, FF, Stark, Spider-Man, Banner, etc. 😎
Originally posted by Badabing
Ra's wins.Osborn was going after Punisher plus half of the MU heroes at the time and still got the job done. Imagine what Osborn could have accomplished if he'd focused only on Frank. 😂
Yes but Norman > Ras, for example Norman has Sentry. Osborn only manged to do it because of The Hood. It could also be argued that Hood > Ras.
Originally posted by Badabing
Ra's has a worldwide network of people and resources. If he got it in his head that Frank was to be eliminated then it would happen. Just ask the JLA. ✅
So does The Hood and he failed. The Hood could have also achieved what Ras did.
Ras also got beaten by Anarky and Ras only seems to have done something on that scale once. Anarky > JLA?
Originally posted by Badabing
ABC logic and hollow comparisons of Character A >>>> Character B >>>> Character C are pointless. I could easily say the same things in reverse order and it would still only be my opinion without some shred of proof. 😬
You're using ABC logic as well. Punisher has never fought Ras before so the best comparisons are Norman, The Hood etc.
Originally posted by Badabing
Frank just doesn't have the resources to trump Ra's. Osborn got him while going after the Mighty Avengers, New Avengers, X-Men, FF, Stark, Spider-Man, Banner, etc. 😎
Again he only manged to do that because of The Hood.
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
So what you're saying is, Osborn was only able to have the Punisher killed because he had an army of superhumans, and would not be able to accomplish the same using legions of ordinary soldiers and mercenaries?I guess the Viet Cong army was lucky Castle went AWOL when his family was killed.
What im saying is Norman > Ras and he manged to kill him because of The Hood. So the point is moot.
Not only that despite the resources Norman has Punisher still nearly killed him. If it wasn't for Sentry Norman would have been dead. Ras doesn't have half the firepower that Norman has but you still think he will win.
Originally posted by DTM
Sheesh, if this is Punisher vs. Ras AND all of his worldwide resources, I have little choice but to go Ras (hardly close to a fair fight really). If this is simply Frank vs. Ras alone, Ill give the more than not win percentage to The Punisher.
Except The Hood has Ras resources and then some and failed to kill Frank. In fact I don't even see how the hell hes going to kill him. Nobodies actualy given a reason so far except thats its Ras.