Is Luke Skywalker a Mary Sue?

In the late books i start getting the impression that Skywalker is broken, as evidenced by the curstomp battles he delivered to a number of characers.
Your opinions? Do you agree?

He's older?

Wut?

And yes, he is certainly a Sue. Though he has good reason to be. Plus he's pretty stupid and easily manipulated. But he's still too much more powefull than every other character in the books, its getting to the point where he's never in any danger.

hes only a stu in terms of power. but personality wise hes dumb as shit which limits his powers! hes like the peter patrelli of star wars.

Haha, so true...

Kinda. Depends on who's writing him. There are times when he is clearly a Deus Ex Machina; there are other times when he struggles with nobodies like Lumiya, Lady Rhea, et al.

I'd like to reiterate how Lumiya is hardly a nobody. Lumiya owned Mara Jade, for example. A nobody, in my humble opinion, would be a Johun or a Bandon.

Originally posted by truejedi
I'd like to reiterate how Lumiya is hardly a nobody. Lumiya owned Mara Jade, for example. A nobody, in my humble opinion, would be a Johan or a Bandon.

Originally posted by mattatom
Do not lump Bandon in with this 'Johan' who i'm pretty sure, doesn't exist.

say what now? doesn't exist? whatever are you talking about? And now you have misspelled his name! how silly of you! 🙄

truejedi
I'd like to reiterate how Lumiya is hardly a nobody. Lumiya owned Mara Jade, for example.

She must have "owned" Mara Jade in somewhere other than the Legacy of the Force series.

truejedi
A nobody, in my humble opinion, would be a Johun or a Bandon.

Lumiya, like Mara Jade, was an exceptionally skilled spy and assassin. Not a prolific duelist or Master of the Force. She is nobody compared to any of the true greats. Do you honestly see Palpatine struggling with her? With either of them? With both of them at the same time? Or Yoda? Or Dooku? Or Mace? Or Vader? Or Marek? Or Maul? Or Qui-Gon?

in the book before sacrifice(which i don't own),I think i remember that Mara makes a fatal error directly before she and Lumiya are grabbed by ship.

Though in the final fight with lumiya and Luke,it was incredibly one-sided.

of course not, to all of those listed opponents, but one doesn't have to be Yoda to avoid being a "nobody". If you used Nobody on someone like Lumiya, you have nothing left with which to christen the actual nobodies.

truejedi
in the book before sacrifice(which i don't own),I think i remember that Mara makes a fatal error directly before she and Lumiya are grabbed by ship.

The fight between them is roughly even; Mara and Lumiya each nearly kill each other. While Mara ends up worse off, it's because she's completely organic whereas Lumiya is the beneficiary of mechanical supplements. Nowhere is it one sided.

truejedi
Though in the final fight with lumiya and Luke,it was incredibly one-sided.

Oh Lord. Please, please don't go there again. Luke did not WTFpwn her in a dazzling display of superior skill or technique. He was pissed and, like Anakin to Obi-Wan, simply pushed her back until she lost her footing and nearly fell to her death. He did not disarm her, crush her, annihilate her.

truejedi
of course not, to all of those listed opponents, but one doesn't have to be Yoda to avoid being a "nobody". If you used Nobody on someone like Lumiya, you have nothing left with which to christen the actual nobodies.

She's a nobody compared to those people. They wouldn't struggle with her.

nice sig gideon

Luke did not WTFpwn her in a dazzling display of superior skill or technique.

He ... simply pushed her back until she lost her footing and nearly fell to her death.

Truth to be told i kinda liked Lumiya. Compared to Jacen, she was a shining paragon of sense and style.
But... you know, all she should've really done to actually succeed with her goals was to let herself be arrested/killed in the Sacrifice. And she, in fact, knew that and pointed that to Jacen. Strange...

I sense contradiction between these 2 sentences.

So "pushing her back until she loses her footing and falls to her death" is WTFpwning her with a dazzling display of skill or technique?

i would say what he did to push her off the cliff DEFINITLY qualifies as a "technique." according to the definition of a technique. So yes, i'd say, his technique, to drive her back and off the cliff,was dazzingly successful.

luke never intentionally performs techniques that would kill someone, hes just too stupid to realize whats lethal and what isnt.

he was pretty BadA in that though.

He catches her as she starts to fall, says "I'll never let you fall." and then cuts her head off. Ridiculous.

What was there history again? There was romance there someplace, wasn't there?

luke didnt mean to behead her though

truejedi
i would say what he did to push her off the cliff DEFINITLY qualifies as a "technique." according to the definition of a technique. So yes, i'd say, his technique, to drive her back and off the cliff,was dazzingly successful.

Well, as cute as that is, it doesn't make a bit of difference. In fact, Lumiya is the one who has the upper hand during the initial portion of the fight,

"And then [Lumiya] cracked [the lightwhip], sending forks of dark energy crackling into the ground at his feet, making him jump back before he sprand forward again and brought the lightsaber around in a right-to-left arc that she parried with the whips handle. He leapt out of range of the whirling tails again and again, then she paused and he edged closer again."

"She drew back her arm and brought the lightwhip crackling through the air, missing Luke by centimeters. He lunged at her again and again, driven back each time. She'd slow sooner or later. But so would he."

Luke attempts to attack are constantly nullified and he, in fact, loses ground.

When she tries to raise the whip again, he rushes in and denies her the chance to "get the whip traveling at its maximum lethal speed." It says he forced her back, step by step, as she tried to maintain the distance she needed [to gain that maximum lethal speed].

"One -- two -- three -- four; she blocked him, handle held this way, then that, using the whip like a short lightsaber to deflect him. But Luke didn't pause or shift direction to wrong-foot her. He drove her like a battering ram toward the edge of the mesa, pushing her within meters, then a step, of the edge.

Lumiya held the whip handle in both hands like a staff and blocked his downward sweep. For a moment they were locked in a stalemate, pushing against each other and grunting with the effort, with only sounds of exertion because they had nothing left to say to each other."

And then she lost her footing.

Sorry, TJ, that's not a dazzling display of superior technique, period. So let it go.