Cypher (Douglas Ramsey) vs Batgirl (Cassandra Cain)

The version of Cypher is the one from Necrosha and onwards

1. h2h only

2. They both get mellee blades and shurikens

I think he stomps her ugly.

this should attract some posts

Does he even have any advantages over her?

He can read body movements perfectly. She can read body movements perfectly. She's been training her entire life in combat and knows just about everything there is to know about hand to hand. He has not. Physically she should be faster, stronger, etc..

Originally posted by Q99
Does he even have any advantages over her?

He can read body movements perfectly. She can read body movements perfectly. She's been training her entire life in combat and knows just about everything there is to know about hand to hand. He has not.

But he can read the rest of the world too, not just body language, that might give him an edge in using the terrain and battlefield against her, like anticipating patterns in incoming traffic in an urban fight. His powers are also more intuitive.

Maybe he can 'hack' her like he did magma and the phalanx virus.

Originally posted by 753
But he can read the rest of the world too, not just body language, that might give him an edge in using the terrain and battlefield against her. His powers are also more intuitive.

No, she has no problem judging the terrain and such too.

And no, it doesn't get more intuitive than hardwired into the brain as a first language from birth. That's the point, it is totally intuitive to her, combat is first nature.

She's around peak human and can pull moves that aren't mentally possible for other humans, he isn't and can't.

Doug is outmatched in combat.

Maybe he can 'hack' her like he did magma and the phalanx virus.

He could do that because Magma had a techno-virus in her. Cassandra doesn't.

Ramsey sounds bad@$$ from what i read since his revival his power seems to be far higher then what cassie is capable of achieving or so it seems from my point of view with him taking on his team mates.

Originally posted by Q99
No, she has no problem judging the terrain and such too.

And no, it doesn't get more intuitive than hardwired into the brain as a first language from birth. That's the point, it is totally intuitive to her, combat is first nature.

She's around peak human and can pull moves that aren't mentally possible for other humans, he isn't and can't.

Doug is outmatched in combat.

He could do that because Magma had a techno-virus in her. Cassandra doesn't.

Actually that wasnt the reason, he could do that to magma because he can read anything and speak anything (everything is language to him), so he decoded amara and created a language specific for her in order to persuade her. This the same principle behind him hacking the phalanx virus by 'asking politely' in a language it understood.

She may have good terrain reading skills but they certainly can't compare to his own. He translates anything.

besides, his powers arent limited to reading, he can 'speak' what he reads intuitively as well, like when he spoke violence and fought the new mutants like a top tier with no real MA training or experience.

Originally posted by 753

She may have good terrain reading skills but they certainly can't compare to his own. He translates anything.

But in practical terms, there's not enough room in 'better than Cass' to get much in the way of advantage.

Doug has become a combat badass because he has *one* of Cassandra's advantages. He might be able to pull the hacking thing, but in hand to hand or with weapons, she wins.

Originally posted by Q99
But in practical terms, there's not enough room in 'better than Cass' to get much in the way of advantage.

Doug has become a combat badass because he has *one* of Cassandra's advantages. He might be able to pull the hacking thing, but in hand to hand or with weapons, she wins.

Yes, I supose he might lack the experience and formal MA skills to take her down for a majority even if he is more powerfull. I think it's close though.