Originally posted by Wild Shadow
facepalm2Athiesm is a belief in no gods or supernatural beings,realms or after life...
^ belief..
it doesnt have to me complicated with ceremonies and traditions in order to be considered a personal belief. it is a very basic none structured belief at its simplest lvl.
No, it isn't a belief. I'm sorry but pointing an arrow up at your sentence and then saying "belief' after it doesn't change much.
Atheism is not a belief in no God, it is no belief in a God.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
I hope you don't think you're winning here.
Of course I can’t win when talking to a RELIGIOUS person like yourself. In other words, regardless of what you are saying, you sound just like a Christian.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
You think that because atheists defend their positions and describe their views that it is a belief? That's horrible logic. Atheism is a lack of belief. Whether you want to compare it to religion or even be remotely akin to religion is your own initiative but that won't suddenly turn it into a belief. I've met a lot of religious folk who'd like atheism to be an organization or belief like theirs so they could take some pressure off of the crimes that religion has performed and the past and, depending on the religion, still performs today.
A lack of belief is still a belief. You would have to have never heard of the concept of a god in order to be the type of atheist that you claim to be.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
Then you may have worded your previous statement incorrectly. You made it sound as if someone had falsely "made up" all of the wars and death of the past.
Sorry that you misunderstood me.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
No, Shakyamunison. It's not a religion at all.
Atheism is just like some of the New Age religions I have read about. They do not tell you how to live your life like some religions do. For example, there is a New Age religion that believes in angels. You don’t have to believe in Christianity or anything. These people do not have meetings, or a holy book. They only have one thing in common, and that is a belief in angels. Now I don’t believe in angels, but it would be silly to call myself a anti-angelist. The fact you use the word Atheist to describe your anti-belief, is what makes it a belief.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
You can hold that position all that you'd like but it's not a religious organization at all. Even if all of the atheists get together and call it "SUPER DESTRUCTO ATHEISM," start donning black robes and killing people with swords, it still wouldn't be a sodding religion. The whole belief system of religious belief usually relies on creationism or the presence of supernatural entities and we all know that atheists are strongly against that. A religion also has to contain a rule system and atheism doesn't. I might add that we are also missing eschatology from our "religion."
I guess you have never heard of Buddhism.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
To wrap this up, another large part of religion is providing you with a lifestyle or providing you with a philosophy to live by. Atheism, again, lacks that. Being an atheism does not mean that you will live a certain way to avoid sin or that jazz. Atheists have a broad variety of lifestyles, morals and ethics.
Your experience with other religions seems to be very limited.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
I'm sorry but I am afraid we lack far too many key ingredients of religion to be even remotely considered one.
Atheism is not an organized religion, but there are a lot of religions in the world that are not organized. Just the fact you identify as a group with a common belief (or anti-belief) is enough to start.
Thank you for giving me the last word.
Originally posted by King Kandy
Atheism is not a belief at all... like I said earlier, defining lack of belief as a belief itself makes everything conceivable a belief, removing the value of even having the word in the first place.
If to not make a choice is still a choice, then to not believe in something is still a belief.
Originally posted by Shakyamunison
If to not make a choice is still a choice, then to not believe in something is still a belief.
Terri Shiavo was an atheist, she did not believe in god, and since she didn't have brain functioning she didn't believe anything at all, actually.
Of course I can’t win when talking to a RELIGIOUS person like yourself. In other words, regardless of what you are saying, you sound just like a Christian.
Could you be any more naive? Is there a certain way a Christian is supposed to sound?
A lack of belief is still a belief. You would have to have never heard of the concept of a god in order to be the type of atheist that you claim to be.
No, it really isn't a belief and saying it is so, again, doesn't make it so. It's like saying that having a basket that has no apples in it still means that there's apples in it. It makes no sense. Atheism is the disbelief of God(s). Here is the definition of disbelief:
"Refusal or reluctance to believe."
I cannot really make it any more simple without bringing out large, colorful blocks and books with pictures, Shakyamunison.
Sorry that you misunderstood me.
How can you be so crass when you failed to correctly word your sentences? You cannot expect me to have a serious discussion with you when you're being so daft.
Read your post:
Religion is something we humans made up, just like all the wars and death, that we humans caused.
Atheism is just like some of the New Age religions I have read about. They do not tell you how to live your life like some religions do. For example, there is a New Age religion that believes in angels. You don’t have to believe in Christianity or anything. These people do not have meetings, or a holy book. They only have one thing in common, and that is a belief in angels. Now I don’t believe in angels, but it would be silly to call myself a anti-angelist. The fact you use the word Atheist to describe your anti-belief, is what makes it a belief.
How wise and clever you are, Shakyamunison! You managed to try and compare atheism to a New Age religion with a basic belief system. Too bad atheism doesn't have a belief system. Are you purposefully classifying atheism incorrectly to degrade it somehow?
What new age religion is this exactly?
I guess you have never heard of Buddhism.
I find it so cute that you're trying to familiarize Atheism as a religion but slowly trying to eek away Buddhism from being a religion. I'm going to be amused at your next post where you try to say that you're not trying to disassociate Buddhism with religion.
Buddhism definition:
"Buddhism is a religion and philosophy encompassing a variety of traditions, beliefs and practices."
Atheism has no traditions, practices or beliefs. This makes it the opposite of religion.
Here:
That baby has a lack of belief in a God. Are you going to try and say that his lack of belief is "still a belief?" Think about what you're saying.
Your experience with other religions seems to be very limited.
Really? I said that a large part of religion is giving the believer a philosophy to live by and you say I've had limited experience with religion? Is that some sort of ridiculous joke?
Atheism is not an organized religion, but there are a lot of religions in the world that are not organized. Just the fact you identify as a group with a common belief (or anti-belief) is enough to start.
No, Shakyamunison. Atheism is not religion period. Whether it is organized or unorganized, it isn't a religion. I have to remind you that "group" does not equal "religion." You need to get your facts straight before providing a retort, my friend.
Thank you for giving me the last word.
You really do not know what you're getting yourself into, Shakyamunison.
Also, I might suggest replying to me via PMing because this is getting a little too off-topic and it's against the rules.
Ok, back on topic folks. Bring this to the religion forum if you want to carry it on. Just to note though, as far as we are concerned on that forum- atheism is not a religion or a belief system. It is a characteristic of certain philosophies or belief systems. It is NOT a system in of itself.
Now- topic.
Ultraviolence, I thought you were done, and giving your closing statement on your post before. I guess I will indulge you just a little more.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
Could you be any more naive? Is there a certain way a Christian is supposed to sound?
Usually they start by insulting you. You would make a good Christian.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
No, it really isn't a belief and saying it is so, again, doesn't make it so. It's like saying that having a basket that has no apples in it still means that there's apples in it. It makes no sense. Atheism is the disbelief of God(s). Here is the definition of disbelief:"Refusal or reluctance to believe."
I cannot really make it any more simple without bringing out large, colorful blocks and books with pictures, Shakyamunison.
How can you refuse or be reluctant to believe in something that does not exist?
Also, you make me laugh so hard… when you say things like: “No, it really isn't a belief and saying it is so, again, doesn't make it so.” I wish you could see the irony in that statement.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
How wise and clever you are, Shakyamunison! You managed to try and compare atheism to a New Age religion with a basic belief system. Too bad atheism doesn't have a belief system. Are you purposefully classifying atheism incorrectly to degrade it somehow?What new age religion is this exactly?
No. I really don’t care what religion you believe in. All religions are equal in that they are all wrong at some point.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
I find it so cute that you're trying to familiarize Atheism as a religion but slowly trying to eek away Buddhism from being a religion. I'm going to be amused at your next post where you try to say that you're not trying to disassociate Buddhism with religion.Buddhism definition:
"Buddhism is a religion and philosophy encompassing a variety of traditions, beliefs and practices."
Atheism has no traditions, practices or beliefs. This makes it the [b]opposite
of religion. [/B]
Ya, that sounds like me. You really should read some of my posts before making such a silly claim.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
That baby has a lack of belief in a God. Are you going to try and say that his lack of belief is "still a belief?" Think about what you're saying.
If that baby were to say to me that he/she was an Atheist, then I would think the baby was expressing its religious views. You really do take this to a strange degree.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
Really? I said that a large part of religion is giving the believer a philosophy to live by and you say I've had limited experience with religion? Is that some sort of ridiculous joke?
No. I was not joking.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
No, Shakyamunison. Atheism is not religion period. Whether it is organized or unorganized, it isn't a religion. I have to remind you that "group" does not equal "religion." You need to get your facts straight before providing a retort, my friend.
Oh the word period really convinced me (NOT). I’m always suspicious of people who I really don’t know that call me a friend. I really should take you at your word, but for some reason I keep imagining a screaming fundamentalist Atheist sitting in front of a computer.
Originally posted by Ultraviolence
You really do not know what you're getting yourself into, Shakyamunison.
Ah, ah, ah, are you going to hurt me? Ha ha ha ha ha
Originally posted by Ushgarak
Ok, back on topic folks. Bring this to the religion forum if you want to carry it on. Just to note though, as far as we are concerned on that forum- atheism is not a religion or a belief system. It is a characteristic of certain philosophies or belief systems. It is NOT a system in of itself.Now- topic.
Yes, sir.