Originally posted by Black bolt z
whose he?
colossus is correct, oblivion is always the last one standing as he is nothingness itself, he'll absorb all that is eternity/infinty. then phoenix force is reborn out of nothing, in some stories it's other abstracts as they are redundant in their roles, and gives birth to a new universe restarting the cycle.
Originally posted by Prep-ManYou can usurp nothingness. That's like saying you can destroy time. They all embody concepts.
After everything is said and done, everything destroyed, Oblivion will always be around. You can't destroy nonthingness. You can even use the UN and he'd still be there. He's an empty void, like Nekron.
Originally posted by quanchi112
You can usurp nothingness. That's like saying you can destroy time. They all embody concepts.
well, you can destroy time in marvel, eternity embodies time like infinity embodies space and ultimately they'll both be eaten by oblivion/death, when there is nothing left to die or cease to be and death itself becomes meaningless, oblivion will still be arround
Originally posted by 753How can you destroy time in marvel? Also eternity embodies all reality and where does it state oblivion is greater than either? We also have recently seen a universe where life has won so I really don't see a point you have. Life can win in this universe as well though not likely due to Thanos but you catch my drift.
well, you can destroy time in marvel, eternity embodies time like infinity embodies space and ultimately they'll both be eaten by oblivion/death, when there is nothing left to die or cease to be and death itself becomes meaningless, oblivion will still be arround
Originally posted by quanchi112
How can you destroy time in marvel? Also eternity embodies all reality and where does it state oblivion is greater than either? We also have recently seen a universe where life has won so I really don't see a point you have. Life can win in this universe as well though not likely due to Thanos but you catch my drift.
The cancerverse is a perversion of the natural cycle of things and although it can happen, I doubt it'll be more than temporary, the whole omniverse has died and been reborn an infinity of times (x-men forever IIRC). Even without death, the cancerverse can be destroyed by outsided forces like the UN and oblivion will still remain. Getting rid of death within the cancerverse does not mean getting rid of the oblivion surrounding it either.
Oblivion is not greater in power at the current point in the life of the omniverse - the concept he represents is simply indestructible, because it already is nothing - but at one point, after forever like I said, eternity and infinity will die and time and space will end following the predictable cycle of the marvel cosmos. Even Death can be said to lose meaning without life, but oblivion remains.
Eternity and Infinity - therefore space and time - are simply recreated along with the other abstracts (except for oblivion who just continues as nothingness outside of time and space) at the birth of the new universe, but this new universe doesnt occur in the same timestream or space as the previous one, several stories makes this clear and events ocurring 'between' one universe and the 'next' are said to happen outside of time itself.
I also doubt thanos will be the one to maintain balance as death's champion in the 616, phyla vell will get her shot at redeeming herself and will be the one to finish off the magus before the cancerverse can invade and spread metastasis.
Originally posted by 753Yes, and since it's been rebron you now realize nothingness never wins effectively destroying your argument. eternity has been described as the greatest abstract right below Lt also further showing I see them as they stand.
The cancerverse is a perversion of the natural cycle of things and although it can happen, I doubt it'll be more than temporary, the whole omniverse has died and been reborn an infinity of times (x-men forever IIRC). Even without death, the cancerverse can be destroyed by outsided forces like the UN and oblivion will still remain. Getting rid of death within the cancerverse does not mean getting rid of the oblivion surrounding it either.Oblivion is not greater in power at the current point in the life of the omniverse - the concept he represents is simply indestructible, because it already is nothing - but at one point, after forever like I said, eternity and infinity will die and time and space will end following the predictable cycle of the marvel cosmos. Even Death can be said to lose meaning without life, but oblivion remains.
Eternity and Infinity - therefore space and time - are simply recreated along with the other abstracts (except for oblivion who just continues as nothingness outside of time and space) at the birth of the new universe, but this new universe doesnt occur in the same timestream or space as the previous one, several stories makes this clear and events ocurring 'between' one universe and the 'next' are said to happen outside of time itself.
I also doubt thanos will be the one to maintain balance as death's champion in the 616, phyla vell will get her shot at redeeming herself and will be the one to finish off the magus before the cancerverse can invade and spread metastasis.
Thanos returning is death's best chance as it should be.
Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, and since it's been rebron you now realize nothingness never wins effectively destroying your argument. eternity has been described as the greatest abstract right below Lt also further showing I see them as they stand.Thanos returning is death's best chance as it should be.
He 'wins' as far as it goes between eternity and himself. It takes other abstracts to jumpstart the cosmic cycle and the new eternity won't be the same as the one before, because the universe won't be the same. Oblivion outlasts all individual encarnations of the other abstracts, because he outlasts all individual encarnations of the cosmos, they die and are reborn, he just goes on. So for this battle, after several billion years, the universe dies and oblivion 'wins', even if it's just a 'cosmic temporary win'.
The members of the cosmic compass are equal among themselves; Death, eternity, oblivion and infinity are all on equal footing below the LT.
Thanos is a villain, phyla is a heroe, so she is more likely to be the one save the day, just like sinestro blundered at the very last moment, just like thanos himself did not release galactus and contain the threat represented by the annihlation wave, but drax did. That's what heroes do, they save the day.
Originally posted by 753I don't see it that way at all.
He 'wins' as far as it goes between eternity and himself. It takes other abstracts to jumpstart the cosmic cycle and the new eternity won't be the same as the one before, because the universe won't be the same. Oblivion outlasts all individual encarnations of the other abstracts, because he outlasts all individual encarnations of the cosmos, they die and are reborn, he just goes on. So for this battle, after several billion years, the universe dies and oblivion 'wins', even if it's just a 'cosmic temporary win'.The members of the cosmic compass are equal among themselves; Death, eternity, oblivion and infinity are all on equal footing below the LT.
Thanos is a villain, phyla is a heroe, so she is more likely to be the one save the day, just like sinestro blundered at the very last moment, just like thanos himself did not release galactus and contain the threat represented by the annihlation wave, but drax did. That's what heroes do, they save the day.
Now we have seen eternity described as the mightiest while death herself fell with aid and quite easily before Thanos with the ig.
Eternity is right beneath Lt which has been stated on panel numerous times.
Thanos saved the day before in marvel's the end, in the infinity classics he was instrumental as well. You can hope she saves the day but they aren't bringing back Thanos to stand there. Thanos is a big deal and always a force while Phyla is mostly someone who fails.
Originally posted by 753
The cancerverse is a perversion of the natural cycle of things and although it can happen, I doubt it'll be more than temporary, the whole omniverse has died and been reborn an infinity of times (x-men forever IIRC). Even without death, the cancerverse can be destroyed by outsided forces like the UN and oblivion will still remain. Getting rid of death within the cancerverse does not mean getting rid of the oblivion surrounding it either.Oblivion is not greater in power at the current point in the life of the omniverse - the concept he represents is simply indestructible, because it already is nothing - but at one point, after forever like I said, eternity and infinity will die and time and space will end following the predictable cycle of the marvel cosmos. Even Death can be said to lose meaning without life, but oblivion remains.
Eternity and Infinity - therefore space and time - are simply recreated along with the other abstracts (except for oblivion who just continues as nothingness outside of time and space) at the birth of the new universe, but this new universe doesnt occur in the same timestream or space as the previous one, several stories makes this clear and events ocurring 'between' one universe and the 'next' are said to happen outside of time itself.
I also doubt thanos will be the one to maintain balance as death's champion in the 616, phyla vell will get her shot at redeeming herself and will be the one to finish off the magus before the cancerverse can invade and spread metastasis.
this is correct,
IIRC, though oblivions consciousness/self awareness
was created in the first big bang, and every other big bang restarts it or something like that.
maelstrom once had a plot to usurp oblivions role.
Originally posted by quanchi112
I don't see it that way at all.Now we have seen eternity described as the mightiest while death herself fell with aid and quite easily before Thanos with the ig.
Eternity is right beneath Lt which has been stated on panel numerous times.
Thanos saved the day before in marvel's the end, in the infinity classics he was instrumental as well. You can hope she saves the day but they aren't bringing back Thanos to stand there. Thanos is a big deal and always a force while Phyla is most someone who fails.
but your forgetting that they all stalemated before.
when quasar and maelstrom was there avatars.
oblivion stalemated infinity and when they stopped fighting.
eternity emerged from inside infinity, and death emerged from inside oblivion.
Originally posted by Colossus-Big CYes, but that doesn't mean Eternity is equal to Oblivion at all. Infinity and Oblivion chose avatars and Infinity's won.
but your forgetting that they all stalemated before.
when quasar and maelstrom was there avatars.
oblivion stalemated infinity and when they stopped fighting.
eternity emerged from inside infinity, and death emerged from inside oblivion.
Originally posted by quanchi112
I don't see it that way at all.Now we have seen eternity described as the mightiest while death herself fell with aid and quite easily before Thanos with the ig.
Eternity is right beneath Lt which has been stated on panel numerous times.
Thanos saved the day before in marvel's the end, in the infinity classics he was instrumental as well. You can hope she saves the day but they aren't bringing back Thanos to stand there. Thanos is a big deal and always a force while Phyla is most someone who fails.
Agree to disagree then.
Their equal footing has been shown other times, although another interpretation I've seen is that eternity/infinity is stronger when the universe is young, as it ages and nears extinction, death/oblivion become stronger. Even assuming eternity is stronger right now, he cannot get rid of oblivion in any way.
It's not what I hope will happen, it's just what I think is more likely given the nature of comic books. Phyla is at a point in her story where succeeding in saving the universe after all her failures and tragedies is mandatory for character development, the build up for her saving the day is a lot bigger than for thanos.
Originally posted by 753Oblivion also cannot get rid of eternity so even by your own standards eternity is mightier. He's right beneath Lt not Oblivion.
Agree to disagree then.Their equal footing has been shown other times, although another interpretation I've seen is that eternity/infinity is stronger when the universe is young, as it ages and nears extinction, death/oblivion become stronger. Even assuming eternity is stronger right now, he cannot get rid of oblivion in any way.
It's not what I hope will happen, it's just what I think is more likely given the nature of comic books. Phyla is at a point in her story where succeeding in saving the universe after all her failures and tragedies is mandatory for character development, the build up for her saving the day is a lot bigger than for thanos.
Originally posted by Colossus-Big CYes, but then again Eternity isn't Infinity and Oblivion isn't Death.
infinitys won because of plot device, its wasnt because of a power difference
Originally posted by quanchi112
Oblivion also cannot get rid of eternity so even by your own standards eternity is mightier. He's right beneath Lt not Oblivion.Yes, but then again Eternity isn't Infinity and Oblivion isn't Death.
How is eternity mightier by my own standards? They will 'struggle' as they have been doing for billions of years stalemating and eventually, eternity dies, which is what I said from the beggining.
Eternity and Infinty are two sides of the same coin he is time she is space, they are both reality - he is not the whole universe without or despite of her - this has been stated numerous times. The same goes for oblivion and death, they're all pretty equal.