Leo's Tourny--TEH FINALZ!!!!!!1!

I wish I could see more advantages for PG, but I don't. I was going to give him the edge in flat out speed, as I agree completely with him that Pip's mode of teleportation is far superior (speed-wise) to Spot's. I think that the drainer may knock out the Spider-Sense when he teleports in...but it may not. And I'm leaning towards the latter. Why? Because Spider-Sense has been shown to detect teleportation prior to the opponent arriving. Therefore the Spider-Sense should warn Digi's amalgam before the drainer materializes into his location to dampen the Sense. At least, that's how I broke it down. So the Spider-Sense plus his superhuman reflexes make up for Spot's slower mode of travel, and I'd give the speed department a push for both combatants.

One other advantage I tried to give PG when breaking things down was the Power Drainer itself, as a OHK basically. The thing is a game changer, afterall. Two problems with that, though: some of Digi's attacks are also OHK to Dr. Trollbot. The glidercide, for example. Secondly, the way I broke Digi's amalgam down, even if his powers were shut down, he would still be Green Goblin with all of GG's equipment, plus the Iron Spider's suit. Basically, PG's power drainer is not an Armageddon-esque, ruin-my-entire-strategy-and-my-character- type deal, as it was against his other opponents. Clever move by Digi. I would have preferred Lockheed the Dragon, but that shows what I know. I've read PG's other matches throughout the tourney. Always before I've had an issue with his lack of offense and offensive gameplan. It's always "I turn off your powers and shoot you dead." TBH, PG seems to have less offense with this incarnation of his team than he did with Punisher. And the "turn off your powers and shoot you dead" doesn't work here, with GG and Iron Spider suits protecting him.

That's what it boiled down to for me. Is PG going to be able to find his opponent faster? Yes. But once Digi uses his spots, Dr. Trollbot isn't automatically going to be able to relocate him. It'll take a few seconds or whatever. Does he have enough offense to take Digi's character out if he does shut down his power? I can't say he does. Mono-a-mono, GG had a great showing against a Sentinel. Rex's suit definitely isn't on that level, nor on Titanium Man's.

PG came up with a great plan and evidence towards the end though to make up for some of these shortcomings: namely amping the drainer, teleporting to the middle of the battlefield and dropping it. Spider-Sense wouldn't be triggered via the teleport, and I'll go ahead and buy that it'd affect the entire radius of the battlefield. Still leaves the glider, pumpkin bombs, finger lasers, and Lunatic Laugh, all of which could now destroy the exposed drainer. Plus, 2 1/2 minutes of uninterrupted time to modify it. Uninterrupted. I don't think Digi will let him have that with the barrage of weapons at his disposal. Moreover, I have absolutely no clue on how to resolve Digi's first line of defense - the Spot-Shield. I can't decide how it should behave. I think the drainer spreads out in a kind of, semi-circular pulse of sorts, like the blip on a radar or maybe how the amplified neural disruptor behaved in PG's scan towards the end. If true, it should probably hit the Spot-Shield before reaching Digi's amalgam and be shunted into the Dark Force dimension. The drainer is genetic in nature - it affects the person directly. A weak example would be that even though the drainer caused Spider-Man to weaken and fall off his webbing, it didn't destroy the webbing itself. Similarly, I don't believe the drainer would kill/take out the Spot-Shield until it struck Digi's amalgam himself and he could no longer maintain his Spot abilities anymore. Also, from New Avengers #55, the drainer doesn't really seem to work 100% immediately. Pretty sure Spider-Man was the first one to fall, but he looked pretty close. Bucky and Clint and Jessica seemed to be able to take a lot more exposure before collapsing. How soon would Spot's abilities cease to work? Multiple layers of armor and his spots might very well dampen the effect long enough to open up a spot and leave the area. I couldn't say for certain, but I'm pretty positive PG couldn't, either.

And....Spot's teleportation has just so much more aggressive capabilities. It was built to be offensive. He can open six or seven spots under the ice or wherever Dr. Trollbot is located once he finds them, and send iron pincers or stingers or pumpkin bombs or lasers or his entire glider at him. More offense in spades, good defense, negating the one-shot capabilities of the drainer via GG and a push in speed means that I feel Digi will definitely have more options to kill his opponent with and should win the match eventually.

Sorry for the abysmally long match synopsis. As you can probably tell, I went back and forth several times and had difficulty in deciding how certain aspects of the fight should behave.

Good luck to Digi and PG and the rest of the judges in placing their votes.

EDIT: Stupid second page. Stupid 10,000 character rule. Stupid long-winded opinions. Damnit.

I should have just given Digi the win based on Post #1, where he quoted Ochocinco's "Child, please," used the phrase 'pumpkin-rape' and referred to his ability as 'awesomesauce.' I laughed so hard during reading that.

Alright just so we're all clear, my post isn't going to be anywhere near as long as that brown-nosing attention whore Eny's was. sly

Anywho, I'm giving my vote to Digi, and here's why…

-PG's strategy of firing his drainer through a very thick chunk of ice, and assuming it would still be at full potency after going through said ice (if it made it through at all) wasn't believable for me in the slightest. Why? Because there are no scans to back up the notion that the drainer-energy can pass through solid matter uninhibited. So all the real world scientific banter between them aside, if it was never shown on panel, there's no reason for me to believe it'd be possible here. I am not as forgiving as Eny. 😈

-In PG's previous matches, one of his biggest advantages was teleportation. However, the scan Digi posted which depicted Spidey not only sensing a teleporter as he was 'porting in, but also dodging the subsequent attack said teleporter fired, was enough for me to believe that Spidey could sense and react to PG's teleportation as well (or at the very least, he could 'eat' any attacks via Spot.)

-I also believe that with Digi's powerset (ie. iron suit, GG's equipment, etc.) he'd be able to pick apart PG's team in a close quarters, or ranged battle (shredding Titanium Man is no small feat, afterall.)

-I didn't agree with PG's "I'm under the ice so you can't get me" strategy. And when Digi posted scans of Spot opening portals across the globe, I had no problem believing he could put a few of them under a mere 25 meters of ice and throw in some bombs if need be.

Don't get me wrong, I thought PG still did have some advantages (as Eny mentioned, superior monitoring was a big one.) However, his offense as a whole didn't leave much room for error - so if the drainer ended up not working (which imo it wouldn't) then PG didn't really have much of an offensive game plan to fall back on. Other side of the coin, Digi had a great offense and a well planned defense.

Good job to both of you… Excellent matches all around. 👆

I'm a bit torn in my decision since PG made me aknowledge that his team could defeat Digi's, but did a much less impressive work convincing me that things would go as he expected. Digi was his usual calm, coherent and articulated debater, pretty much fulfilling his role as doubt-caster.

Because, really? Why would you ammalgamate everyone including your just-human-tech-back-up dude and risk losing against the drainer to then claim that having-no-powers part of the amalgam saves it from drainage? It was a lost point, but it was not the important part. Digi knew that if the battle was played on whether the drainer worked or not, if he managed to convince us that he would win if it didn't, then he only would need to cast doubt in PG's original plan. It was a plan of putting all the eggs in the same basket, but nicely done.

So well, I found Digi's reasonings more rethorical than concrete and PG's articulation way too weak to dispel most of the doubt placed by his opponent. But sadly if I think PG's team would win is more extrapolation from me than actual debating. As such Digi for the win.

(As you can see, this was far from my favorite debate, but congratulations both of you because you pulled some great moves to get here. Well played.)

that's three for digi, so i guess that's that.

Congratulations Digimark007, broke the "curse".

i had a gloat sig, quote, and the whole nine in my mind.....

moar tourneys please

Originally posted by psycho gundam
that's three for digi, so i guess that's that.

Congratulations Digimark007, broke the "curse".

😛

thought it was five....

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I'll be getting in my vote Monday sometime. Good match, guys! 👆

Originally posted by Enyalus
There are seven judges total though, so don't give up yet. And take heart - any opinion Bentley gives has to be wrong. The other judges will surely consider that fact when weighing in.

😛

I tend to take that into account when voting.

boxed

Okey dokey, here comes my relatively short vote. Sorry for the wait, guys.

First of all, I liked the match. It was pretty neat reading both participants rosters for said match as well as what they had brought to it, prep and strategy wise. I felt that PG's power drainer was, again, the one thing his definitive victory or loss would hinge on. Conversely, I felt Digi was better well rounded in terms of offense and defense, especially with Spot-ploitation.

In the end, I felt Digi's plan came together nicely and better tasked to dealing with what PG could offer, which is why I'm affording him the victory. What sold me for Digi, was the fact his equipment all complemented what he wanted to quite nicely. Ranged weaponry? Check. The ability to attack from wherever? Check. Impressive defensive/evasion maneuvers? Check. If I had to break it down, I'd wager Digi's team would get a nice majority all things considered against PG's, due to earlier mentioned well rounded-ness. PG certainly had plenty of admirable tricks up his sleeves, and it sure as hell wouldn't be impossible for him to win, but not for the majority. Not only that, but his superior monitoring - nice, by the way 👆 - gave him a great edge.

In the end though, Digi walks away with my vote after a long, hard fought debate. Congratulations to both Digi and Psycho Gundam for putting on a good final round.

Aw, Jake, you should've voted for PG so we could ***** at Batdude, Bran and Naija for being late. 😛 Now it doesn't matter.

congrats digi--to the remaining judges. no need to cast those extra votes unless you really have no life. 😐

but thanks for playing along and having the votes in on time.

😛

oh, and good job PG. i liked your amalgam from the start.

Sorry fir the late decision guys, been super busy of late. was planning to render decision today but i see theres no need anymore. Congrats to Digi

Originally posted by Digi
A hearty thank you to leo, participants, and the judges. And congrats to PG on a tourney well-fought. I won't lie and say this isn't a relief to win (it certainly is), but I'm ironically probably the most happy that I can go back to judging these things for a while. Tourneys drain me, from research and prep to drafts and matches themselves, so I'll hopefully get to take some time off now.

I'd also be remiss in not thanking inamilist for his help. I had singled out Urich for the finals but my collection on him is incomplete. In's respect thread on him is largely broken links, but he managed to re-scan much of it for me in the days preceding the finals. I would've had to choose someone else without his help, and while I had other solid options, I really liked Urich. So it worked out well.

It seems popular after winning a tourney to enter a bunch of partner tourneys, lending a champion's name to the mix while doing none of the work. That sounds like an amazing plan to me (313), so despite my hoped-for layoff, I'll be back eventually, probably with a partner doing my dirty work.

[QUOTE=12734514]Originally posted by Enyalus
[B]Me, too. I remember Leo and I discussing Harrow and the drainer just before the tourney opened. Leo allowed it because we agreed it wasn't unbeatable, and at least I felt pretty confident that someone would be able to get around it. I've looked at all of PG's matches, though, and was pretty shocked to see that there wasn't a lot of compensating going on to adjust for it.

Not sure if PG's debating was just that uber or if all of ya'll except Digi were shmucks. uhuh I'm betting on the latter though.

I mentioned this in PMs to others a few times. It was the one really original idea in the tourney. So a massive kudos to PG for it. The first time I beat PG was mostly by accident. My team worked well against him. I knew he was keeping it for the finals though, so it gave me some time to plan for it specifically. Everyone else couldn't plan specifically for the drainer though, because there were more people left in the tourney at the time, so it was more difficult until the last round of re-drafts when I only had one team to worry about.

That said, Urich was a specific answer to Harrow (tons of ranged attacks + base human to throw the drainer into some doubt), so I'll take a small amount of the credit. Spidey + Spot was also fun as hell, and would've been even better had Blair not disproven some of my strategies in the match before ( 😒 ).

If PG had gotten his original draft of Mysterio + Harrow, I feel like it would've been hard for anyone to counter, myself included. Fortunately, he ended up banned for offensive teleportation, but it definitely would've required a different strategy from me.

....

As an addendum, I'll be updating the tourney respect thread soon to include this tourney, complete with champion's comments that I wish more tourney winners bothered to submit to me *looks at leo*. As always, feel free to suggest any additions that you think could be made, since I normally do changes all at once then ignore the thread for months.[/B][/QUOTE]

Heh, I would've voted for PG.

biscuits

my dirty tactics will bare fruit one day lol.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
my dirty tactics will bare fruit one day lol.

Improved you have.

Hm. I just realized: Digi wins his first tournament, and the Heroic Age of comic-dom begins. Coincidence? I think not.

313

Originally posted by batdude123
Heh, I would've voted for PG.

biscuits

I only had enough money to bribe the 4 judges I needed. Maybe next tourney we can work something out.

biscuits

Originally posted by psycho gundam
my dirty tactics will bare fruit one day lol.

Hopefully. I mean, it worked for Blair, right?

srug

Originally posted by Digi
Hopefully. I mean, it worked for Blair, right?

srug

Mine worked from the first time. 😉

I was going to vote for Digi, but I didn't want to be the one to crush PG, as there was already 3 for Digi when I saw it.

Good job though PG. And a super well done to Digi.

...

😐