Originally posted by Nephthys
Gideon is a chicken-shit so who cares. sneer
In comic books from Dark Horse, Palpatine is featured in a prejudice light. Supposedly, the only aliens he condones in the Empire's high offices were the Chiss, and they were established at the far end of the galaxy.
His rise to "Supreme Chancellor" seems to be a symbolic reference to real life Hitler and Nazism, which perhaps his prejudice nature is molded after. (As seen in the documentary "mythology of Star Wars".)
There is also a Sith paradox concerning this - aren't the Sith race originally an alien species?
...And Darth Maul isn't really human either, so why choose an alien apprentice to succeed him as Sith Lord?
I hope this issue is addressed in the new Plagueis novel, it would certainly put some of the seemingly continuity goof-ups to rest.
Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Didn't Gideon make an argument that Palpatine himself wasn't personally prejudiced, but he allowed it in the Empire as a means of control?
That's what I believe as well. Afterall, Palpatine seems to hate everyone equally. And as already metnioned he did have an alien apprentice and showed actual sadness following his "death".
He did? O_o
Originally posted by darkriddle
In comic books from Dark Horse, Palpatine is featured in a prejudice light. Supposedly, the only aliens he condones in the Empire's high offices were the Chiss, and they were established at the far end of the galaxy.His rise to "Supreme Chancellor" seems to be a symbolic reference to real life Hitler and Nazism, which perhaps his prejudice nature is molded after. (As seen in the documentary "mythology of Star Wars".)
There is also a Sith paradox concerning this - aren't the Sith race originally an alien species?
...And Darth Maul isn't really human either, so why choose an alien apprentice to succeed him as Sith Lord?
I hope this issue is addressed in the new Plagueis novel, it would certainly put some of the seemingly continuity goof-ups to rest.
Well said.
My review of Darth Plagueis, which features moderate spoilers, so bewarned. Tl;dr version: Go get it, it's excellent.
Spoiler:
Darth Plagueis was excellent; it met most of my expectations and surpassed others.Luceno consistently proves why he is considered one of Del Rey’s greatest assets when it comes to Star Wars literature; in my opinion, he is rivaled only by Stover with respect to authors with multiple contributions to the mythos. He edges ahead of the likes of Steve Perry, Michael Reaves, Paul S. Kemp, and Timothy Zahn—who are all superb authors in their own right. On the other hand, he absolutely outclasses the likes of Drew Karpyshyn, Troy Denning, Aaron Allston, Karen Traviss, and the Bantam-era novelists like Kevin J. Anderson.
Key to Luceno's success is his attention to detail and respect of continuity; suffice it to say that this novel is more entrenched in canon than any other published work with the Star Wars name on it. He reportedly worked with highest levels of the Lucas media empire to ensure the accuracy of events and to guarantee that the novel, cover-to-cover, was commensurate with the creator’s strict vision of canon.
Plot
The book is segmented into three parts. The first part deals with the final day of Plagueis's apprenticeship under Tenebrous. After killing his Master, he continues his entrepreneurial quests under the alter-ego of Hego Damask, the outrageously wealthy 'Magister' of Damask Holdings—which has direct ties to the likes of the Trade Federation and InterGalactic Banking Clan. His pursuits lead him to Naboo where he first meets Palpatine, a young malcontent, and discovers that he's highly Force sensitive.
The second part deals with Palpatine's Sith training—philosophical lessons on Muunilinst and Sojourn, combat excursions on Hypori and Kursid, and political refinement on Naboo and Coruscant. Plagueis increases his efforts to manipulate midichlorians and uses his vast resources and connections to facilitate Palpatine's political career.
The third part deals with a bifurcated path the Sith take to success: Palpatine working to complete the political elements of the Sith Grand Plan, ranging from the blockade of Naboo to his subtle manipulation of Dooku, and Plagueis's fanatical efforts to conclude his Force-entrenched experiments. And ultimately, one succeeds as the other fails, which determines the novel's chilling ending.
Characters
The novel deals with two principal characters: the titular Sith Master and Darth Sidious. Everyone else is relegated to supporting roles, though some feature more than others—Maul, Dooku, Tenebrous, Veruna, Pestage, Valorum foremost among them.
Plagueis is described in the films as a mystic. In the novel, he is that in addition to political kingmaker, galactic financier, and scientist. The implication throughout the novel is that the Sith of Bane's order must be all of these—as adroit in the trappings of the "profane world" as the Sith combat arts. As a combatant, though, Plagueis is tremendously potent. At one point, Plagueis muses that in all of his studies in the Force, if a Force-user who was his equal in strength preceded him, he isn't aware of it. Luceno is careful to not paint him as unstoppable or infallible, however: Plagueis is wounded in his grueling duel with Venamis, nearly slaughtered by Maladian assassins, and is noted more than once to have little talent with Sith sorcery—unlike his disciple. As a character, he is profoundly ruthless without being cruel (at least as an adult). He is, in a way, depicted as almost honorable and killing only when necessary. In fact, he is shown to have a genuine affection and surprisingly deep trust in Sidious, which (as you would expect) dooms him.
Palpatine is, in many ways, more prominent in the novel than Plagueis himself. We are first introduced to him as a young malcontent. In addition to being responsible for the deaths of two people in a speeder accident, his past was so checkered that his beleaguered family moved him from school-to-school and used their wealth to conceal his misdeeds. Unlike Bane, however, Palpatine's sociopathy seems more congenital than learned—Plagueis notes that he has "the bloodlust of a serial killer" and there are a handful of scenes that depict Palpatine's deranged proficiency with indiscriminate physical violence. Though, again, Luceno is sure to add establishing scenes of dimension: his aptitude for flirtation, his warped filial relationship with Darth Maul, and his quiet reservations at killing his political mentor, Vidar Kim.
Tone
I stand by my assessment that Plagueis is a photo negative of Cloak of Deception, with the principal difference being the emphasis on Sith machinations rather than those of the Jedi. It is a more cerebral work, concerning with Sith philosophy and politics, though there are a few important action scenes to ground it in Star Wars escapism.
Grade: 9/10
I forgot to mention that there are important revelations from Plagueis: for example,
Spoiler:
Plagueis really was able to control midichlorians at the end of his life: able to create beings from them, able to kill people by manipulating the midichlorians to return to the Force, and able to increase his own midichlorian count.
Darth Plagueis is, quite simply, an exceptional novel.
The story spans from the ending of Plagueis apprenticeship all the way to his death, an extraordinary feat for a single book under 400 pages. Unlike the recent series that have been pumped out (Lotf, FotJ, NJO), Plagues moves at a brisk pace without the need for filler, yet it is not rushed but rather perfectly paced.
The action in this book is rather sparse, and when there is such a sequence it is not dragged on for pages like many SW novels do today, but rather told in a short but rewarding fashion. Ultimately, this novel is about political subterfuge and unraveling the mysteries of the force rather than lightsaber combat and space battles, and it’s all the better for it.
Perhaps the greatest strength of Darth Plagueis is how it manages to tie in with the Prequel Trilogy. Numerous, plot threads are tied together in this novel. Anakin’s birth (which is still somewhat ambiguous), the force being unbalanced, the Clone army, Dooku’s fall, and many others are all touched upon or explained. Furthermore, reading the final pages of the book, which coincide with the events of TPM, was some of the most fun I have ever head reading. It’s that good.
In the end, Darth Plagueis is one of those rare SW novels that manages to transcend from mere pulp fiction to something greater. It truly is one of the greatest works in the EU and sits along other greats such as the Revenge of the Sith novelization and Yoda: Dark Rendezvous.
10/10
Plagueis was far more interesting that I had hoped or anticipated and has become one of my favoirtes in the EU. He isn’t just another cookie cutter Sith Lord but has rather a unique view on the master/apprentice dynamic and the Force. The idea that he and Palpatine would rule as equals was quite interesting. Not to mention it was cool seeing him manipulate events through wealth rather than words. Furthermore, I was rather glad that he wasn’t pure undiluted evil who would kill without a reason; in fact, at one point in the novel he spared that one force sensitive gambler. Also glad to see he wasn’t presented as a sympathetic character like Drew tried to paint Bane as.
Palpatine, on the other hand, was pretty much pure evil. But he still manages to be interesting. Once again the dynamic between him and Plagueis was fascinating. I also liked the almost paternal bond he and Maul shared. But perhaps more interesting than all was his interactions with Senator Kim.
I’m still a little uncertain on some of Palpatine’s manipulations. For example, he claims the clone army was his idea. Yes, he initially brought the idea of exterminating the Jedi not by an outside force but by an inside one. Yet, at one point when Plagueis hints at the clone army and Palpatine seems curious, and at during this scene it was told from Palpatine’s POV.
As for my favorite scene, I really liked most of the scenes in which the novel coincided with TPM. The only part I wasn’t a great fan of was when Palpatine killed Plagueis as it was a little too over the top and I’m not sure why Plagueis was doing practically nothing. Sure he was drunk but you think he would have at least fought back.
However, if I had to choose a single scene it would be between when Plagueis learns about Anakin and virtually shits his pants or when he kills Veruna showing that midi-chlorian manipulation is restricted not only to life but can be used for death as well.
Originally posted by ares834
I’m still a little uncertain on some of Palpatine’s manipulations. For example, he claims the clone army was his idea. Yes, he initially brought the idea of exterminating the Jedi not by an outside force but by an inside one. Yet, at one point when Plagueis hints at the clone army and Palpatine seems curious, and at during this scene it was told from Palpatine’s POV.
I think that's what he meant: the presence clones themselves wasn't his idea, but the idea of a treacherous army was.
[i]Ares[i]
As for my favorite scene, I really liked most of the scenes in which the novel coincided with TPM. The only part I wasn’t a great fan of was when Palpatine killed Plagueis as it was a little too over the top and I’m not sure why Plagueis was doing practically nothing. Sure he was drunk but you think he would have at least fought back.
Well he prepared to, remember? Gathering a storm of Force energy within, testing himself. Then Palpatine began to throttle him and the game was up.
[i]Ares[i]
However, if I had to choose a single scene it would be between when Plagueis learns about Anakin and virtually shits his pants or when he kills Veruna showing that midi-chlorian manipulation is restricted not only to life but can be used for death as well.
Good scenes.