Captain America (Steve) vs. Wildcat and Green Arrow

Originally posted by namorsubby
ollie has tagged slade before and managed to in that same issue. Slades faster anyway. Cap does not possess the same brain function that makes slade the team beater he is. Stop trying to make slade a dc barometer for steve rogers. Hes not. Plain and simple.

Like i said, either one of these guys can take a minority vs cap. The notion that he can take a majority vs both only implies a lack of knowledge on both combatants. Teds 7 decades worth of experience, for example. Just how much does cap have?

GA never hit Slade with an arrow fired form the bow in fact. GA stabbed Slade in the right eye from behind while Slade kept GL from using his ring after Slade pretty much owned everyone else including GA himself.

For the record, Slade is not superior to Cap. only slightly better healing and reaction time. Cap could defeat Slade 1 on 1, or it could go either way really. Also you should quit with this notion that I don't know about WC or GA.. I have comics with them fyi.

You dont have to explain the fight to me, i have the scans. Either way ga has tagged slade with arrows before.

Caps healing factor is no where near on par, period. Theres nothing to suggest it is, but you guys keep saying "only slightly". No, only plain out of his league.

Slades reaction time has been stated instantaneous many times. Hes routinely outmanuevered opponents so much faster than cap that its not even funny. And sure, if you only consider slades low end feats vs elite peak humans and ignore the consistent ass whoopings hes given them and metas in groups than yeah, him and cap 1 on 1 could go either way.

But seriously, stop bringing slade into this. Hes not a measuring stick for how cap would do vs dc characters, so stop making him one. Cap doesnt have the team beating creditials slade does anyway.

And yes, if you knew these characters, youd know its virtually a slap in the face to suggest that they both cant take a character of his level together.

Cap vs ted. Ted 4/10
Cap vs ollie. Ollie 3-4/10
Cap vs both. Team 10/10

Personally I wouldn't give Ted any wins against regular Cap, Steve holds every advantage.

Not neccessarily. How much experience does cap have? Also
Steve is more skillledoverall certainly, but teds boxing skills far exceed anyone in comics, along with having mastered martial art forms. His strength and endurance basically defy logic, being that he is simply human. I cant think of a peak without some type of armor in their suit that is that durable. Hes pretty underrated if you ask me. His jsa members consider him the best fighter in the world. He beats metas all the time without armor or weapons, just his fists.

I'd argue that experience won't be a factor since Steve is very experienced and has fared well against very unorthodox fighters in the past. I understand that Ted has absurd durability, but for all proposes Rogers is above human durability himself, and even if he didn't hold that advantage, he is holding his own better in the long run considering external factor -stamina, weaponry, speed, skill, etc.-.

I'm not saying Ted isn't powerful, but it's like comparing a random heavy weight fighter against Prime Rocky Marciano.

Originally posted by Bentley
I'd argue that experience won't be a factor since Steve is very experienced and has fared well against very unorthodox fighters in the past. I understand that Ted has absurd durability, but for all proposes Rogers is above human durability himself, and even if he didn't hold that advantage, he is holding his own better in the long run considering external factor -stamina, weaponry, speed, skill, etc.-.

I'm not saying Ted isn't powerful, but it's like comparing a random heavy weight fighter against Prime Rocky Marciano.

Originally posted by namorsubby
You dont have to explain the fight to me, i have the scans. Either way ga has tagged slade with arrows before.

Caps healing factor is no where near on par, period. Theres nothing to suggest it is, but you guys keep saying "only slightly". No, only plain out of his league.

Slades reaction time has been stated instantaneous many times. Hes routinely outmanuevered opponents so much faster than cap that its not even funny. And sure, if you only consider slades low end feats vs elite peak humans and ignore the consistent ass whoopings hes given them and metas in groups than yeah, him and cap 1 on 1 could go either way.

But seriously, stop bringing slade into this. Hes not a measuring stick for how cap would do vs dc characters, so stop making him one. Cap doesnt have the team beating creditials slade does anyway.

And yes, if you knew these characters, youd know its virtually a slap in the face to suggest that they both cant take a character of his level together.

Cap vs ted. Ted 4/10
Cap vs ollie. Ollie 3-4/10
Cap vs both. Team 10/10

First off, Slade's HF isn't far and beyond Steve's. Because Slade doesn't heal as fast as Logan nor are their HF on par. Slade can resurrect and has better control over his metabolism. Thats it. Steve has shown comparable damage soak to Slade.

Cap has been shot in the head and survive.

Cap can withstand several blows from the likes of Iron Man and Namor and not black out from the damage.

Cap has been shot multiple times without armor, and survive.

Cap has even been caught in explosions and survive.

And second Cap's reflexes are also instantaneous by feats alone. He has reacted to ramdom dangers and traps instantaneously one after the other in Captain America Vol 1 #358 (The Blood Stone Hunt arch). Also take into consideration where they are fighting.

Here's how Cap uses his surroundings against a physically superior oponent, Nazi.
http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/00002.jpg
http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/00004.jpg
http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/00005.jpg
http://i663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/00006.jpg

And here Cap again takes on two more powerful oponents, Scorpion and Mr. Hyde.
http://img141.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-32072/loc597/39903_Captain_America152_15_122_597lo.JPG
http://img16.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-10882/loc1197/39904_Captain_America152_16_122_1197lo.JPG
http://img203.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=39909_Captain_America152_18_122_458lo.JPG#
http://img190.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-15909/loc489/39915_Captain_America152_19_122_489lo.JPG
http://img181.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-9429/loc59/39921_Captain_America152_20_122_59lo.JPG

This is how fast Cap can and will react to their attacks

Captain America Dodging Blasts from the robots with ease.
http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/6297/a1zb0.jpg

Cap can react with the speed and timing to actually roll the force of a concussive shot after it's fired.
http://img404.imageshack.us/img404/9325/a2jz0.jpg

"Cap moves so fast that these guys barely even see him flip right past them, and they were waiting for him" - King KAM
http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/9071/a7gi2.jpg

Maria Hill doesn't think the likes of Luke Cage and Daredevil would be too much for Cap to handle himself. Also see how fast Cap reacts; taking down a group of armed SHIELD agents.
http://img331.imageshack.us/img331/7710/scan00239un.jpg
http://img331.imageshack.us/img331/2331/scan00243nj.jpg
http://img331.imageshack.us/img331/237/scan00266jd.jpg
http://img331.imageshack.us/img331/1333/scan00276vh.jpg
http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/1608/scan00286bd.jpg

Soon after Cap displays amazing acrobatics and agility; falling in mid air while blocking automatic gunfire from all sides.
http://img331.imageshack.us/img331/6641/scan00295fv.jpg

Here again Cap takes on a physically superior opponent, Namor; showing skill, speed, agility, resilience and durability.

Note: Cap fought with damaged body armor mid way into the fight.

http://img156.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-4312/loc1041/48878_Captain_America423-15_122_1041lo.JPG
http://img17.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-32440/loc964/48884_Captain_America423-16_122_964lo.JPG
http://img146.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-26365/loc879/48890_Captain_America423-17_122_879lo.JPG
http://img102.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-17965/loc876/48901_Captain_America423-18_122_876lo.JPG
http://img7.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-482/loc1021/48903_Captain_America423-19_122_1021lo.JPG
http://img108.imagevenue.com/aAfkjfp01fo1i-15951/loc1197/48910_Captain_America423-20_122_1197lo.JPG

And explosive arrows are really no problem for the Shield to handle really if anyone thought otherwise. Cap really can handle these two with a lot of effort.

Wildcat beating Captain America 4/10? Jesus Christ. Ted would be lucky to beat Captain America 40% of the time he himself had the SSS. You got jokes man, you got jokes.

Ollie and Ted aren't peak, they are Olympic level. Captain America is 3x peak with virtually limitless stamina and a massive skill advantage. Do the math.

rogers isn't 3x peak human because bucky barnes himself isnt a peak human. also as far as ted being olympic, sportsmaster is an olympic level character and he's been schooled by ted. ted is easily a peak human.

that being said cap takes it, but srank is still a moron just like on comicvine.

Originally posted by namorsubby
The fact that no one has closed this thread yet is a testament to just how slanted these boards are. Itz simply absurd to think that 2 peaks of this caliber working together cant take steve 10/10. Then there are a few of the same radicals saying they couldnt even take a majority against him? Nonsense, plain and simple. Either one of these guys could take a minority alone. Even taking these guys at their lowest, i cant see how they cant beat one individual of cap's power level and power set.

Originally posted by wellillbedamn
you gotta remember that the majority of people on this site are idiots. plus with morons like carver9, quanchi, srank and marvel knight leading the charge.

hysterical.... Very funny but grow up. I can't speak for the others. But I wouldn't call them morons. And you don't need to put me on such a pedestal here on KMC. I don't lead anything and I'm far from being a idiot lol. I just try to be real about the outcome.

Comicvine is whack btw... KMC is much better and its members.

Originally posted by wellillbedamn
rogers isn't 3x peak human because bucky barnes himself isnt a peak human. also as far as ted being olympic, sportsmaster is an olympic level character and he's been schooled by ted. ted is easily a peak human.

that being said cap takes it, but srank is still a moron just like on comicvine.

Yeah buddy, Bucky is peak human. Maybe try reading some comics? Your ignorance of characters and utter lack of knowledge may fly on comicvine, because it is filled with individuals as equally uninformed as you are, who get all they know from irrelevant fan written character wikis... but even on comicvine the Bucky write up lists him as peak human, so maybe you are uninformed even by comicvine standards? Sad.

Robin has schooled Shrike (an olympic level human), I guess Robin must be peak human! I guess Catwoman is too because she has beat a lot of olumpic level fighters! ZOMG Onyx is peeeeeeeeak human. dur

You're dumb. Do you want me to show you how to buy comics online so you can educate yourself?

Bucky, in his short run, has a record that puts Green Arrow into shame and that should make you ask if Wildcat can putt more than 4 wins against him, and yet Bucky has never managed to overpower Steve.

Originally posted by Bentley
Bucky, in his short run, has a record that puts Green Arrow into shame and that should make you ask if Wildcat can putt more than 4 wins against him, and yet Bucky has never managed to overpower Steve.

Seriously, even if someone can't be bothered to go back and read the Winter Soldier and subsequent Bucky Cap stuff, all they need to do is read the last couple of story arcs with Bucky in the Russian Gulag with his arm de-powered to know whats up. Hell, it might even directly state in the narative that he is peak human in the first couple issues of that arc.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Seriously, even if someone can't be bothered to go back and read the Winter Soldier and subsequent Bucky Cap stuff, all they need to do is read the last couple of story arcs with Bucky in the Russian Gulag with his arm de-powered to know whats up. Hell, it might even directly state in the narative that he is peak human in the first couple issues of that arc.

Bucky shouldn't ever be considered peak human as Spidey should ever be considered class 50 or more. Both have the feats but that doesn't automatically give them this status.

Bucky may be olympic level but not peak human (which is clearly above).

Originally posted by h1a8
You must know when to be able to throw out nonsense when it applies.

Bucky shouldn't ever be considered peak human as Spidey should ever be considered class 50 or more. Both have the feats but that doesn't automatically give them this status.

Bucky may be olympic level but not peak human (which is clearly above).

Based on what?

I'm sorry but Bucky is peak, and Steve is superhuman. As much as I hate to to destroy the delusional dream Batman fanboys have that Bruce = Steve, but that just isn't the case.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Based on what?

I'm sorry but Bucky is peak, and Steve is superhuman. As much as I hate to to destroy the delusional dream Batman fanboys have that Bruce = Steve, but that just isn't the case.

If you were a good debator you wouldn't jump to illogical conclusions. I don't once think that Batman =Steve in the physical department. I'm trying to not be bias here, something you should try as well. A peak human feat doesn't qualify you to be peak human if you are a normal human. You must be enhanced with some outside agent (like a chemical) in order for that to happen. Cap can be enhanced human or peak human because of an outside agent (SSS).

By this definition, Batman isn't peak human either (for a normal human could theoretically be stronger).

Also you have the comic definition of peak human and the real life definition of peak human. They are not the same. Every hero (no matter if they have powers or not) have at least peak human feats (in the real life definition). But some are not peak human (in the comic definition).

In Summary, a normal human CAN NEVER REACH PEAK HUMAN unless they receive some outside agent to achieve it.

Batman is the true definition of what a peak human is in DC, period.

Batman out classes WC and GA 1 on 1 as well. And with prep, Bats could take them with ease. Knowing Bruce; he's probably thought of this already lol...

physically, Cap is clearly better compared to Bats. But in DC, Bruce is really among the very few who would give Steve a very tough fight. And WC is near Bruce physically, but less skilled. And GA would get washed up by Bruce, real talk. Cap would do even better with his combine vast skill, greater experience, and physically superiority a crossed the board.