Who are your role models?

Originally posted by inimalist
so you are trying to mock Kandy because you have a superficial level understanding of Tim Leary's impact on science and society?

I'm not sure where you draw the mocking part from.

Perhaps I should type slower? 😮

lol, replace the verb, the point remains

Originally posted by inimalist
lol, replace the verb, the point remains

😛

Since you seem so intent on joining the discussion care to mention who inspires you?

it really depends what you are talking about

there are really few individuals that have impacted my life outside of the specific field they are in. Like, I could talk about artistic or musical influences, but they would rarely cover my moral and philosophical ones, which would be different from my political or scientific ones...

Desmond Tutu is up there... Andres Serrano... R A Fisher... Ayn Rand... but those are all from such different aspects of my personality, I would hardly be able to say one is more or less a role model, and there would be dozens more

Originally posted by inimalist
it really depends what you are talking about

there are really few individuals that have impacted my life outside of the specific field they are in. Like, I could talk about artistic or musical influences, but they would rarely cover my moral and philosophical ones, which would be different from my political or scientific ones...

Desmond Tutu is up there... Andres Serrano... R A Fisher... Ayn Rand... but those are all from such different aspects of my personality, I would hardly be able to say one is more or less a role model, and there would be dozens more

Anybody who encompasses most (the majority I guess) of your personality traits?

Originally posted by theICONiac
Exactly!

Had King Kandy mentioned Freud/Pavlov/Jung etc. no one would nary bat an eye...but Leary? First thing that comes to mind is...wait for it, DRUGS!

Originally posted by theICONiac
Anybody who encompasses most (the majority I guess) of your personality traits?

I don't believe in personality traits, unfortunately

Originally posted by King Kandy
Freud was a cocaine addict who wrote articles saying it was amazing and everyone should use it. Not to mention you didn't bat an eye on Ken Kesey on my list and he probably used more drugs than them both combined. So it is quite curious you singled Leary alone out on that. As if the only aspect of his life is "he liked acid".

So I am in error.

Why is he your role model?

Originally posted by theICONiac
Quite.

Although take away the drugs and he loses that certain pizazz, no?

What?

That's like saying that Einstein isn't so impressive without Relativity and the Photoelectric Effect. It's true but utterly pointless.

Originally posted by inimalist
I don't believe in personality traits, unfortunately

Not even as pragmatic labels?

Originally posted by King Kandy
I was curious about this. I'm an atheist, so I don't use any holy book as a guide to my life. But nonetheless, I do have people whose lives and teachings, I find highly applicable to myself and try to go by. I'm curious what people other members consider their "role models".

I have a lot of them, but here's a short few:

Mindset

Thomas Jefferson
Mozart
Nikola Tesla
Hunter S. Thompson

Mainly for their work ethic and ability to think in unconventional ways. They also didn't care about what people thought of them.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
What?

That's like saying that Einstein isn't so impressive without Relativity and the Photoelectric Effect. It's true but utterly pointless.

Yeeeeeeeeeahhhh...

So Leary has no further appeal beyond the drugs is what you are saying?

Originally posted by theICONiac
Yeeeeeeeeeahhhh...

So Leary has no further appeal beyond his entire career as a scientist and social activist is what you are saying?

fixed that for you

Leary cannot be extricated from "drugs" any more than Edison can be extricated from "inventing".

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Not even as pragmatic labels?

personality traits that are stable from situation to situation are rare and really, would be horribly maladaptive.

there is something to be said for people who are low social monitors (they have a lower level of social influence [conscious and unconscious] on their behaviour), but as you get into the extremes, well, this is entirely something I'm making up on the spot, but it would be indistinguishable from autism.

so I suppose you could use traits to describe people in certain contexts, and describe how consistent that behaviour is across contexts, but in general, no, I don't believe in trait theory of personality at all.

Originally posted by theICONiac
So Leary has no further appeal beyond the drugs is what you are saying?

Leary is a man who challanged the conventional American establishment so much that the president labeled him the most dangerous man in America...

I think of that, the Weather Underground, and the fact that Leary wrote most of the psychological tests they gave him in prison when I think of his impact on society... That all you know is drugs says something much more profound about your understanding.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
fixed that for you

Leary cannot be extricated from "drugs" any more than Edison can be extricated from "inventing".

Hey, we are getting somewhere! 😄

Let's continue with this train of thought. We are on a role here...

So when one proclaims Leary a role model (an individual by your own admission who cannot be extricated from "drugs" he endorsed) can one assume that drugs are a component of that admiration?

Originally posted by inimalist
Leary is a man who challanged the conventional American establishment so much that the president labeled him the most dangerous man in America...

I think of that, the Weather Underground, and the fact that Leary wrote most of the psychological tests they gave him in prison when I think of his impact on society... That all you know is drugs says something much more profound about your understanding.

I am sorry you are not getting my point.

That's kind of the trouble with taking "role models" too literally. We wouldn't want to become another person, so no role model is someone we'd want to emulate 100%. It's just varying degrees of cherry-picking traits and aspects of a person.

Again, I feel like "heroes" is easier to quantify. A person can be your hero and you could want to be nothing like them. Role model has such a heavy implication of emulation, that it makes it difficult to truthfully ascribe to anyone fully.

Originally posted by theICONiac
I am sorry you are not getting my point.

elaborate then

God my father and my husband!