Originally posted by zopzop
Do pre retcon Beyonder and MM count? If not : Scathan, Protege, PISless LT, Mxy, Mandrakk, GEB, any competent HotU user, HoM Wanda, MJJ, any competent user of the Nexus of All Realities. Honorable mention : any competent Starbrand user (the LT feared it).
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Dr. Doom.
But what I don't get, is that how any of those guys are above an Infinity Gauntlet user, and if that's not enough, what about all of those other powerful artifacts?
Wasn't Krona more powerful than all of those artifacts combined, or is my perceptions of JLA/Avengers wrong?
Originally posted by Stoic
But what I don't get, is that how any of those guys are above an Infinity Gauntlet user, and if that's not enough, what about all of those other powerful artifacts?Wasn't Krona more powerful than all of those artifacts combined, or is my perceptions of JLA/Avengers wrong?
The LT is easily above the IG/Cosmic Cube/etc.... he's multiversal. As is the Protege (who surpassed him) and Scathan (who manhandled the Protege) and the HotU (which owned the LT and all other abstracts in 616 reality). GEB is an evil Presence (both are multiversal). Mandrakk was above even that. Mxy, MJJ, Nexus of All Realities, and HoM Wanda are OMNIVERSAL.
With the Starbrand, Erishikegal had power enough to challenge the LT and upset the balance of power in the multiverse.
Quan's Thanos (If odin can't drop thanos, no one can. Odin is above TOAA and presence.)
Carver's Hulk (Hulk thunderclapped a freakin' dimensional barrier cast by Umar, a freaking dimensional barrier.)
H1a8 and shokosugi's superman (My calculations predict that force of 50 earth would be sufficient for combo to ko or THIS B LEVEL VILLAIN IS NO MATCH FOR SOOOPERMANNN......)
Originally posted by zopzop
The LT is easily above the IG/Cosmic Cube/etc.... he's multiversal. As is the Protege (who surpassed him) and Scathan (who manhandled the Protege) and the HotU (which owned the LT and all other abstracts in 616 reality). GEB is an evil Presence (both are multiversal). Mandrakk was above even that. Mxy, MJJ, Nexus of All Realities, and HoM Wanda are OMNIVERSAL.
Hold up.
You trying to tell me that:
1. Mxy, MJJ, etc., because they've had the term "omniversal" thrown around, are greater than the likes of LT, HotU, GEB, the Presence, etc?
2. That Mandrakk is above the GEB/Presence?
😕
Originally posted by Cogito
Hold up.You trying to tell me that:
1. Mxy, MJJ, etc., because they've had the term "omniversal" thrown around, are greater than the likes of LT, HotU, GEB, the Presence, etc?
2. That Mandrakk is above the GEB/Presence?😕
Don't be confused, it's simple really.
Concerning DC -
Mxy is beyond question. He destroyed and remade the entire DC OMNIVERSE. So there goes the Presence and GEB.
The Primal Monitor was so above DC's 52 universes that it seemed like an amoeba when he discovered it. Mandrakk if I'm not mistaken was his probe. So there goes that.
Concerning Marvel
Merlyn said that if MJJ wasn't stopped he posed a threat to the omniverse and would be the "new God playing dice with reality". A weaker alternate universe version of him took UNIVERSAL NULLIFICATION to destroy and it was said this trick wouldn't work on the 616 version. So yeah.
HOM Wanda remade the ENTIRE MARVERL OMNIVERSE with her Chaos Wave. Not even the HotU in Thanos' hands accomplished that (there were realities outside the scope of what he absorbed, Death's dimension was just one of them).
Originally posted by zopzop
Mxy is beyond question. He destroyed and remade the entire DC OMNIVERSE. So there goes the Presence and GEB.
Sigh...ok. WF Mxy had one feat that was, bar none, the greatest display of power in comics. If that's all you want to look at, then fine, go ahead. I, for one, won't accept him above the likes of the Presence.
Originally posted by zopzop
The Primal Monitor was so above DC's 52 universes that it seemed like an amoeba when he discovered it. Mandrakk if I'm not mistaken was his probe. So there goes that.
Originally posted by zopzop
Concerning Marvel
Merlyn said that if MJJ wasn't stopped he posed a threat to the omniverse and would be the "new God playing dice with reality". A weaker alternate universe version of him took UNIVERSAL NULLIFICATION to destroy and it was said this trick wouldn't work on the 616 version. So yeah.HOM Wanda remade the ENTIRE MARVERL OMNIVERSE with her Chaos Wave. Not even the HotU in Thanos' hands accomplished that (there were realities outside the scope of what he absorbed, Death's dimension was just one of them).
First, statements, especially those about potential, don't amount to much. Second, the HotU is most powerful than MJJ and Wanda and that's that.
Originally posted by guy222
wish dc had brought back wallylove the carnivore storyline
anyhoo, lt ftw
a little boy with glasses and a baseball bat, wally claims to be an incarnation of God. nobody has proved him wrong yet. the omnipotent wally encountered supergirl(linda) several times in her "Earth Angel" days, giving her advice and support. he bears a strange resemblance to the carnivore, the voluntarily fallen angel who is supposed to be his opposite number
Originally posted by Stoic
But what I don't get, is that how any of those guys are above an Infinity Gauntlet user, and if that's not enough, what about all of those other powerful artifacts?Wasn't Krona more powerful than all of those artifacts combined, or is my perceptions of JLA/Avengers wrong?
The LT was demonstrated to be above the Infinity Gauntlet, on panel. This is why Warlock gave up the gauntlet in Warlock #1. A confrontation between the two would have resulted in warlock losing, and all reality destroyed in the process.
Pre-Retcon beyonder is the most powerful entity ever seen in comics. Quadrillions of times more powerful/vast that the omniverse combined.
Even at the end of secret wars, we find that he was holding back- there's no way to gauge how strong he actually was. Pre Retcon MM is lower tier but at that high of a level it doesn't even matter.
Originally posted by Space M ummy
The LT was demonstrated to be above the Infinity Gauntlet, on panel. This is why Warlock gave up the gauntlet in Warlock #1. A confrontation between the two would have resulted in warlock losing, and all reality destroyed in the process.Pre-Retcon beyonder is the most powerful entity ever seen in comics. Quadrillions of times more powerful/vast that the omniverse combined.
Even at the end of secret wars, we find that he was holding back- there's no way to gauge how strong he actually was. Pre Retcon MM is lower tier but at that high of a level it doesn't even matter.
LT didnt demonstrate what u should stated of him being above the Gauntlet.
Adam gave it up willingly do the consequences if they confronted each other.
it doesnt make anyone superior over the other in power but relative equal regardless of who won. 😬
Originally posted by Nietzschean
LT didnt demonstrate what u should stated of him being above the Gauntlet.
Adam gave it up willingly do the consequences if they confronted each other.it doesnt make anyone superior over the other in power but relative equal regardless of who won. 😬
he did, actually. Reversed the damage adam did (blowing away the abstracts present) just by saying so, and during the "hearing" stated that he would win in a confrontation between the two (though it would wreck all reality in the process), which adam "should be aware of, due to his mastery of time." Adam conceded this point.
that wasn't speculation, that was a demonstration of power and perception of alternate timelines between the two. Adam and the LT were NOT equals there.