I've read a mental health book about this type of talk. It was described as having a slight case of schizophrenia. It's right there in the dictionary of psychology. The more detailed the response to what the person would do if they won such and such amount, defined how deeply the condition was, or is.
Originally posted by Stoic
I've read a mental health book about this type of talk. It was described as having a slight case of schizophrenia. It's right there in the dictionary of psychology. The more detailed the response to what the person would do if they won such and such amount, defined how deeply the condition was, or is.
[citation needed]
Originally posted by inimalist
[citation needed]
I couldn't find it out there on wiki, but I honestly read it in that dictionary, and found that I was guilty of such behavior as well. 🙂 This is what I did find though.
1. Characteristic symptoms: Two or more of the following, each present for much of the time during a one-month period (or less, if symptoms remitted with treatment).
* Delusions
* Hallucinations
* Disorganized speech, which is a manifestation of formal thought disorder
* Grossly disorganized behavior (e.g. dressing inappropriately, crying frequently) or catatonic behavior
* Negative symptoms: Blunted affect (lack or decline in emotional response), alogia (lack or decline in speech), or avolition (lack or decline in motivation)
If the delusions are judged to be bizarre, or hallucinations consist of hearing one voice participating in a running commentary of the patient's actions or of hearing two or more voices conversing with each other, only that symptom is required above. The speech disorganization criterion is only met if it is severe enough to substantially impair communication.
2. Social or occupational dysfunction: For a significant portion of the time since the onset of the disturbance, one or more major areas of functioning such as work, interpersonal relations, or self-care, are markedly below the level achieved prior to the onset.
3. Significant duration: Continuous signs of the disturbance persist for at least six months. This six-month period must include at least one month of symptoms (or less, if symptoms remitted with treatment).
Originally posted by Stoic
I couldn't find it out there on wiki, but I honestly read it in that dictionary, and found that I was guilty of such behavior as well. 🙂
/facepalm
I'm sure you did read it somewhere
I am also unsurprised that you read the symptoms of s psychological disorder and immediately thought you had them. Welcome to the most common thing ever in the history of the world.
Originally posted by Stoic
This is what I did find though.1. Characteristic symptoms: Two or more of the following, each present for much of the time during a one-month period (or less, if symptoms remitted with treatment).
[b]* Delusions
* Hallucinations
* Disorganized speech, which is a manifestation of formal thought disorder
* Grossly disorganized behavior (e.g. dressing inappropriately, crying frequently) or catatonic behavior
* Negative symptoms: Blunted affect (lack or decline in emotional response), alogia (lack or decline in speech), or avolition (lack or decline in motivation)If the delusions are judged to be bizarre, or hallucinations consist of hearing one voice participating in a running commentary of the patient's actions or of hearing two or more voices conversing with each other, only that symptom is required above. The speech disorganization criterion is only met if it is severe enough to substantially impair communication.
2. Social or occupational dysfunction: For a significant portion of the time since the onset of the disturbance, one or more major areas of functioning such as work, interpersonal relations, or self-care, are markedly below the level achieved prior to the onset.
3. Significant duration: Continuous signs of the disturbance persist for at least six months. This six-month period must include at least one month of symptoms (or less, if symptoms remitted with treatment). [/B]
ya, that is more or less a word for word copy of the DSM criteria for schizophrenia diagnosis.
How do you think delusions relate in any way to what we are talking about? people suffering delusions would be much less able to determine what to spend limitless amounts of money on than would people without them...
Originally posted by inimalist
/facepalmI'm sure you did read it somewhere
I am also unsurprised that you read the symptoms of s psychological disorder and immediately thought you had them. Welcome to the most common thing ever in the history of the world.
ya, that is more or less a word for word copy of the DSM criteria for schizophrenia diagnosis.
How do you think delusions relate in any way to what we are talking about? people suffering delusions would be much less able to determine what to spend limitless amounts of money on than would people without them...
No the dictionary was quite specific in it's explanation. What I got was from wiki. As I stated, I could not find the quote that I read in the Dictionary of Psychology, but it does not mean that I am telling a fib. Like I said, I was guilty of describing in detail, what I would have done if I won, such and such amount. It also said that it was a sign of having a slight amount of the disorder. Key word is slight.
Originally posted by Stoic
No the dictionary was quite specific in it's explanation. What I got was from wiki. As I stated, I could not find the quote that I read in the Dictionary of Psychology, but it does not mean that I am telling a fib.
I'm not accusing you of lying, I'm saying your source is wrong
Originally posted by Stoic
Like I said, I was guilty of describing in detail, what I would have done if I won, such and such amount. It also said that it was a sign of having a slight amount of the disorder. Key word is slight.
you are missing some part of the equation then, because having a detailed idea of what you would spend unlimited money on is not symptomatic of schizophrenia. There is no "hyper-organized" subtype.
Could it have been something like a restricted amount of money, like, what you would do with $10, and listing far too many things?
Originally posted by inimalist
I'm not accusing you of lying, I'm saying your source is wrongyou are missing some part of the equation then, because having a detailed idea of what you would spend unlimited money on is not symptomatic of schizophrenia. There is no "hyper-organized" subtype.
Could it have been something like a restricted amount of money, like, what you would do with $10, and listing far too many things?
No it literally said that people who make detailed accounts of what they would do if they won substantial amounts of money, fall into the category of having a slight amount of the disorder. Honest Indian. I had to check myself, and realized that i had done what it described several times. If you go and read the definition of being schizophrenic on the wiki site that I was on, you will see some common symptoms that lend power to what i read in that dictionary. Socioeconomic situations were very interesting among other citations on that link. here read it for yourself.
Originally posted by Stoic
No it literally said that people who make detailed accounts of what they would do if they won a substantial amounts of money, fall into the category of having a slight amount of the disorder. Honest Indian.
yes, I believe you read that somewhere, don't worry. The internet is full of completely BS information, especially about issues of psychology and mental health, especially about schizophrenia (psychopathy and sociopathy as well, hell, add depression and ADHD to that list... ugh)
however, if we look at what scientists say, first, we see there is no published literature, at all, about schizophrenia and lottery winnings
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=schizophrenia%20lottery
and a search for "schizophrenia money" returns 5 pages of results, none of which deal with the ability to plan what you would spend money on as a sign of schizophrenia.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=schizophrenia%20money
(in fact, it is such an unsearched topic that PubMed suggests I am looking for "schizophrenia monkey"😉
further, individuals with schizophrenia are seen to have sporadic, at best, incentive to perform based on winning monetary rewards
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19821433
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9824878
the second link is especially important, as the Wisconsin card sorting task specifically requires the ability to organize one's thoughts, which would be crucial for detailing things to spend money on. A loss of this cognitive organizational capacity is nearly tautological with schizophrenia.
additionally, when tested in economic games, individuals with schizophrenia show a decreased ability compared to non-clinical populations
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17905200
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17916386
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21035194
and finally, when people actually check how individuals with schizophrenia spend their money, they find close to 70% of their disposable income spent on addictive/psychoactive substances (cigarettes, alcohol, drugs)
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17901909
do you have any evidence at all?
Originally posted by Stoic
I had to check myself, and realized that i had done what it described several times. If you go and read the definition of being schizophrenic on the wiki site that I was on, you will see some common symptoms that lend power to what i read in that dictionary. Socioeconomic situations were very interesting among other citations on that link.
/sigh
which common symptoms of schizophrenia suggest what you are saying?
I shouldn't have to try and interpret the point you are making...
Originally posted by Stoic
here read it for yourself.
the only mention of money on that page describes how 70% of the population believes people with schizophrenia are irresponsible with their money.
Originally posted by Stoic
No it literally said that people who make detailed accounts of what they would do if they won substantial amounts of money, fall into the category of having a slight amount of the disorder. Honest Indian. I had to check myself, and realized that i had done what it described several times. If you go and read the definition of being schizophrenic on the wiki site that I was on, you will see some common symptoms that lend power to what i read in that dictionary. Socioeconomic situations were very interesting among other citations on that link. here read it for yourself.
What? No, making planes to spend money that you don't have is not a mental disorder. It is called planning a vacation.
Originally posted by inimalist
apparently, budgeting one's paycheque is a sign of schizophrenia...
You don't get it. It's the role playing part in your mind that the dictionary was referring to. It also did not say that those that partook in this behavior were full blown, but rather exhibit slight signs of the disorder. Again the keyword here is slight.
Originally posted by Stoic
You don't get it. It's the role playing part in your mind that the dictionary was referring to. It also did not say that those that partook in this behavior were full blown, but rather exhibit slight signs of the disorder.
then you have part of the test wrong, or what they are measuring...
for instance, just naming many things with unlimited money would not be a sign of any schizophrenia, regardless of the number named.
However, say you said, "How many groceries could you buy with $10", different subtypes of schizophrenia would give different answers, and more would not always be symptomatic of a disorder (the catatonic subtype would be expected to give much less than a non-clinical individual).
Additionally, such a test would be really inconclusive. You could pin down sterotypic or perseverance patterns in cognition, you could pick up repetition or rule breaking, but none of those relate to a diagnosis of schizophrenia specifically. In every case, there are numerous reasons that such biases could exist. In fact, most disorders that impact the dopamine system or the basal ganglia would produce those effects, including things that tend to be largely motor disorders (Parkinson's).
But simply just a numerical count of the number of things? that has no value whatsoever, I'm sorry, there could literally be hundreds of non-pathological reasons a person would list more things (for instance, simply having thought more about it in the past, or coming from a SES that alters the way they think about needs in a more greedy or ostentatious manner, or being more interested in the task). Your source is just flat out wrong.
like, can you provide a link to anything that suggests this is actually a thing? I don't think that is a test for schizophrenia at all... Like, maybe it is older? Something that would describe the schizophrenic mind as "role playing" does not sound like modern clinical psychology... It almost sounds like one of those personality tests where they are trying to sell you something at the end(?)
Originally posted by Stoic
Again the keyword here is slight.
there is no such thing as slight schizophrenia
there are schizotype disorders, but even then, I'd imagine people who suffer those wouldn't agree with the adverb