Originally posted by Stoic
Bush. So by the time he finishes cleaning up his mess Americans may go ahead and vote the republicans back in and we can start all over again. First they would put more taxes on the poor and middle class citizens, and allow the rich to grow richer by encouraging the outsourcing of jobs again. Wow Obama is such a bad guy, after all why should people have free health care?
I agree with this.
Originally posted by Brockalizer
How's the koolaid over there in Jersey? Time for a history lesson. Reagan inheritted a worse economy than Obama did. He didnt piss and moan about it, or keep blaming his predeccessor. He got to work and fixxed it. Why? Because a real leader produces results not excuses. Bush's tax cuts generated more revenues for the government than ever before. The tax cuts didn't tank the economy the housing bubble burst, that is what started the collapse. Guess who decided that not being able to afford a home shouldn't keep people from getting home loans? Here's a hint, it rhymes with Carter. Secondly Obama enjoyed an unbeatable majority in both houses of Congress for the first two years as president yet things got worse, how is that not his/their fault. Finally if free healthcare is so great why are deathrates from common cancers, such as breast and prostate, as much as 50% higher in countries with "free" healcare? Why do millions of Canadians and Europeans chose to come here and pay for treatment every year, rather than stay home and get "free" treatment. Why do people in Canada and Europe have to wait an average of six months for a hip replacement?
A history lesson you say? If you are gonna compare apples then compare apples to apples instead of to oranges. Reagan inherited a problem primary situated in america. It wasn't a global effect like what fdr or Obama had to deal with. Reagan also go the benefit of inheriting an American recovering from decades of presidents who cut taxes, and paid for it by cutting social services? And if you think the mess in the economy came from carter and not all the money spent warring in the cold war era sponsored by the fear mongering of Nixon and his republicans.
And let me simplify health care for you. Right now people run to the emergency room because they can't afford services. Accumulating bills they will never ever pay. So these people that never go. They get far. Sick. On disability. And then they feed off the ssi system. Guess what if you don't do preventive medicines which are cheaper you end up with people with diabetes etc costing us a lot more. Short term pain for long term benefit. Yes there's pros and cons but in the end the pros outweighs the cons.
Way too many people get caught up in the little stuff and ignore the big picture.
And let's just ignore the fact that bush increased spending AND decreased tax collections. If someone told you they were taking a pay cut and going to trade up from a Toyota to a BMW you'd consider them nuts right?
On and on. I could just as easily attack why the democrats did wrong but they didn't start this. I'm sick of people in the republican party, MY party saying its Obama blaming bush when it's a few years back they were just as quick to blame Clinton for 9/11.
Sadly I think the GOP gave obama the keys to the kingdom to use him as a scapegoat like they did carter. Shrug. Economies in a shambles? Let's let the democrats clean up the mess and incite rage and by the time we come back into power the mess will have lessened to the point where we look good. :-/
Originally posted by JakeTheBank
Anyway, it's pretty obvious this thread was designed to draw people in to a political debate. Is Obama perfect? Far cry from it. But I'll take him over the bigots and zealots on the far right.
What's sad is that it's actually the people who know very little about the overall picture that take the extremist views, where as those who diversify their education will move towards the middle or claim independence so that they don't have to take the sheep mentality of voting. The horrible part is that the uninformed are the extremes. My friend and I are both republicans. He decried obamas health care plan without ever reading it.
Hell he didn't even know the names mitt, newt, sanctorum or what they stand for. Paul Ryan? Ron Paul? We were gonna vote for Palin a woman who wanted a bridge built to nowhere?
Ever meet someone that hated on people that took handouts one war and then accept them the next? What exactly do you think these foreclosure, auto industry bailouts and refinances are? Any republican worth his salt thinking that accepting help in this matter is different than low income accepting food stamps is deceiving themselves.
And I'm sure someone like brockalizer ignore how bush tried to revamp the entire social security system while using it as his own personal bailout piggy bank.
Ever wonder why taxes went up? Tax breaks to the rich during the bush era set for a decade and scheduled to expire two years into obamas term.
People like brockalizer are spoon fed everything they know about politics an like sheep they accept it without looking further into the details.
Hypocrisy exists on both ends.
Originally posted by Brockalizer
How's the koolaid over there in Jersey? Time for a history lesson. Reagan inheritted a worse economy than Obama did. He didnt piss and moan about it, or keep blaming his predeccessor. He got to work and fixxed it. Why? Because a real leader produces results not excuses. Bush's tax cuts generated more revenues for the government than ever before. The tax cuts didn't tank the economy the housing bubble burst, that is what started the collapse. Guess who decided that not being able to afford a home shouldn't keep people from getting home loans? Here's a hint, it rhymes with Carter. Secondly Obama enjoyed an unbeatable majority in both houses of Congress for the first two years as president yet things got worse, how is that not his/their fault. Finally if free healthcare is so great why are deathrates from common cancers, such as breast and prostate, as much as 50% higher in countries with "free" healcare? Why do millions of Canadians and Europeans chose to come here and pay for treatment every year, rather than stay home and get "free" treatment. Why do people in Canada and Europe have to wait an average of six months for a hip replacement?
😆
Originally posted by rotiart
What's sad is that it's actually the people who know very little about the overall picture that take the extremist views, where as those who diversify their education will move towards the middle or claim independence so that they don't have to take the sheep mentality of voting. The horrible part is that the uninformed are the extremes. My friend and I are both republicans. He decried obamas health care plan without ever reading it.Hell he didn't even know the names mitt, newt, sanctorum or what they stand for. Paul Ryan? Ron Paul? We were gonna vote for Palin a woman who wanted a bridge built to nowhere?
Ever meet someone that hated on people that took handouts one war and then accept them the next? What exactly do you think these foreclosure, auto industry bailouts and refinances are? Any republican worth his salt thinking that accepting help in this matter is different than low income accepting food stamps is deceiving themselves.
And I'm sure someone like brockalizer ignore how bush tried to revamp the entire social security system while using it as his own personal bailout piggy bank.
Ever wonder why taxes went up? Tax breaks to the rich during the bush era set for a decade and scheduled to expire two years into obamas term.
People like brockalizer are spoon fed everything they know about politics an like sheep they accept it without looking further into the details.
Hypocrisy exists on both ends.
Kabooom. I couldn't agree more. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if there were people out there that cast their votes on the grounds of who is better looking.