Does this sound like a plausible plot?

Lestov, I can't tell you what to write about, but to use Christian in this way may not be the best subject that you could write about, because for one, Christian's are a peace loving crowd, by edict. Perhaps if you wrote a book based on the same premise but made it more of a John Carter Warlord of Mars setting, without using Christian, Muslim, or any of the other various religious groups in reality, you may get a better response. This would make it far easier for you to tell the tale the way that you would like for the consumer to take it. Just an idea.

Originally posted by Stoic
But that's how you feel friend, other people may enjoy this type of lifestyle. It's the way of the world. Free thought, and choice, and the rest of all of that good stuff.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
I know and it's something I'll never understand. And I can't even get any of them to explain it to me because when I word it like that, they get offended.

They get a feeling, a good one when they pray to Jesus, and they go back each week seeking that same feeling. Indoctrination, is a very strong thing once assimilation occurs. Now you may believe that you have not been effected by indoctrination, but we all have. What I am speaking of is a very profound thing.

We are all born, and once we reach a certain age, we are each taught certain things like; you must go to school, and educate yourself in order to find a good job so that you can take care of yourself, which will then open doors to you being able to buy a car, a nice house with a white picket fence. This education will also open doors to you having a decent social life; where you may find a spouse, so that you can have children, and then the cycle repeats itself through you, as you indoctrinate your children with what you were taught.

Many Christian's seek to pierce the veil of the facade of what is, or can not be perceived by the natural man/woman in order to see the metaphysical, which is God, and his/it's kingdom. Born again Christian's, are children in the spirit once the baptism takes place, and mature as their understanding of the bible grows. Are they indoctrinated? Of course. Is indoctrination a bad thing? Well, look deeper, and ask yourself if it is worse than the indoctrination that you have been brought up to follow.

By the way... What do you think the Matrix film was based on? Do you recall what Morpheus asked Neo in the first film?

I heard about a pop-science show that was talking about the neurochemistry of prayer. Certain brain-patterns 'lit up' when a person had a conversation with someone in the same room that did not activate when they knew they were talking to an empty room. These same centers showed activity during believers' prayer, but not during atheists' prayer.

Theists actually, on a physiological level, believe their prayers to be heard. So that helped me to understand how the belief is more persistent than the many counterarguments.

Originally posted by Stoic
Do you recall what Morpheus asked Neo in the first film?

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Since like half his dialogue was questions, I'm just gonna say no. Also I realized that a lot of what you described theists as wanting are all related to sensations of pleasure and comfort, and the belief that worship in their deity will provide those things. It's at about that point that logic breaks down, faith takes over, and my ability to relate to those people falls flat. Not to say "faith" is horrible, but faith for comfort just screams "COP OUT!" to me.

But on the same note, many people that do not believe in God, still have faith in something. You seem to be a well educated individual, so excuse me for asking this, but do you have faith that if a person studies hard enough that they will eventually get a job in their field of studies if they'd put forth enough effort in those studies, as well as equally putting forth effort in finding that job?

This is why I said that perhaps you might want to look deeper. We are all jacked into a system one way or the other. What comforts you may be different than what comforts another person. People need something to believe in, whether it be in science, or theology, or some other form of activity to get them through.

Christians, and other religious folk, have good reasons to believe in God, or a higher power, because let's face it, you can hardly get something from nothing, and if you look around, there are a whole lot of things out there.

Belief due to unknown catalyst's? Hahaha

you've talked a lot about why belief feels good, but not about why it's true. And the only truth-argument you've given, "something from nothing" is insufficient to justify a belief in the Christian god. (All the Cosmological argument can establish is a First Cause, but none of the characteristics of that cause.)

And in fact, all my comment was about was how the theist feels during prayer. If you read carefully, my post doesn't say that belief/disbelief is caused by these structures in the brain (not catalysts). Rather, people with different beliefs experience prayer differently.

I didn't give a causal relationship (and afaik neither did the scientists).

Originally posted by Stoic
Lestov, I can't tell you what to write about, but to use Christian in this way may not be the best subject that you could write about, because for one, Christian's are a peace loving crowd, by edict.

I can't tell, are you being serious here?

I hope not. It's a proven fact that the majority of Christians since time immemorial are anarchists, murderers & rapists by nature.

In the future, when archaeologists stumble upon this layer of the internet, they'll probably think that we are all just socks of Symmetric Chaos, or maybe an enclave of absurdists.

But if theres no God and hence no Heaven then where do all the calculators go after they die?

Checkmate, Atheists!

Originally posted by Nephthys
But if theres no God and hence no Heaven then where do all the calculators go after they die?

You actually believe in calculators!?

Originally posted by Stoic
But on the same note, many people that do not believe in God, still have faith in something. You seem to be a well educated individual, so excuse me for asking this, but do you have faith that if a person studies hard enough that they will eventually get a job in their field of studies if they'd put forth enough effort in those studies, as well as equally putting forth effort in finding that job?

This is why I said that perhaps you might want to look deeper. We are all jacked into a system one way or the other. What comforts you may be different than what comforts another person. People need something to believe in, whether it be in science, or theology, or some other form of activity to get them through.

Christians, and other religious folk, have good reasons to believe in God, or a higher power, because let's face it, you can hardly get something from nothing, and if you look around, there are a whole lot of things out there.

Belief due to unknown catalyst's? Hahaha

That said, you kinda nailed what I'm talking about. The cosmological and existential answers evade these theists, so they turn to deities and religions for answers. For comfort. I don't understand why people turn to intangible, imperceptible, and mystical solutions for the sake of comfort. To me, that's uncomfortable. I'd rather be permanently stumped and forever asking "Why?" than formulate a comfort-answer based around unfalsifiability, unquantifiability, and mystery. The weird thing is, many of them will freely admit to their God possessing those traits, and still accept it's existence as being all the answer they need. Like they're surrendering their curiosity and desire to know truth for the sake of feeling emotionally safe and secure. Boggles my f*cking mind.

That's what I don't get: people who try to comfort themselves with answers to (as of yet) unanswerable questions by piling on more mysterious unanswerable questions.

👆👆

Originally posted by Oliver North
I can't tell, are you being serious here?

I was very serious. You see, Christians don't kill, however there have always been men that hid behind the banner of Christianity and killed, raped, and done many wretched things in the name of Christ. This does not and never will make them Christians however. For example the crusades that went on and were even ordered to happen by certain churches were not Christians at all. Christlike, in the way that they move yes, but not Christian.

Originally posted by Zampanó
you've talked a lot about why belief feels good, but not about why it's true. And the only truth-argument you've given, "something from nothing" is insufficient to justify a belief in the Christian god. (All the Cosmological argument can establish is a First Cause, but none of the characteristics of that cause.)

And in fact, all my comment was about was how the theist feels during prayer. If you read carefully, my post doesn't say that belief/disbelief is caused by these structures in the brain (not catalysts). Rather, people with different beliefs experience prayer differently.

I didn't give a causal relationship (and afaik neither did the scientists).

How can anyone prove anything that has not been seen, and even if it was seen by one person, if they can not reproduce this sighting before a large group of skeptics, then it can not be proven. I'm not really here to prove anything, but just to say that it is everyone's right to believe in whatever they want to, as long as it does not harm the lives of others. I simply stated that religious people have good reason to believe in God, because you simply can not get something from nothing. I also stated that there sure are a whole lot of things to justify their beliefs, which now becomes more of a fact, than just a feeling. Why? Because there is tangible evidence all over the place. Don't get me wrong though, I'm not here to convince anyone of anything.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
I hope not. It's a proven fact that the majority of Christians since time immemorial are anarchists, murderers & rapists by nature.

How is it a proven fact? Is it also a proven fact that all black men are lazy criminals that stand on street corners selling drugs? Or that all white men are crazed serial killers? You really have no right to paint such a broad picture of any majority until you have met the people being painted in this light. Sorry but what you just stated was thoroughly offensive. I don't know what will become of people once they are dead, or if we truly have souls that will one day be judged for better or worse, but it's every persons right to believe in whatever they like to. Before you judge Christians you should study what it means to be a Christian, and then once you do this, ask yourself if a true Christian would murder, steal, kill, and rape. You will find that they are just as capable as any other person of committing these offenses, but the doctrine that they follow never bred this type of behavior. The people that do bad things things were doing these things in their hearts, long before ever becoming Christians, and will continue to do these bad things until they decide to stop, or are stopped. You have to divide the ones with mental issues from the ones that are not plagued with the desire to do harm. Most governments that people pledge allegiance to have far more blood soaked hands than any religious order ever will.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
Faith in tangibles I get. Faith in intangibles, not so much.

That said, you kinda nailed what I'm talking about. The cosmological and existential answers evade these theists, so they turn to deities and religions for answers. For comfort. I don't understand why people turn to intangible, imperceptible, and mystical solutions for the sake of comfort. To me, that's [b]uncomfortable. I'd rather be permanently stumped and forever asking "Why?" than formulate a comfort-answer based around unfalsifiability, unquantifiability, and mystery. The weird thing is, many of them will freely admit to their God possessing those traits, and still accept it's existence as being all the answer they need. Like they're surrendering their curiosity and desire to know truth for the sake of feeling emotionally safe and secure. Boggles my f*cking mind.

That's what I don't get: people who try to comfort themselves with answers to (as of yet) unanswerable questions by piling on more mysterious unanswerable questions. [/B]

Faith is what drives people. I'm not sure if you've fully thought this out. Look deeper within yourself like i asked you to do before. You yourself are driven like all others, and with hope, you live your life by faith in one thing or another. How many times have you been unsure of how events would unfold? How do you see yourself as being different? Those with no faith, or hope tend to live hopeless lives, and in turn find no joy in life, or very little to any reason to continue living.

Anyways guys, I never wanted to get into a religious discussion here. I just wanted to bring light upon those that would carry the banner of Christ, and call themselves Christians, but what they really are is the polar opposite. I must learn to stick to one liners.

I agree with the notion that everyone lives their lives by faith in the intangible, to varying degrees, for comfort. If you genuinely have no faith in variables that you can't quantify then you'd never step outside your door, unless you simply didn't care whether you live or die.

I don't really see how the statement "I'm not depressed by life because I believe that when I die I'll go to heaven, even though I have no empirical evidence to support this notion" is any different than "I'm not afraid of getting on this airplane because I'm confident that it won't crash, even though I have no empirical evidence to support the notion that it won't."

Originally posted by Stoic
I was very serious. You see, Christians don't kill, however there have always been men that hid behind the banner of Christianity and killed, raped, and done many wretched things in the name of Christ. This does not and never will make them Christians however. For example the crusades that went on and were even ordered to happen by certain churches were not Christians at all. Christlike, in the way that they move yes, but not Christian.

Your argument is, then, that someone who sins is no longer a Christian?

Originally posted by Tzeentch._
"I'm not afraid of getting on this airplane because I'm confident that it won't crash, even though I have no empirical evidence to support the notion that it won't."

wouldn't the statistics on plane crashes be empirical evidence to support that notion?

In theory, statistics that showed the probability of going to heaven would be evidence that one might go to heaven.

Originally posted by Oliver North
wouldn't the statistics on plane crashes be empirical evidence to support that notion?

It's an assumption most of us make, though, for the sake of feeling better.