Collateral damage vs Characters power level

Always wondered about this. How important is collateral damage when its concerning a fight? Example...let's say if someone toppled a Celestial with a punch and damaged him would that punch be greater than what WBH did in the dark dimension? Which is important, collateral damage or power level (damaging something of significant power above yours)?

They are both very important.

One thing I'll say however, sometimes non-descript displays of power than just involves knocking down or hurting a tough opponent MAY have jobbing/pis involved.

But collateral damage is a pretty straightforward and undeniable show of power.

Collateral damage, when we see it, is obviously a pretty definitive showing of power.

Not seeing it, though, doesn't mean that the characters are somehow lacking in power; it's a part of the medium that you can't show as much collateral damage as powers imply. Otherwise everytime Superman or Hulk dukes it out with someone, the shockwaves from their punches alone (even with shock absorption taken in to account) would likely kill anyone close by.

Power level will always, imo, take precedence when shown through peer-to-peer interactions, fights, and of course feats.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Collateral damage, when we see it, is obviously a pretty definitive showing of power.

Not seeing it, though, doesn't mean that the characters are somehow lacking in power; it's a part of the medium that you can't show as much collateral damage as powers imply. Otherwise everytime Superman or Hulk dukes it out with someone, the shockwaves from their punches alone (even with shock absorption taken in to account) would likely kill anyone close by.

Power level will always, imo, take precedence when shown through peer-to-peer interactions, fights, and of course feats.

Great post.

hulk slams into hulkbuster ironman (broke windows all over and f'd shit up indirectly) just like he did his wife, only difference is that latter was exponentially more powerful, scientific notation worthy

Collateral damage is over rated (but fun in forum fights). As evidence, I give you the "BILLION DIMENSION SLAGGING" blast of Pre-Retcon MM. He hit and actually staggered PR Beyonder with that sh|t and the walls in Marsha's apartment building weren't even singed! LOL.

Another example. Bor, big poppa of the Norse Pantheon. Even more powerful than Odin and Serpent was fighting Thor, who at the time I believe had full possession of the Thorforce, making him Odin's equal if not more powerful.

The fight iirc might have made some cracks in one small part of a city block. Maybe they knocked over a lightpost.

I'm 'amazed' at how fast collateral damage in a comic-book city gets repaired, something I never thought about until after 9-11. I mean, in RL, can you imagine how long it would take to repair the damage from WBH's footsteps?

That's something I liked about "Hancock": the film did somewhat address the reality of collateral damage resulting when a superbeing does his thing, how expensive repair is, how collateral damage can affect public opinion, etc.

Originally posted by Mindship
I'm 'amazed' at how fast collateral damage in a comic-book city gets repaired, something I never thought about until after 9-11. I mean, in RL, can you imagine how long it would take to repair the damage from WBH's footsteps?

That's something I liked about "Hancock": the film did somewhat address the reality of collateral damage resulting when a superbeing does his thing, how expensive repair is, how collateral damage can affect public opinion, etc.

I mean you have heroes that can lift hundreds of tons of crap, move stuff with their minds, rearrange molecules, warp reality, etc... I'm sure they pitch in off panel to help repair any damage caused.

Hell, you have people like Franklin Richards, who can basically create another universe if 616 reality gets too messed up.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Collateral damage, when we see it, is obviously a pretty definitive showing of power.

Not seeing it, though, doesn't mean that the characters are somehow lacking in power; it's a part of the medium that you can't show as much collateral damage as powers imply. Otherwise everytime Superman or Hulk dukes it out with someone, the shockwaves from their punches alone (even with shock absorption taken in to account) would likely kill anyone close by.

Power level will always, imo, take precedence when shown through peer-to-peer interactions, fights, and of course feats.

Originally posted by zopzop
Not really that incredible once you think about it.

I mean you have heroes that can lift hundreds of tons of crap, move stuff with their minds, rearrange molecules, warp reality, etc... I'm sure they pitch in off panel to help repair any damage caused.

Hell, you have people like Franklin Richards, who can basically create another universe if 616 reality gets too messed up.

...though now and then, I wouldn't mind seeing them metas helping out in-panel (perhaps they have -- I just missed it) to give creedence to what you said, which does make sense.

I've seen Flash, GL and Superman at the very least offer to help and at times actually help, but it does seem pretty rare to see it on panel.

Sentry unleashing the power of "million exploding" suns barely damaged the neighbourhood...

Originally posted by SamZED
Sentry unleashing the power of "million exploding" suns barely damaged the neighbourhood...

And somehow nobody dies when this shit happens.

meh, collateral damage is a tool like anything else in comics. it should be used as it is used in a comic, imo--that is to say--if the writer focuses on it, then we should take it into consideration (namor v thing in avx, red hulk v colossus are simple examples) but when it is not made an issue, or is flat out omitted or ignored, i don't think it can be held against the characters. people aren't killed, buildings aren't toppled, etc....for the same reason a character's clothing isn't singed or disintegrated. the medium requires a VARYING degree of suspension of disbelief. i don't think we can paint each example with the same brush. that is something that is done too often in this forum. imo.

I was watching the Avengers again the other day and the part where Tony is trying to work on the helicarrier's engines, he let heavy pieces of metal fall to the ground which would have easily killed someone if the metal had hit them. I know not the same thing.

Originally posted by leonidas
meh, collateral damage is a tool like anything else in comics. it should be used as it is used in a comic, imo--that is to say--if the writer focuses on it, then we should take it into consideration (namor v thing in avx, red hulk v colossus are simple examples) but when it is not made an issue, or is flat out omitted or ignored, i don't think it can be held against the characters. people aren't killed, buildings aren't toppled, etc....for the same reason a character's clothing isn't singed or disintegrated. the medium requires a VARYING degree of suspension of disbelief. i don't think we can paint each example with the same brush. that is something that is done too often in this forum. imo.

Kind of like how Dragonball Z focuses a lot on collateral damage.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
👆 Exactly.

Kind of like how Dragonball Z focuses a lot on collateral damage.

Everything suddenly becomes clearer now....

Originally posted by -Pr-
Collateral damage, when we see it, is obviously a pretty definitive showing of power.

Not seeing it, though, doesn't mean that the characters are somehow lacking in power; it's a part of the medium that you can't show as much collateral damage as powers imply. Otherwise everytime Superman or Hulk dukes it out with someone, the shockwaves from their punches alone (even with shock absorption taken in to account) would likely kill anyone close by.

Power level will always, imo, take precedence when shown through peer-to-peer interactions, fights, and of course feats.

Absence of collateral damage is never an indication of power, however, the presence of collateral damage is.

we all agree that monarch's explosion was weaksauce, though 👆