Originally posted by zopzop
Strange with AO's power impressed the LT and the LT himself said so.Strange sans ALL of his artifacts annihilated Gorath and his minions. Dance around this fact all you want Cort, it's not going away.
You're dancing around the fact that Strange already had imbued himself with enough black magic power that even if he did have those artifacts that were transported to Agamotto's realm after the fight with Urthona they wouldn't have made the slightest bit of difference since he was already more powerful than he had ever been.
Yeah and? None of those no named beings you mentioned mean anything. We have no feats or fights to gauge their power by! The fact that Strange wtfpwned Arioch in like 8 panels says all we need to know about Arioch's power level. And it's not good.
It really just shows more about Strange's power and abilities. Notice that when Arioch states he has 'infinite power', Strange agrees that he cannot possibly stand up to it, so he resorts to fusing with him. Considering a peer of the Ancient One couldn't even make it to Arioch's realm without going comatose yet an Ancient One empowered Strange was hanging with Zom years earlier, I'd say it's at least clear that Arioch is superior to the Zom that was seen struggling to catch the agile Doc Strange. 😛
Pulling out his forlock was the only way to beat him, since it would unleash evil energy and summon the LT. That was what the AO told Strange before merging with the stone pillar. Strange with AO's power did nothing to Zom. Zom, on the other hand, had Strange dead to rights until the LT arrived.
A young and inexperienced Doc Strange who wasn't even Sorcerer Supreme was holding his own against Zom after AO gave him his power. Why is that such a big deal to you? Good lord, Kaluu himself could have done similarly based on the showing of that encounter. Zom's not impressive in the least bit.
Strange has humiliated Gorath on at least 2 occasions. 😆
You exaggerate things. Strange getting manhandled and toyed with and having to resort to killing his mentor to BFR Shuma back to his dimension isn't exactly a humiliation for Shuma. Shuma would have killed Strange instantly had he not played with him. Then again, Dormammu's arrogance gets the best of him on multiple occasions and causes his defeats. And I really think you're reaching when you keep bringing up Shuma's appearance on Earth when he was starved "weak and hungry after long slumber". Sure Shuma-Gorath was fairly beaten when Strange fought him in his realm but to act like Strange merged with gods and boosted to levels far beyond his normal scope = Strange as normal or even SS is outright silly.
When did the Vishanti even fight Gorath?! And I'm not talking about ONE sentence. What were the circumstances of the fight.You are basing your whole argument off ONE SENTENCE with no context behind it.
It's stated by Agamotto that they fought Shuma-Gorath before. Hoggoth backs him up by saying that they recall Shuma-Gorath well. And later Kaluu tells Strange that not even Agamotto had destroyed a lord of chaos. You can cry for context all you want, but it's clear that Shuma-Gorath is in the Vishanti's league otherwise the Vishanti wouldn't have said that they fought with him and Kaluu wouldn't have made such a big deal about Agamotto not even doing such a thing.
I typed this to you in a previous thread concerning S-G, but I'll type it again. When one reads a comic or watches a cartoon that uses its characters to relay ground rules to the reader/viewer, the simplest interpretations are the ones that really matter. In the case of Shuma-Gorath fighting the Vishanti, we can ask ourselves if the Vishanti really fought Shuma literally, or we can throw into the equation random what-ifs coming from our imaginations. Or, we could go ahead and apply the razor and say: "The Vishanti said that they fought Shuma-Gorath, both are still around, none was said to have defeated the other on panel or in bios, etc, Kaluu made a big deal about Strange being able to do what not even Agamotto could do." These are all conclusions that don't require second-guessing to reach. If we're willing to take such a counter-productive stance for perfectly decisive statements, we may as well be questioning every other seemingly direct indicator in Marvel with an axe to grind. Clearly Shuma's within the Vishanti's league.
And as we've seen, Strange DIDN'T kill Gorath, because Gorath was going to be reborn through Strange. If Strange really did kill Gorath, we wouldn't have any subsequent appearances by him no? Some feat.
Strange prevented Shuma-Gorath from slaughtering Earth's populace as he did in prehistoric times by defeating him. That's what his goal was. Shattering Shuma's shell is no easy task. It's a great feat for Strange.
Originally posted by Marvel_Mystic
Cort's trolling hard today.Dormammu wins because he actually fights people and doesn't sit his ass in his dimension all day like Shuma.
Trolling...me? It's not my fault that zop gets emotional whenever Shuma's name is mentioned on KMC.
And Dormammu is far more persistent than Shuma in attacking 616, sure. But being arrogant and more willing to get your ass kicked by higher powers doesn't impress me.
