Pikon runs the SSJ2 gauntlet
Pikon is interested in testing the might of the saiyans he has not fought. Goku gave him the closest match of his afterlife so he now wants to see how he can fare against the others.
1. SS2 Teen Gohan(Buu saga)
2. SS2 Gohan(Cell games)
3. SS2 Vegeta
4. SS2 Majin Vegeta
How far does Pikon get? Which fights are as close as his fight with Goku?
That *should* have been Super-Perfect Cell that Pikkon casually two-shotted. If so, he'd get to at least #3.
Wait are you questioning of the validity of it or do you not know what it means?
If the first one then Goku's hair was his original SSJ hair and he had no sparks so he definitely wasn't a SSJ2.
If the latter then it means Mastered Super Saiyan which was the form Goku and Gohan took after a year of training. It's essentially Super Saiyan without an energy drawback that fatigues them easily.
Anyways Pikkon had a hard fight with a regular SSJ so he's weaker than any SSJ2.
Originally posted by Galan007
Pikkon two-shotted a SSJ2-level being(Super-Perfect Cell), so I don't know where this "any SSJ2 beats him" nonsense is coming from.He also shrugged off Goku's super-kaioken, for what it's worth.
lol the real nonsense is if you think a SSJ2 fighter would be evenly matched against a normal SSJ just because you're using a 2 second high showing. And Cell showed no sparks so there is absolutely no evidence that he was powered up as SPC but nice try.
Cell was taken by surprise, nothing more. It happens all the time...
Anything above that is just ignoring reason.
Lol, so Cell was inextricably depowered upon his death? Please, I'd rather not start just making things up. It was Super-Perfect Cell, unless you have evidence to the contrary.
Additionally, we know that Goku had evidently become more powerful after his death, because he was about to engage Super-Perfect Cell as a FALSE SSJ, until Pikkon swooped in:
So despite already knowing how powerful Cell was, Goku didn't even feel the need to transform into a proper SSJ to fight him. This is indicative of Goku becoming substantially more powerful. How could his power have increased that much? Well, the only logical answer is that he received a decent zenkai secondary to his pre-death beat-down at the hands of Cell & the Cell Juniors.
Anyway, it's clear that Pikkon is solidly in the SSJ2 tier-- nothing less than that could have beaten SPC so easily. You not liking said feat doesn't change the fact that it still happened. 👆
[edit]
And Pikkon did NOT take Cell by surprise. Had you actually watched the clip I posted, you would have noted that Cell both saw, and verbally reacted to, Pikkon coming at him head-on, prior to being attacked:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYcEvG3rvl0
(1:50)
Pikkon tooled him fair and square.
Originally posted by Galan007
Lol, so Cell was inextricably depowered upon his death? Please, I'd rather not start just making things up. It was Super-Perfect Cell, unless you have evidence to the contrary.
What part of no sparks was hard to understand? Do you not watch DBZ? Characters spend time to, you know, power up? Right? Cell was toying with weaklings and didn't bother to go into full strength as otherwise shown by the LACK OF SPARKS. Yes that is viable evidence that Cell was not fully powered up. No, he didn't lose his powers you're attacking a strawman and a rather poor one at that. What I'm claiming is that it wasn't "turned on." So I'll say it again before you ignore it: there was no sparks meaning NO PROOF that Cell was SPC. The burden is on you, not me but nice spin.
Additionally, we know that Goku had evidently become more powerful after his death, because he was about to engage Super-Perfect Cell as a FALSE SSJ, until Pikkon swooped in:
That's cool. So when Goku thinks he can beat Call it's valid but when Goku flat out admits Gotenks is stronger that doesn't count? Hilarity.
So despite already knowing how powerful Cell was, Goku didn't even feel the need to transform into a proper SSJ to fight him. This is indicative of Goku becoming substantially more powerful. How could his power have increased that much? Well, the only logical answer is that he received a decent zenkai secondary to his pre-death beat-down at the hands of Cell & the Cell Juniors.
Please, I'd rather not start just making things up.
Anyway, it's clear that Pikkon is solidly in the SSJ2 tier-- nothing less than that could have beaten SPC so easily. You not liking said feat doesn't change the fact that it still happened. 👆
Yep it's so undeniably clear like how he stomped a SSJ tier character when he's so clearly a SSJ2. I like reason and apparently you don't so if you want to claim that Pikkon was using like half of his power against Goku in the finals of a tournament, go ahead and believe that. =/
[edit]
And Pikkon did NOT take Cell by surprise. Had you actually watched the clip I posted, you would have noted that Cell both saw, and verbally reacted to, Pikkon coming at him head-on, prior to being attacked:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYcEvG3rvl0
(1:50)
Pikkon tooled him fair and square.
The "you didn't check out the source material" is such a overused and weaksauce attempt of fallaciously inferiorizing the other person's argument and it actually really annoyed me. Bravo. So I'll return the favor. Did you objectively watch it or were just turned on by the wank? Cell was rushing towards Goku and did not realize someone stepped in and was screaming out of shock because he was surprised. He didn't know what was going on which makes it a surprise attack.
Can't wait for you to spin this so I'll save you the trouble and concede before I break my computer.
A question about this topic, wasn't there an off-hand comment in the anime about how Goku actually got to train in the afterlife because he was allowed to keep his body? As far as we've seen in the anime the villains seem to perform rather worse in the afterlife than they should've in other conditions.
The Ginyu forces got utterly trashed by Yamcha/Tien when they went to Kaiohsama's planet, for example.
Originally posted by Bentley
A question about this topic, wasn't there an off-hand comment in the anime about how Goku actually got to train in the afterlife because he was allowed to keep his body? As far as we've seen in the anime the villains seem to perform rather worse in the afterlife than they should've in other conditions.The Ginyu forces got utterly trashed by Yamcha/Tien when they went to Kaiohsama's planet, for example.
I do think the villians get depowered at least somewhat. I meant they said Raditz put up a fight so i can only imagine what kind of fits Nappa, the Ginyus, Frieza, Cell and Dabura were throwing yet they were all contained seemingly easy enough.
And Yamcha and Tien have no business stomping the Ginyus after Vegeta looked like such a loser against them
Originally posted by juggermanI agree.
Vegeta beats him.Majin Vegeta kills him.
Originally posted by BentleyIt has never been so much as alluded to that an evil character is depowered upon their death. In the filler episodes you're talking about, Yamcha and Tien were able to beat the Ginyu Force, but after doing so Yamcha explicitly noted: "you have to admit that all the stuff King Kai taught us really came in handy."
A question about this topic, wasn't there an off-hand comment in the anime about how Goku actually got to train in the afterlife because he was allowed to keep his body? As far as we've seen in the anime the villains seem to perform rather worse in the afterlife than they should've in other conditions.The Ginyu forces got utterly trashed by Yamcha/Tien when they went to Kaiohsama's planet, for example.
This tells us that it was King Kai's training, not the Ginyu Force being less powerful, that allowed him/them to win.