Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Yes...another Skyfather.Cains enchantment comes from Cytorrak...an Elder God...a being thats beyond Skyfather.
This is like saying that since Hogun is a God and Superman is only a mortal, Hogun is beyond Superman.
Being an Elder God (Also, where has Cytorrak been called an Elder God?) implies great power yes, but that's not enough when dealing with Odin who has concrete feats and history.
Fyi, Thor has fared better against Atum then any other Elder God has.
Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Wow...I know you dont really read comics, but come on man...really!?
WTF...I do read comics, crazy. Also, which one is worse, the scan you posted or this...
http://s30.photobucket.com/user/Hulk3389/media/hulk457-stopsjuggernaut.jpg.html
Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
This is like saying that since Hogun is a God and Superman is only a mortal, Hogun is beyond Superman.Being an Elder God (Also, where has Cytorrak been called an Elder God?) implies great power yes, but that's not enough when dealing with Odin who has concrete feats and history.
Fyi, Thor has fared better against Atum then any other Elder God has.
Thor is a mainstream character; other characters job to mainstream characters as the story demands...
Thor also outperformed the 2000ft Destroyer against the 4th Celestial Host, so Thor performing well against Atum (relative to the other Elder Gods) doesnt carry that much weight...
Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Thor is a mainstream character; other characters job to mainstream characters as the story demands...Thor also outperformed the 2000ft Destroyer against the 4th Celestial Host, so Thor performing well against Atum (relative to the other Elder Gods) doesnt carry that much weight...
Thor directly disproving the notion that being an Elder God doesn't automatically means superiority means little? Okay, whatever.
As long as you've dropped the notion that Cytorrak is more powerful just because Odin is a Skyfather. Which is silly especially in a post Chaos War world.
Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Thor is a mainstream character; other characters job to mainstream characters as the story demands...Thor also outperformed the 2000ft Destroyer against the 4th Celestial Host, so Thor performing well against Atum (relative to the other Elder Gods) doesnt carry that much weight...
I am glad you didnt dispute this factual information...
👆
Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
I am glad you didnt dispute this factual information...👆
What factual information? Your response to my point was that it doesn't count because Thor's a main character.
That's not even worth discussing as a serious point of contention. Especially since compared to Cytorrak, Odin would count as a main character as well which means that the rule that Elder Gods > Skyfather wouldn't apply to him either. 😬
Now, do you have any evidence that supports Cytorrak being greater then Odin? Do you have any feats for Cytorrak that match what Odin has accomplished? Or does it not count because Odin's a main character?
Originally posted by Rage.Of.OlympusConsidering every time someone calls on the crimson bands they're directly calling on cytorrak's power I'd say he definitely has the feats. Have to dig for it but it was Dr. Strange that explained it such as when he calls on the power of the Vishanti he calls on Cytorrak to cast the spell. That said the spell has held up to Zom at his best when he was running up against eternity and Dormammu. So... yeah. Also Fear Itself run made it pretty clear that the Juggernaut enchant is directly linked to the desire of the user to fulfill their desires. Also the only time I'd say the Crimson Kings power was directly called into contest was when Illyana broke the enchant on her Colossus but the caveat to that was that it was in her hell dimension where she had absolute authority.
What does full backing mean? That Cytorrak channels all of his power into Juggernaut? What is the precedent for that? Why not just make a Cytorrak vs. Mjolnir thread instead?Simply put, Classic Juggernaut's unstoppable enchantment while powerful is not as powerful as Mjolnir's worthiness enchantment.
Also, I have no idea why you think Odin is less powerful then Cytorrak? That's just weird.
Where does it say that Juggernaut gets the body and raw power of Cytorrak? I have never come across the ideas you've expressed in this post before. I'm assuming there are some comics I've missed?
Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Hulk is a mainstream character...Juggs jobbed to Hulk unless you want to believe that Hulk can just match Thors God Blast on demand...
You play DCUO? The stats that you boast are impossible to have btw. You're Dom is way too high for a hard light user. Also you can't just dismiss a feat simply because you don't like it. The Hulk is just that damned powerful. Cain wasn't able to budge Mjolnir in the past when he tried with all of his might, and he won't be able to do it here. It's simple Mjolnir wins this.
Originally posted by Uriel005
Again I reiterate a Spell POWERED by Cyt was strong enough to restrain Zom... The Crimson bands are to him what Vishanti invoked spells are to the Vishanti...
Didn't the Sentry pretty much walk right through those same crimson bands and pwn Doom while he held the other Avengers captive within those bands as well? Just because Cain is powered by this same power, does not mean that he has the ability to operate at those levels. He never has therefore he loses this. He was never able to even budge the hammer with all of his might, and he will not be able to do it here either. This is based on his past failed attempt. Mjolnir wins. I mean it's the only logical conclusion friend.
Originally posted by StoicHis stats aren't impossible, look at his vit. He's basically crowd control, while his vit is like tier 4.5.
You play DCUO? The stats that you boast are impossible to have btw. You're Dom is way too high for a hard light user.
But anyway, Cyttorak could be abstract level. That has no bearing on the enchantment we've seen overpowered on panel. The enchantment isn't all of his power or even close. Just like the Mjolnir enchantment isn't all of Odin's power or even close.
And Mjolnir's enchantment is def stronger than Cain's.
Cyttorak is one of the mystic principalities, not an elder god, and being an elder god doesn't really mean anything considering several of them aren't really powerful, full of low showings, and don't really have the feats.
Cyttorak isn't much better, he (or rather his aspect) got one shotted into a thousand pieces by juggernaut (when he was helped into using ruby's power) in x men unlimited #12.
Originally posted by Stoic
You play DCUO? The stats that you boast are impossible to have btw. You're Dom is way too high for a hard light user
Those stats are very real; I have a hybrid build that emphasis's Precision and Dominance with only a small amount of Vit...
Every single piece of gear I have is modded with Precision plus either Dom or Vit; only 4 items are Precision/Vit with the other 6 items modded by Precision/Dom...
My rings (both of which are item level 86) are DPS rings (with the Precision affinity) modded with Precision/Dom expert Mods...
So I say again, those stats are very real...
