Tulak Hord--How powerful is he, really?

It was confirmed to have been Vitiate himself. Neph will be more than willing to provide you with the youtube link and the scan from the encyclopedia that prove it.

No it wasn't. I've played the game and Neph wouldn't do such a thing. It was one of his Voice bodies and when it died, his spirit went back into his real body to take a nappy nap.

I don't know how to do scans. I think my printer can do it so if I really need to I'm sure I can google it.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
You are exhibiting the second case of TOR-induced schizophrenia; Patient Zero (Beefy) seems to be recovering well enough so I have hope for you as well.

But, to quote some insightful guy from another thread:

So this is the best defense that Vitiate, who is allegedly the baddest motherfvcker of all and who happens to be standing in the midst of an extraordinarily powerful dark side nexus which happens to stand in the heart of a city on a planet that "bristles" with dark side energy, can conjure?

Under the Moose's paradigm, this is pretty damning.

My argument has only been that he and the Hero were equal in strength when they fought, not that Vitiate was at his full power. I am merely explaining why it isn't inconsistent for Vitiate to seem less impressive in the cutscene considering how weak and exhausted he was. Its like complaining about how lame Sidious was when his body was dying and Han shot him in the back.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I don't know how to do scans. I think my printer can do it so if I really need to I'm sure I can google it.

Or the youtube link where the creators confirm it would suffice.

Originally posted by Nephthys
My argument has only been that he and the Hero were equal in strength when they fought, not that Vitiate was at his full power. I am merely explaining why it isn't inconsistent for Vitiate to seem less impressive in the cutscene considering how weak and exhausted he was. Its like complaining about how lame Sidious was when his body was dying and Han shot him in the back.

Yes, it would be complaining how lame Sidious was when his body was dying and he suffered an ignominious death. Though it's actually not quite as lame as what happened with Vitiate since he was shot (1) in the back, (2) Han unwittingly served Sidious's need to shed his mortal coil, (3) Sidious wasn't on a dark side nexus, and (4) managed to lay waste to his attackers.

And, as you've constantly squawked since the beginning, Vitiate apparently had the energy to try and collapse the entire temple around them. So it really is inconsistent.

In fact, the entire fight scene is. Vitiate does nothing spectacular at all the moment the Hero shows up, from start to finish. If we use our heads, we can reconcile this and say, "low showing" from an otherwise extremely powerful character.

But playing it literally, with no thought to context, as the Moose suggests? It's pretty laughably bad.

It isn't youtube but I've profiled it (right at the bottom) for if you really want it.

And, no it isn't a low showing since the majority of the fight occurs in gameplay. We have no idea how epic the actual battle was. Though since it was termed as 'apocalyptic' I'd say it was rather impressive.

And we can only turn to the cutscenes for validation and the cutscenes show an extremely lame battle. Compared to the wankery surrounding him, he's demonstrating movie-level strength and skill at best.

There are plenty of more impressive fights from TOR, TCW, and a host of other canon.

Eh, not really (for TOR at least). TOR doesn't go out of its way to make big, visually impressive fights, preferring to just do it in gameplay. The only really impressive looking fight is Thanaton vs Nox.

But perhaps you were referring to the trailers, which are very impressive visually, but not above anything seen in the movies imo.

So how does Vitiate go from owning the entire strike team to losing to the Hero?

They got more powerful. Its implied the Hero is growing rapidly since Scourge says that if he'd fought the Hero when they first met on Quesh he could have destroyed them, whereas a mere planet later the Hero defeats him comfortably.

After that we see that Vitiate has actually been training the Hero for months on his fortress while they were under his control. So their power likely developed even further there and would continue to grow in Act III.

It was a rhetorical question DE, I've played the game.

As you said, Beefy, the game and its writers are retarded. 😬

That was the answer I was going for.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
As you said, Beefy, the game and its writers are retarded. 😬

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Honestly, I sympathize with Janus, Nai, and the others on this issue now more than ever. The power hierarchy in ROTS went fvcking nuts: Dooku ragdolls Obi-Wan, but gets pwned by Anakin, who in turn duels with Obi-Wan for 3.5 hours without any real progress; Sidious b1tchslaps three Jedi Masters, loses to Mace for no reason, then beats Yoda. The explanations Stover and others had to come up with in order to rectify this situation are horrible, but I give them so much credit for trying.

The Flanneled Chins clearly didn't give a shit.

^ As if G-canon is any more sane. TCW cartoon characters act more like TOR/KotOR Era Jedi than their movie or novel counterparts, and OT Force users might as well be 4th level DnD wizards.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
^ As if G-canon is any more sane.

'Sane' is not a word I'd use to describe G-canon.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
'Sane' is not a word I'd use to describe G-canon.

I think part of the reason why I detest SW more and more as time goes on is because GL never got a handle on it in the first place. He had every opportunity to create thorough narrative and setting and set the stage for proper EU. He doesn't have to be Tolkien-level worldbuilding awesome, but he could at least say, set down some hard rules on Force usage.

This all started with DE's stupidity and the original Exar Kun appearance, which opened the floodgates for the comics where they took the idea "Size matters not" as literally meaning "**** physics, *****; I'm a Force user".

I started a thread over at TFN polling people about their favorite depiction of the Force. I can't remember how I determined the quasi-arbitrary distinctions.

You have the school of Karpyshyn and Blackman, which is all about LOL BAM IN YOUR FACE FORCE DAMN LOL!

Then you have stuff from Avellone and Stover which have moments of the prior but mostly deal with the Force as an "ethereal" thing.

Then you have the PT/TCW which depict the Force as a useful and powerful, but not by any means infallible tool.

Then you have Zahn and the OT, which paint the Force as minimalist as possible.

I much preferred the OT, although some early PT era novels depict it very tastefully, such as The Approaching Storm, Cloak of Deception, Medstar Duology, etc.

But the flaw in your argument is that the Emperor is alive and well after the end of the Sith Warrior storyline, and sends you a mail saying he was 'wounded' by an unnamed Jedi Knight. So, it's quite possible that was a voice.

Many believe that to be a lie. As of yet its unverified.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
I much preferred the OT, although some early PT era novels depict it very tastefully, such as The Approaching Storm, Cloak of Deception, Medstar Duology, etc.

I tend to prefer the Force as depicted in TCW, which is more liberal than the Force in the OT, but people aren't leveling temples, playing tug-o'-war with black holes, or blowing up starfleets.