Originally posted by psmith81992
Ha, a Sidious fanboy calling me biased. Now THAT's amusing. Seeing as how there were less than 100 jedi remaining after Revan got done with his war, that's proof enough.
[Beefy]Omg you're an embarrassment to mankind. The purge would only be as effective if you could prove that Revan began with as many Jedi and killed as many Jedi as Sidious did. Or maybe you should just leave the arguments for Gideonno one because all Revan fanbois are stupid and lame and gay.
Also, where's my sammich?[/Beefy]
Originally posted by The_Tempest
Those are not my tears you're drinking. 😐I actually addressed all of Beefy's points and yours; neither of you has elected to respond.
Thus, I WIN THIS THREAD (and all others)
LOLNOPE.
You implied something vague about the Mando Wars even though we've dmeonstrated that the Jedil Civil War meets or surpasses the devastation to the Order from Order 66.
This still assumes that the death of many Jedi is instrumental in the shift or at least important.
Originally posted by Stealth Moose
LOLYES x infinity
Originally posted by Stealth Moose
You implied something vague about the Mando Wars even though we've dmeonstrated that the Jedil Civil War meets or surpasses the devastation to the Order from Order 66.
Originally posted by Stealth Moose
LOLNOPE.
The devastation of the Jedi by the time of Kreia's death was the product of three different wars: the Mandalorian wars, the Jedi Civil War, and whatever we're calling Exile vs. The Triumvirate.
Revan's efforts constitute the lion's share of Jedi killing and countless Jedi flocked to his cause during the conflict. Meaning he may have very well killed far less Jedi than Palpatine and the Banites since a lot of the Jedi left to join his team.
In contrast, Order 66 and the Clone Wars that preceded them were entirely the product of Palpatine's singular efforts, meaning his purge was more impressive. And he didn't ask droves of them to join his team.
Originally posted by Stealth Moose
This still assumes that the death of many Jedi is instrumental in the shift or at least important.
I'm not assuming that at all. You merely asked me how Banite efforts surpassed those of other Sith with respect to Jedi killing.
From Plagueis, we know what was instrumental in the shift: Plagueis & Palpatine pushing the Force out of balance via ritual.
Also (and I preface this with the admission that Wookieepedia may not be accurate here), Kreia is alleged to have claimed the following:
"The Jedi Civil War destroyed the Jedi. By the war's end, barely a hundred Jedi remained. Many fell in battle… and many more were seduced by Revan's teachings."
Originally posted by The_Tempest
LOLYES x infinityThe devastation of the Jedi by the time of Kreia's death was the product of three different wars: the Mandalorian wars, the Jedi Civil War, and whatever we're calling Exile vs. The Triumvirate.
Revan's efforts constitute the lion's share of Jedi killing and countless Jedi flocked to his cause during the conflict. Meaning he may have very well killed far less Jedi than Palpatine and the Banites since a lot of the Jedi left to join his team.
In contrast, Order 66 and the Clone Wars that preceded them were entirely the product of Palpatine's singular efforts, meaning his purge was more impressive. And he didn't ask droves of them to join his team.
I'm not assuming that at all. You merely asked me how Banite efforts surpassed those of other Sith with respect to Jedi killing.
From Plagueis, we know what was instrumental in the shift: Plagueis & Palpatine pushing the Force out of balance via ritual.
Read again, I asked how the Bainites were worse enough in comparison to warrant the shifting of the balance. The underlying premise is that balance is just fine until they came along, even though the quotes provided in the first two posts even point out that they alone aren't the only ones capable of disharmony.
The imbalance of the force was due to Plagueis and Palpatine's ritual, shoving the force in favor of the dark side, which had nothing to do with jedi deaths, but by them asserting their authority over the force, which allowed Plagueis to outright defy the force in that he was able to manipulate midichlorians. Then Sidious further imbalanced it by clouding the jedis' far sight ability (AOTC graphic novel has Yoda trying to perceive the future, but it was blocked by an apparition of a hooded figure [Sidious]), giving him more than just a one up on the jedi. During the PT era, the dark side reigned, and according to the DP novel, the dark side and Sidious were in complete harmony with one another, as the dark side made Palpatine it's property (most likely because of his intellect among his other traits) while Palpatine made the dark side his.
As of the PT and OT, the imbalance had more to do with the force being in Palpatine's favor (the dark side), with Palpatine--the dark side's instrument--being in complete control of almost everything, and in a way, even making the jedi servants of the dark side (which eventually lead to their own near extinction, and was a major cause of Palpatine's rise to power), as opposed to the number of jedi he wiped out. Almost everything went Sidious' way, which is why he had to be destroyed in order for balance to be brought back to the force.
That's my interpretation anyway.
^ Basically this.
Moose, your premise is outdated. Darth Plagueis reveals that imbalance was introduced to the Force due to the ritual undertaken by Plagueis and Sidious. The darkening of the Force 200 BBY was the result of cosmological experiments conducted by Tenebrous and his unnamed Master, which are also mentioned therein.
Like you, I much prefer the idea that the Force's imbalance was the product of the machinations of the Banite Sith, culminating in Palpatine's unprecedented rise to galactic power.
Luceno's take is unimaginative and petty, even though it confers what is arguably the most impressive display of Force manipulation in the entire mythology to Palpatine and Plagueis.