The difference is that the Ultra Super Saiyan-form was based on a trade-off of speed for power, whereas the Super Saiyan 2-form increased both speed and power and so did Super Saiyan 3.
The problem with the Super Saiyan 3-form was that Goku hadn't practiced it enough to where he could cope with its ki consumption.
Originally posted by Astner
The difference is that the Ultra Super Saiyan-form was based on a trade-off of speed for power, whereas the Super Saiyan 2-form increased both speed and power and so did Super Saiyan 3.The problem with the Super Saiyan 3-form was that Goku hadn't practiced it enough to where he could cope with its ki consumption.
Exactly.
By end of Z, I'd bet money on him refining SSJ3 enough to equal Gohan, if not surpass him.
It's kind of what he does.
Originally posted by Astner
I think that would fall under plot induced stupidity. Honestly, the whole movie is difficult to make sense of in the context of the original series.
No the point is SS3 is worthless and when it all comes down to it S1 is the best form and in that Goku and Vegeta can do anything..even Goku after losing his God Mode fights Bill head to head in S1..S1 beat Majin Boo, S1 beat Freeza, S1 is the ultimate form.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10Mo9NU68lE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bH_CcJ-uBWI
Both transformations take way to long and way to much power to get what they are trying to achieve..
Originally posted by BloodRain
No. In terms of upgrades SS3 is to 2 as 2 is to 1. All-round increase, unlike USS.
How come Goku cant beat anyone in SS3 then even in the other worlds when he has no power drain? He always has to fuze or go back to S1 to win..S1 is the prefect form..Speed, Strength Spirit, Ki
Originally posted by SupraRemember, that was the first time he went SSJ3 while he was alive. The first transformation would've obviously taken more out of him than normal, because he had only ever used the form while he was dead, thus didn't have to worry about ki usage as much.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bH_CcJ-uBWIBoth transformations take way to long and way to much power to get what they are trying to achieve..
Later in the very same arc, however, Goku was able to transform into a SSJ3 with ease:
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17115590/411708.gif.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17115591/411709.gif.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17115592/420711.gif.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17115593/420712.gif.html
He transformed easily during BoG as well:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0YzjYaaigA
(0:22)
The ki-consumption/stamina issue inherent in a SSJ3 is likely something that Goku could learn to cope better with-- not unlike he did with his standard SSJ form.
Originally posted by Galan007
Remember, that was the first time he went SSJ3 while he was alive. The first transformation would've obviously taken more out of him than normal, because he had only ever used the form while he was dead, thus didn't have to worry about ki usage as much.Later in the very same arc, however, Goku was able to transform into a SSJ3 with ease:
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17115590/411708.gif.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17115591/411709.gif.htmlhttp://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17115592/420711.gif.html
http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/17115593/420712.gif.htmlHe transformed easily during BoG as well:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O0YzjYaaigA
(0:22)The ki-consumption/stamina issue inherent in a SSJ3 is likely something that Goku could learn to cope better with-- not unlike he did with his standard SSJ form.
Yes but he failed to take down Bills in S3 where Vegeta surpassed Goku and fought Bills head to head.where S3 Goku was taken down in 1 touch..he always has to go back to S1 to finish the job, he never can win in S3..he has all the time in the world and other worlds to perfect that form yet it cannot be perfected because it is inherently wrong..
Originally posted by Supra
How come Goku cant beat anyone in SS3 then even in the other worlds when he has no power drain? He always has to fuze or go back to S1 to win..S1 is the prefect form..Speed, Strength Spirit, Ki
And for Bills that is because he was so much more powerful. Vegeta? Complete BS and made of plot-fail;
Fact- Using the same forms Goku and Vegeta are /roughly/ even.
Fact- Vegeta lacks SS3.
Fact- SS3 is 4x SS2, meaning even if Vegeta was somewhat stronger normally this form change would stop that.
With the facts that moment should not have happened. So IMO it had something to do with some unknown rage amp. Stupid, maybe, but that scene was stupid.
Originally posted by SupraYes he did; he surpassed Mystic Gohan, Gotenks, and Fat Buu as well. As someone else said, though: that showing reeks of PIS, as it doesn't follow pre-established continuity in the slightest. After all, a lower transformation should never be able to surpass a higher transformation in the DBZ-U-- that defeats the entire purpose behind various SSJ transformations all together(this is all secondary to the fact that SSJ3 is canonically 4x> SSJ2.)
Yes but he failed to take down Bills in S3 where Vegeta surpassed Goku and fought Bills head to head.where S3 Goku was taken down in 1 touch..
I just chalk it up to sheer fan-service, tbh-- Akira finally gave Vegeta his much-needed time to shine, and didn't give a phuck about shitting on his previous works.
Originally posted by BloodRain
Because the single person in Z he's faced as SS3 was Buu. On the first occasion he admitted to not finishing him off, and on the second it was because he didn't have enough power, barely enough to hold the form let alone use its full power. For both he lacked proper control over that form, not going through a similar SS training like he and Gohan did in the Cell saga.And for Bills that is because he was so much more powerful. Vegeta? Complete BS and made of plot-fail;
Fact- Using the same forms Goku and Vegeta are /roughly/ even.
Fact- Vegeta lacks SS3.
Fact- SS3 is 4x SS2, meaning even if Vegeta was somewhat stronger normally this form change would stop that.
With the facts that moment should not have happened. So IMO it had something to do with some unknown rage amp. Stupid, maybe, but that scene was stupid.
