Sauron vs Gothmog

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Moosie.. you honestly have no clue about what we are talking about. You're doing your little sidelining routine because you were already made to look like a fool in this thread and others. Remember that whole... Morgoth came first before Melkor... anybody saying that.. should never act like they have a clue what they are talking about when it comes to Lord of the Rings or Sim material.

Mixing up Melkor and Morgoth, despite nailing everything else right, is a gaff, not a sign of ignorance.

You thinking Sauron is weaker than Gothmog, coupled with not knowing the details of Sauron's battles with Huan, the details surrounding Feanor's battle, and Gothmog's entire resume tbh, makes you truly full of shit.

You haven't quoted one source. Repeatedly saying something only makes it true if you work for the government. Get a grip.

Also since a certain someone is using BoLT as a "canon" source:

"the royal house laid on and the king came down in splendour among them and hewed with them, that they swept again much of the square, and of the Balrogs slew even two score, which is a very great prowess indeed: but greater still did they do, for they hemmed in one of the Fire-drakes for all his flaming, and forced him into the very waters of the fountain that he perished therein."

So killing a single dragon is considered more impressive than killing 40 Balrogs... Guess that means dragons are far greater than Balrogs.

So I'm still waiting for the feats of Elendil and Gol-Galad in the first age.. you guys laughed at me for saying first age elves were more impressive than Second or Third age elves.. which of course in canonically true.. You guys acted like the two in question have feats in the first age LULZ... POST THEM please... Or could it be that Gil-Galad wasn't even around for most of the first age and when he was.. he was a child for most of it... Most of his entire reign was in the second age... That isn't getting into Elendil of the FIRST AGE LULZ HAHAHA.

So I'm still waiting on their feats or what they accomplished during this time... I'll be waiting on pins and needles

Ohhh and one more things Ares... who was leading the batttle in BOLT?

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
Mixing up Melkor and Morgoth, despite nailing everything else right, is a gaff, not a sign of ignorance.

You thinking Sauron is weaker than Gothmog, coupled with not knowing the details of Sauron's battles with Huan, the details surrounding Feanor's battle, and Gothmog's entire resume tbh, makes you truly full of shit.

You haven't quoted one source. Repeatedly saying something only makes it true if you work for the government. Get a grip.

Totally false... I am the first one to say these things that are canon facts...

1. I mentioned specific battles in the thread this thread spawned from.. good check out the thread.. I mentioned SPECIFIC battles Gothmog lead and Sauron was no place to be found.

2. I'm the one who mentioned Huan defeating Sauron.. this again was never brought up until I said it..

3. I mentioned Eru killing Sauron with the flood.. again this was first mentioned by me

4. I mentioned the Balrogs fighting her off to save Melkor, when again Sauron was nowhere to be found when the going got tough.. This was never brought up until I said this fact

5. I mentioned Gothmog killing Feanor.. Ecth.. and Fingon.. again this was never mentioned until I stated these facts

6. I mentioned Sauron being called the Lieutenant of Angband.. while Gothmog was the Captain.. again nobody mentioned that canon fact until I did.

Those are just a handful of the canon facts that I mentioned that were never presented until I joined the thread. That is just some of what I've said.. but to act like I've said no facts and brought nothing new is totally laughable and idiotic. You can say oohhh well there was context to this and context to him kllling this person.. but the fact remains me stating Gothmog killed them is a canon fact and something that was presented before. That is just a handful of things I brought to the table.. what have you brought? All you've done is sideline for Ares and Nib and act like you know what you're talking about. When really....

If somebody can't get the most fundamental of facts right.. Melkor coming before Morgoth.. it doesn't get much worse than that. You can say I left out whatever context I want. But Melkor coming being Morgoth should be some of the most common knowledge there is.. and you had no clue. Come back when you do have a clue and can bring more to the table than sidelining.

So now we know that a dragon>40 Balrogs.

👆

Still waiting on those first age feats for Elendil and Gil-Galad.. are they coming sometime this century? Ohh wait... I was spot on LULZ..

40 you say... why do you say such things Ares lol.. You need to do a revisionist recton bud. Again... which you failed to answer.. WHO WAS LEADING the battle including the Dragon(s)?

Originally posted by ares834
So now we know that a dragon>40 Balrogs.

👆

Keep cheerleading moosie poo... Morgoth before Melkor eh?

Still waiting on those 1st age feats again... LULZ

Well there was that time Sauron knocked out Luthien with a glance, the same Luthien that could knock out Morgoth with her magic. Which Sauron tanked, I should mention.

It's almost like the orders of power and ability aren't so black and white as A>B>C. It's almost like there's... nuance, or some worthless, hard-to-categorize shit like that.

Originally posted by Lord Lucien
It's almost like the orders of power and ability aren't so black and white as A>B>C. It's almost like there's... nuance, or some worthless, hard-to-categorize shit like that.

Nonsense! Everything is black and white!

Not as black and white as my fist in your eye.

Originally posted by Stealth Moose
Nonsense! Everything is black and white!

Originally posted by NemeBro
Not as black and white as my fist in your eye.

You can't handle this bro.

So how about those first age feats for Gil-Galad? Should I choke on water some more with all those first age feats for Elendil LMAO.. Ohhh wait.. first age? lulz

Sauron knocked out someone who knocked out Morgoth.

Where are Gothmog's feats again?

Also, Gil-Galad was already High King of the Noldor and had been for some time by the time the War of Wrath happened.

No one said that Elendil was from the first age. At least I didn't. **** what anyone else said.

You however did say that both are third age characters, which is factually untrue, also you're a stupid pig ****er. 👆

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
So how about those first age feats for Gil-Galad? Should I choke on water some more with all those first age feats for Elendil LMAO.. Ohhh wait.. first age? lulz

Who the **** said Elendil was a first age character? You, however, did claim he and Gil-Galad were third age characters.

That not what I said.... First age Elves feats shit all over people from the 2nd and 3rd age.. I never said that's where Gil-Galad is from... ALso, you seem to not know about the first age if you think Gil-Galad had any feats in the first age... The MAJORITY of his reign was in the 2nd age... He BARELY came to the throne at the END of the first age. For the majority of the first age he wasn't even around until the end where he was a child and then took the throne as a young man. He has NO first age feats. Which again is why I said... Elves of the first age feats shit all over elves of subsequent ages.. Which again.. knowing Gil-Galad has NO first age feats as he only rose to power at the end of the first age.

You mention Sauron knocking out someone.. yet you fail to mention all the times Sauron was killed or defeated. Shit, he died more times than most people on here have gotten into a real world fight. His record is pretty bad when it comes to defeating people.

Gothmog on the other hand... was the captain of Angband... Sauron was only the Lieutenant. Numerous sites list them as having an equal rank with Morgoth.. yet me know Military wise they weren't equal. Gothmog was in charge of the forces and the General. He was leading troops into battle.. Sauron was held up in the fortress practicing magic.

When Melkor was crying out for help as he was being devoured... Where was Sauron to save him? No where to be found... The Balrogs saved the day. If somebody even more powerful than Sauron couldn't stop himself from being devoured by an amped Ug.. what would Sauron be able to do? Next to nothing... yet the balrogs could.

Further, as stated... gothmog died fighting Ecth.. who as you know killed numerous balrogs before being killed by Gothmog.. Anybody that can kill numerous balrogs is pretty damn powerful.. Yet Gothmog killed him... It was a last ditch effort that killed Gothmog.. he had already landed the killing blow.

Killing Feanor, is again, above anyhing Sauron has EVER done in his entire history. Like LIterally. We can go on and on about him having help yada yada.. the fact is.. there was a battle going on all around them... Feanor decided to rush Gothmog and his help.. he paid the pirce as AGAIN Gothmog landed the killing blow.. nobody else. Further, we're talking about the most powerful elf of all time here... not some run of the mill no feats Gil-Galad.

Wht it comes down to is this and there is no getting around this...

Gothmog has beaten better people and not lost nearly as many times. These are all facts. We can try and discredit gothmogs wins.. but he still won and landed the killing blows. Killing blows, AGAIN, against people far superior to ANYBODY Sauron has beaten or been beaten by.

Sauron was the better politician.. and better at black magic I'm sure. Shit I would even call him Morgoth's apprecntice and who he wanted to leave in charge of his affairs to care on his ways. No issue there. This however, is a BATTLE VS. FIGHT... Gothmog was the warrior... Sauron wasn't and was never called such.

Originally posted by ares834
Who the **** said Elendil was a first age character? You, however, did claim he and Gil-Galad were third age characters.

Wrong again bud.. what I said was... Ist age elves FEATS shit all over second and third age characters.. That is absolutly how it is. If you interrupted what I said wrong.. or I wasn't clear enough.. that is what I was saying and believe said. Secondly, Elendil wasn't a first age character so even if I did mean what you thought I did.. .It would still apply and I would be spot on. Second, Gil-Galad WASN'T even around for the MAJORITY OF THE FIRST AGE. He came at the end of the first age and was a child even then. He took the thrown or should I say shared the thrown.. at the END of the first age. he reign was mostly all in the second age.. which again is NOT the first age. So again, when I say first age feats shit all over subsequent ones.. I'm dead on.. unless you can name me ANY first age feats of Gil-Galad.. I'M STILL WAITING ON THOSE.