Emperor Malgus vs. The Maul Brothers

Originally posted by carthage
I'm not misrepresenting anything, all I did was challenge your point with regards to Malgus's "mastery of the force".

Originally posted by carthage
I even agreed with you that they're even in terms of endurance.

Originally posted by carthage
Again if you look back at my posts I only took issue with your statements regarding Malgus's force mastery, and I gave feats that showcased my viewpoint as to their close proximity in those feats.

Nothing Malgus has done with his force abilities put him as superior to Maul based on what you posted, as Maul has performed feats quite similar to his.

Originally posted by carthage
Maul's stronger, faster, and more skilled and that would swing the duel in his favor in terms of a saber duel.

Satele Shan and Aryn Leener were faster then Malgus and they still failed. Maul will fail too.

Originally posted by carthage
Malgus's force abilities aren't so powerful as to swing the duel in his favor. Lightning can be absorbed by a saber, he has no feats of force maelstrom in active combat, and Maul's physical showings with force enhanced abilities outstrip Malgus's based on the showings I've posted and can post again to reiterate my point

Learn how potent Malgus's lightning is.

Malgus, not to be outdone, picked a Jedi Knight at random, a human female ten meters away, held forth his left hand, and discharged veins of blue lightning from his fingertips. The jagged lines of energy cut a swath through the battle, harvesting two Padawans as they went, until they caught up to the Jedi Knight and lifted her off her feet. She screamed as the lightning ripped into her, her flesh made temporarily translucent from the dark power coursing through her. Malgus savored her pain as she died. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Deceived)

This event took place inside Jedi Temple. Jedi and Sith were fightning. Notice that these Malgus's lightning swept through the lightsabers of these Jedi and were destroyed.

Not convinced?

As Aryn prepared to leap at Malgus, he held forth a hand, almost casually, and lightning sizzled through the space between them. Aryn interposed her lightsabers, but the power in the lightning exceeded anything she had felt from Malgus before. It blasted through her defenses and both lightsabers flew from her hands. The lightning seized her, lifted her up, and threw her from the top of the shuttle. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Deceived)

This is Aryn (freaking) Leener, not some chump.

Not convinced yet?

Malgus held forth his hand and the rage within him manifested in blue veins of lightning that discharged from his fingertips and slammed into Adraas. The power stopped Adraas’s charge cold, blew his lightsaber from his hand, caught him up in a cage of burning lightning. He screamed, squirming in frustration and pain. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Deceived)

Lord Adraas was not an ordinary Sith Lord, regarded as one of the strongest Sith Lords of his era and his era had major quality. At one point, noted as wielding blackhole of energy with the dark side.

Not convinced yet again?

At 10 meters, Malgus extended his free hand and loosed veins of blue Force lightning. They struck the charging Jedi: swept through his defenses, swirled around him, and began to burn flesh.

Shouting with pain, the Jedi leaned forward into the lightning - teeth bare, blue blades held before him - and staggered toward Malgus. Despite his burns, he came onward. One step, another, another, but he was failing, wilting in the heat of the lightning. Malgus channeled more power and the Jedi fell to his knees, screaming. The lightning spiraled around the Zabrak, blasting dark holes in his body. The lightsabers fell from his hands and he writhed in agony, screaming his pain into the sky.

Malgus ended his attack. The Jedi, ruined, fell to the ground and rolled over onto his back. His breathing sounded worse than Malgus's.

Malgus strode to his side and stood over him.

He found that he admired the Jedi's mettle.

He deactivated his lightsaber. (The Third Lesson)

This wasn't an ordinary Jedi either. He was powerful enough to collapse two buildings simultaneously, basically daddy of even the renowned Darth Vader.

--

Here is what will happen: Darth Malgus would rip Maul apart with his lightning alone. He will do the same to his brother.

--

No feats with Force Maelstrom?

Malgus did use this talent during his battles:-

This is not fake but genuine depiction of Malgus using Force Maelstrom talent in a battle. Notice that he utterly overwhelmed multiple opponents with this magnitude of power. I can post larger picture for you, if you want to see it.

Darth (freaking) Sidious noted that Darth Malgus was likely greatest warrior to have ever existed and the former have history with Darth Plagueis, Darth Maul, Count Dooku, Savage Opress, Assaj Ventress and Darth Vader. Malgus is likely superior warrior then any of these individuals.

Originally posted by carthage
Also even as good of a warrior as Malgus is people keep forgetting about Maul's brother. Malgus's fights have never showed him as readily one shotting a powerful opponent, why people magically assume he'd dispose of either without labor intensive fighting goes against every duel Malgus has ever had.

Darth Malgus is too powerful for this duo. Deal with it.

You need to stop lying about quotes. You find a quote, and then fake a second part to make it look more viable.

Sidious never called Malgus the greatest Warrior, he merely stated that he had an unparalleled control of his rage, something Vader could learn from.

Originally posted by Selenial
You need to stop lying about quotes. You find a quote, and then fake a second part to make it look more viable.

Sidious never called Malgus the greatest Warrior, he merely stated that he had an unparalleled control of his rage, something Vader could learn from.

Malgus submitted utterly to the dark side, and doing so made him an exemplary warrior. His battlefield feats have never been duplicated. (Book of Sith - Secrets from the Dark Side)

Darth Malgus is an unparalleled warrior according to Darth Sidious, I said nothing wrong.

Originally posted by carthage
I'm not misrepresenting anything, all I did was challenge your point with regards to Malgus's "mastery of the force". I even agreed with you that they're even in terms of endurance. Why do you always post like you have a chip on your shoulder dude? Again if you look back at my posts I only took issue with your statements regarding Malgus's force mastery, and I gave feats that showcased my viewpoint as to their close proximity in those feats. Nothing Malgus has done with his force abilities put him as superior to Maul based on what you posted, as Maul has performed feats quite similar to his. Maul's stronger, faster, and more skilled and that would swing the duel in his favor in terms of a saber duel. Malgus's force abilities aren't so powerful as to swing the duel in his favor. Lightning can be absorbed by a saber, he has no feats of force maelstrom in active combat, and Maul's physical showings with force enhanced abilities outstrip Malgus's based on the showings I've posted and can post again to reiterate my point

Also even as good of a warrior as Malgus is people keep forgetting about Maul's brother. Malgus's fights have never showed him as readily one shotting a powerful opponent, why people magically assume he'd dispose of either without labor intensive fighting goes against every duel Malgus has ever had.

As far as force abilities go, a hat-tip to legend for posting force feats for Malgus. Malgus has oneshotted several people with the force, including three padawans simultaneously and Aryn Leneer. With telekinesis, he penetrated the force defenses of Satele Shan and slammed her into a tree, he prevented several tons of rubble from falling on him while severely wounded then blasted it away, he crushed a Jedi's throat with the force in the sacking of Coruscant, he penetrated Ven Zallow's force defenses, and he telekinetically throttled Lord Adraas. Malgus also brought the strike team sent after him to their knees with force lightning. A team that included either the Hero of Tython and Barsen'thor, or the Emperor's Wrath and Darth Nox.

There is more than a marginal discrepancy between their respective force abilities, and though I conceded Maul to be the more skilled of the two, their martial prowess isn't too far off, with Malgus besting Kao Cen Darach and Ven Zallow, warranting the Republic or Sith's greatest Heroes to kill him, and his tremendous accolade from Sidious. Even Vader looked up to Malgus in some respects. Malgus's force abilities could in fact turn the tide in his favor.

I didn't mention Savage because the point of this debate was me challenging your opinion that Maul is better than Malgus in every way, which is simply not true.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Here;

Malgus submitted utterly to the dark side, and doing so made him an exemplary warrior. His battlefield feats have never been duplicated. (Book of Sith - Secrets from the Dark Side)

Darth Malgus is an unparalleled warrior according to Darth Sidious, I said nothing wrong.

Battlefield.

Means warzone, not a normal fight.

And this is because no Sith or Jedi ever lead battles in the way that Malgus did, you never see Dark council members on the field etc, Vader didn't lead Stormtroopers, he just went solo Rage on occasion

Though this also isn't even counting Vader, as Sidious wrote the book of Sith before ANH.

Originally posted by Selenial
Battlefield.

Means warzone, not a normal fight.

And this is because no Sith or Jedi ever lead battles in the way that Malgus did, you never see Dark council members on the field etc, Vader didn't lead Stormtroopers, he just went solo Rage on occasion

Though this also isn't even counting Vader, as Sidious wrote the book of Sith before ANH.

Republic defenders lucky enough to flee these battles told of Malgus striding confidently at the front of his armies and single-handedly shattering fortifications. (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)

Dark Council members also participated in battles such as Darth Marr and Darth Decimus. Both have very impressive performance as well. Darth Marr's combat prowess became stuff of legends, he single-handedly routed entire armies of the Republic in various battles.

Darth Vader's performance against Count Dooku is covered though, as Anakin. And Anakin was at his top form during this time. After Darth Vader's injuries and loss, Darth Sidious wanted to inspire Darth Vader, he regarded Darth Malgus as an excellent example.

Again you fail to see.

This is all about War, it means Nothing in the context of duels and battles, Sidious' admiration of Malgus was as a war leader and an expert controller of his rage, nothing more.

The entire post before you mentioned their force abilities was a misrepresentation of my argument. Whether you deny it or not there is no way for you to hide the fact that you spent half of a post challenging me on a point I never made (their speed), and acted as if I was losing for not supporting this point, even though I never held that viewpoint to begin with, and in fact said the exact opposite. Then you claimed that I conceded everything except endurance, which is blatantly untrue, considering that I also never conceded strength, tactical ingenuity, or mastery of the force. You misrepresented my points to make me look bad, and then you tried to cover it up. You lied and you are still lying by trying to deny this.

Go play a martyr somewhere else.

As far as force abilities go, a hat-tip to legend for posting force feats for Malgus. Malgus has oneshotted several people with the force, including three padawans simultaneously and Aryn Leneer. With telekinesis, he penetrated the force defenses of Satele Shan and slammed her into a tree, he prevented several tons of rubble from falling on him while severely wounded then blasted it away, he crushed a Jedi's throat with the force in the sacking of Coruscant, he penetrated Ven Zallow's force defenses, and he telekinetically throttled Lord Adraas. Malgus also brought the strike team sent after him to their knees with force lightning. A team that included either the Hero of Tython and Barsen'thor, or the Emperor's Wrath and Darth Nox.

I guess that's all cool and all except Maul has ragdolled Kenobi who is more impressive than the fodder Malgus killed. He's also brought down tons of rubble when he sent Kenobi flying and collapsed a cave simultaneously. Also Maul has telekinetically stopped hearts and snapped necks as well. None of what you posted is all that different from what he has done. I fail to see any discrepancy in terms of whatever "massive" force advantage he has.

I didn't mention Savage because the point of this debate was me challenging your opinion that Maul is better than Malgus in every way, which is simply not true.

Nope. As this thread is Malgus vs. the Maul Brothers, every post you've made fails to take into account the existence of his brother in this match. He'd be hard pressed by Maul alone, with Savage he is finished

Originally posted by Selenial
Again you fail to see.

This is all about War, it means Nothing in the context of duels and battles, Sidious' admiration of Malgus was as a war leader and an expert controller of his rage, nothing more.

He fought on the frontlines.

What do you think "single-handedly shattering fortifications" suggests?

Malgus's combat actions represent his battlefield feats. Sidious wasn't referring to Malgus's leadership abilities, he was referring to Malgus's skills and psychology as a warrior.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Malgus was not a politician, Selenial.

He fought on the frontlines.

What do you think "single-handedly shattering fortifications" suggests?

Malgus's combat actions represent his battlefield feats. Sidious wasn't referring to Malgus's leadership abilities, he was referring to Malgus's skills and psychology as a warrior.

Exactly.

It has nothing to so with duels against force users, prowess in lightsaber forms or anything like that, that could be applied here.

Originally posted by Selenial
Exactly.

It has nothing to so with duels against force users, prowess in lightsaber forms or anything like that, that could be applied here.

I agree with Legend. Duels with Force users happen on the battlefield and obviously lightsaber prowess is a big factor on it as well. Suggesting that war has nothing to do with battles and duels is ridiculous.

Bane never fought on a battlefield.

I said duels occur on a battlefield, but Bane never had a duel on a battlefield, so theres no comparison there.

Originally posted by Vitiate Rocks
You said that duels were ''a big factor''. It's a pretty good comparison according to yourself.

On the other hand, per the dictionary, a ''battlefield'' is simply ''an area where battle is fought''. Bane has fought multiple battles and would qualify.

It's only a comparison between people who have performed feats on the battlefield. What I said was that duels between Jedi and Sith are a big factor in battles fought during a war and happen frequently. Since Selenial was trying to suggest that duels have nothing to do with war and battles, which is clearly false. This doesn't mean that Malgus performing great feats on the field surpasses people who have fought off a battlefield.

I wouldn't qualify any of Bane's fights as battles since that's usually defined as a conflict between two large forces. Also, Bane has only fought in a few real fights whilst Malgus fought in a 30 year war. It's only natural he has performed superior battlefield feats to Bane, who has never fought in any war as a Sith.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I said duels occur on a battlefield, but Bane never had a duel on a battlefield, so theres no comparison there.

Really? Because I don't see anything in those quotes that pertains directly to duels with powerful Jedi.

Malgus' battlefield feats have no repercussions or affects on a duel with someone of Mauls Caliber.

Originally posted by Selenial
Really? Because I don't see anything in those quotes that pertains directly to duels with powerful Jedi.

Malgus' battlefield feats have no repercussions or affects on a duel with someone of Mauls Caliber.

What happens during combat? Force powers and lightsaber are used, opponents are struck down or destroyed.

Darth Malgus did fight many Jedi during battles. The events depicted in all 3 official trailers are representative of battles taking place between the Jedi/Republic and reconstituted ancient Sith Empire.

Darth Malgus' Force Maelstrom is a combination of Force resistance, Force Lightning, and Telekinesis. Users also include the Shadow Guard.
Darth Malgus is highly capable in all three of these aspects. Being able to wield them simultaneously is a testament to his power in combat.
To gauge how effective it would be against Darth Maul, it would be appropriate to look at his Force resistance feats to lightning and telekinesis.

Originally posted by Vitiate Rocks
When Malgus utilizes Maelstrom against a character even approaching Maul's level, let me know.

Originally posted by Vitiate Rocks
Maul's Force aura is strong enough to blunt Malgus' telekinesis, and he could just block his lightning or dodge it.