Too powerful character team cut

Originally posted by Surtur
It really depends on which JLA lineup you are talking about. Since, the one with Wally West? Yeah, Wally stands way way way out. Wally West at his most powerful could of solo'd the entire league by himself. Think about it: he can move at many many times the speed of light(to the point Superman is a statue compared to him). He can hit with enough force to KO white martians and he can also steal speed to the point it takes you a century just to blink.

There isn't anyone in the JLA who could resist a speed steal or millions of punches of the same caliber as the one he knocked a martian into orbit with.

With all that said that is why I can't help but always laugh whenever I'd see someone complaining about Superman being too powerful, and yet they seemingly have no problem with some of his teammates, some of which are just as broken or even more broken then he is. I've seen people dislike the character because they think he is too powerful, which means these same people should utterly hate Wally West. They should also despise Martian Manhunter and Green Lantern too.

My problem with Manhattan is that when you think about it he was mostly all talk. Sure, he said he had done things like walk on suns, etc. but he never actually does anything like that. I always see people applying a level of power to him that he just plain never actually showed on panel.

And no Flash has ever made Superman a statue. I can post a dozen races with Wally alone that shows Superman being able to keep up with Flashes.

....this is why I said Superman, lol.

Fast as the Flash. Stronger than a GL's constructs. Stronger than MM/WW. Greater magical immunity than WW. All in one package.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You are confusing forum flash with comic flash.

Nope, comic Wally is the dude who evacuates a city of half a million people in less then a second while only carrying 1-2 people at a time.

And no Flash has ever made Superman a statue.

Um, what? No, he certainly has. There was an instance in comics with Flash disarming a kryptonite bomb, he does so at such speeds Supes can't even react, and Superman even notes this and says it must of been Flash who did it.

I can post a dozen races with Wally alone that shows Superman being able to keep up with Flashes.

Here is the thing: Superman has raced Jay Garrick before. He did not blow the guy away, you realize this, yes? Jay Garrick has NOTHING on Wally at his peak.

If Superman beat Wally West in a race..it was probably during a time where he wasn't at his most insane levels of speed. Also citing races isn't a good feat, I believe it was Barry who said "those races were for charity Clark" when commenting on how people thought Supes could keep up with him.

Though I would be mighty curious to see you post a feat of Superman beating Wally West in a race, and doing so during the time period where he was at his most broken. I know in one issue Superman comes to Wally for help in training his speed and better controlling it..and he has to push himself just to go lightspeed. So when did these races where he beats Wally happen?

Originally posted by Surtur
Nope, comic Wally is the dude who evacuates a city of half a million people in less then a second while only carrying 1-2 people at a time.

Originally posted by abhilegend
[B]To show how much faster Superman is than a microsecond level being.

A microsecond is like hours to him. He attacks at FTL speed and even though its energy Superman, he was stated to be slower than real Superman. In fact they had to take tests if he even was as fast as his older self.

That's damn faster than nanosecond level reaction feat.

There superman went FTL in a timeframe which made microseconds look like hours. And that was energy superman, slower than normal superman.

Um, what? No, he certainly has. There was an instance in comics with Flash disarming a kryptonite bomb, he does so at such speeds Supes can't even react, and Superman even notes this and says it must of been Flash who did it.

Here is the thing: Superman has raced Jay Garrick before. He did not blow the guy away, you realize this, yes? Jay Garrick has NOTHING on Wally at his peak.

If Superman beat Wally West in a race..it was probably during a time where he wasn't at his most insane levels of speed.

Also citing races isn't a good feat, I believe it was Barry who said "those races were for charity Clark" when commenting on how people thought Supes could keep up with him.

http://s1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Superman/?action=view¤t=barysupesholdingback.jpg

So it all balances out I think. And just before Flashpoint Superman raced Barry and caught him while he was out of control anyway.

Though I would be mighty curious to see you post a feat of Superman beating Wally West in a race, and doing so during the time period where he was at his most broken.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Flashes had to go faster than EVER to reach the singularity of Darkseid.

Superman entered the same singularity via sheer speed.

http://i.imgur.com/bTTGYKl.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/0ftYh3c.jpg

Superman is certainly at the same speed level as Wally and Barry.

😄

Flashes had to go faster than ever to reach there. Superman had no problem matching that.

I know in one issue Superman comes to Wally for help in training his speed and better controlling it..and he has to push himself just to go lightspeed. So when did these races where he beats Wally happen? [/B]

http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Speed/flight/JLAClassified16a.jpg
http://i1007.photobucket.com/albums/af191/lgu88/Superman/Speed/flight/JLAClassified16b.jpg

Posting feats for Energy Superman are irrelevant, those do not transfer over to normal Superman. you say the energy form is slower, but based on the feats you posted that doesn't seem to be true. You saying Superman was "pretending not to notice" during the kryptonite bomb thing is completely unfounded, I'm not sure where you got that from.

Superman making Jay look like a statue directly contradicts Superman being unable to beat the guy by a good margin in other instances. Also how come when Flash is shown to be way faster it is Superman just "pretending" but you feel it is okay for you to cite feats where Superman appears on the same level as Wally, despite Wally's high end stuff utterly blowing his away? Post crisis Superman can fly at FTL speeds in space, in an atmosphere he can move around the speed of light. If that wasn't the case he would of never been shown struggling to reach lightspeed even after specifically asking Wally for training at how to better use his speed.

Then we have things like..do you feel Black Adam and Captain Marvel are not more or less peers of Superman when it comes to strength, speed, etc.? Black Adam also had encounters with Jay Garrick where they were more or less even. You can't tell me that, at their high end, Jay is as fast as Wally. Heck to my knowledge post crisis Superman couldn't even time travel on sheer speed, pretty sure Wally could eventually do so even without his cosmic treadmill.

Originally posted by Surtur
Posting feats for Energy Superman are irrelevant, those do not transfer over to normal Superman.

Originally posted by abhilegend
[B]Matches speed of mercury turned up to a million........

Superman>>>Cap in speed.

mmm

Black Adam also had encounters with Jay Garrick where they were more or less even.

You can't tell me that, at their high end, Jay is as fast as Wally.

Heck to my knowledge post crisis Superman couldn't even time travel on sheer speed, pretty sure Wally could eventually do so even without his cosmic treadmill. [/B]

Originally posted by abhilegend
Energy Superman was slower than normal Superman. It was made clear in the same comic. Oh really? Superman has feat that shit on that too. Because everyone else was confused to how it happened, Superman knew how it vanished.

Not really. Superman became faster after Infinite Crisis and he had only one race with Jay.

And in the very same comic where he was "unable" to beat Jay had him matching both Jay and Wally untill they combined their speed to enter speed force and went back in time.

Do you think that would've happened if Superman was a statue compared to Wally?

Like which feat? You're just citing random feats like that means something. He was going lightspeed inside a black hole. If you think him doing that is struggling, I'd ask you read about Flash who had troubles with going lightspeed in a blackhole too.

No they are not. Superman has casually matched speed of mercury amped up a million times.

Jay was speedblitzing the phuck out of Adam. He is not. He's not much slower either. Otherwise he wouldn't be able to almost enter speed force on his own.

That's just the restrictions about speedsters who don't have access to speed force. Nobody is saying Superman is as fast as wally or barry, but to pretend that he is so much slower when decades of continuity contradict that based on some random high end showings is stupid.

Did Sensor Girl fool the entire Justice League with her illusions?

Yes.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes.

Would you put Sensor Girl on the same level as Fantomex?

Yes.

Heh. abhi blew a load of Superman all over my thread.

Originally posted by Digi
Yeah, JLA is fine because they're so stocked. No single character stands out as too OP.

I'd actually argue for The Doctor over her. Especially early on when it was Jenny Sparks. They tried every trick in the book to PIS him out of stories so that it wouldn't end in a few panels. Hell, in one story it literally did end in a few panels once he decided "Ok, enough of this sh*t" and actually showed up to the party.

In fairness, that was kinda the point with him.

I have to agree on The Doctor and Manhattan. Good calls.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
True. Was a tossup in my head over which to put down....but the heroin junkie Jeroen was too endearing, what with his love of horse porn, to cut.

what can i say... now you get to meet a G!!

When it comes to ridiculous powered members of a team the first team that comes to mind for me is ALWAYS the JSA

Original Line up

Spectre
Classic Dr Fate
.
.
Alan Scot/GL
.
.
Jay Garrick
.
.
.
.
Hourman
Hawkman
.
.
.
.
.
Sandman
Atom

I mean seriously, I small guy who works out on a team with two reality warpers, a guy with a magic ring that can make anything and a guy who's faster then light. AND once you got down to Hourman you were talking about a guy not much above Captain America ( GA tales HM was at best 2 to 3 tons and could run 40mph)

When flash left Johnny Thunder (another reality warper) took his place. Starman replaces Alan/GL, and they replaced Hourman with Dr Midnight (just to make the difference even bigger)

Yeah, thats good stuff right there.
Team books really epitomize suspension of disbelief....